Tradecraft Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Quote Only death can pay for life - Mirror Maz Duur Quote Fire and blood - House Targaryen words (and the recipe for dragon hatching) No wonder why Rhaegar was so gloomy! But seriously, how come nobody makes the link between blood magic and Rhaegar? How precisely do you think he was going to hatch dragons? Ask them nicely to hatch? Dany knew the secret. She sacrificed Mirri Maz Duur like it was nothing. The question is who was he planning to sacrifice? Himself? Plus others? Were those others willing to go down with the ship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 We've been told Rhaegar was obsessed with "prophecy(ies)*, not with hatching dragons like so many of his ancestors. If his obsession was like so many other Targs and we never hear a thing about it, it would be bad writing and an asspull, both unlikely to be employed by Martin. Tradecraft 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Not surprising if he did, given supposedly Aegon V also tried to do that at Summerhall. There was a rather dark theory that baby Rhaegar himself was supposed to be the sacrifice and it would have actually brought back the dragons if he did. So I would assume that Rhaegar was either planning to sacrifice himself and/or his newborn baby... Tradecraft 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craving Peaches Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 2 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: We've been told Rhaegar was obsessed with "prophecy(ies)*, not with hatching dragons like so many of his ancestors. To be fair, if the prophecy was about some supernatural threat, Rhaegar may have thought he needed dragons, and Aegon V was supposedly trying to do something with dragons at Summerhall. But I agree the 'hints' if they are even that are quite slight, and given we only have two books left with so many other things that need to be explained/revealed, I'm not sure if we will get an answer about this. This is why I think, for example, it isn't suddenly going to be revealed in the penultimate book that everything we knew about the Tower of Joy was wrong. Tradecraft and Aldarion 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Tradecraft said: How precisely do you think he was going to hatch dragons? Ask them nicely to hatch? His son was supposed to figure it out. Aemon was telling Sam how he and Rhaegar figured out that his son was supposed to figure it out. Quote "It was a prince that was promised, not a princess. Rhaegar, I thought . . . the smoke was from the fire that devoured Summerhall on the day of his birth, the salt from the tears shed for those who died. He shared my belief when he was young, but later he became persuaded that it was his own son who fulfilled the prophecy, for a comet had been seen above King's Landing on the night Aegon was conceived, and Rhaegar was certain the bleeding star had to be a comet. What fools we were, who thought ourselves so wise! The error crept in from the translation. Dragons are neither male nor female, Barth saw the truth of that, but now one and now the other, as changeable as flame. The language misled us all for a thousand years. Daenerys is the one, born amidst salt and smoke. The dragons prove it." Just talking of her seemed to make him stronger. "I must go to her. I must. Would that I was even ten years younger." astarkchoice, Tradecraft and Khal Rhaego Targaryen 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astarkchoice Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 6 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said: His son was supposed to figure it out. Aemon was telling Sam how he and Rhaegar figured out that his son was supposed to figure it out. This Its prophecy being a.sword with no hilt again..raeghar saw his marriage to lyanna would be linked to the song of ice and fire to save the world....BUT he probably imagined his visions meant a world where he broke the rebellion then replaced areys for his son.to fight the forces of darkness with a united westeros at his command!!! On reflection he may have also saw a battle with a powerful warrior in his future hence why he suddenly announced he must be a great warrior after years of 0 interest in swordplay...again prophecy being a treacherous misstress he was right just he assumed the outcome would be +ve for him!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 3 hours ago, kissdbyfire said: We've been told Rhaegar was obsessed with "prophecy(ies)*, not with hatching dragons like so many of his ancestors. If his obsession was like so many other Targs and we never hear a thing about it, it would be bad writing and an asspull, both unlikely to be employed by Martin. The dragon lord prophecies are about dragons! What else could they be about? Swans?! Geese?! Chocolate bars?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 3 hours ago, Craving Peaches said: Not surprising if he did, given supposedly Aegon V also tried to do that at Summerhall. There was a rather dark theory that baby Rhaegar himself was supposed to be the sacrifice and it would have actually brought back the dragons if he did. So I would assume that Rhaegar was either planning to sacrifice himself and/or his newborn baby... Terrifying! That he might sacrifice his own children! Which I suspected but I have never seen anywhere. Everyone romanticises the man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 2 hours ago, Craving Peaches said: To be fair, if the prophecy was about some supernatural threat, Rhaegar may have thought he needed dragons, and Aegon V was supposedly trying to do something with dragons at Summerhall. But I agree the 'hints' if they are even that are quite slight, and given we only have two books left with so many other things that need to be explained/revealed, I'm not sure if we will get an answer about this. This is why I think, for example, it isn't suddenly going to be revealed in the penultimate book that everything we knew about the Tower of Joy was wrong. You don't need the future books if you believe in parallels! If you believe in parallels (current POV's tell the story of Roberts Rebellion), you don't need more books! It's a magic trick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 1 hour ago, Hugorfonics said: His son was supposed to figure it out. Aemon was telling Sam how he and Rhaegar figured out that his son was supposed to figure it out. Rhaegar thought he need three children... Why three? What if he thought he needed to sacrifice three? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 1 hour ago, astarkchoice said: This Its prophecy being a.sword with no hilt again..raeghar saw his marriage to lyanna would be linked to the song of ice and fire to save the world....BUT he probably imagined his visions meant a world where he broke the rebellion then replaced areys for his son.to fight the forces of darkness with a united westeros at his command!!! On reflection he may have also saw a battle with a powerful warrior in his future hence why he suddenly announced he must be a great warrior after years of 0 interest in swordplay...again prophecy being a treacherous misstress he was right just he assumed the outcome would be +ve for him!!! All this blood magic going on in these books and you think RHAEGAR's hands are squeaky clean? Whats the point of any of it if Rhaegar isn't using blood magic?! Khal Rhaego Targaryen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 Melisandre"s rubies prove Rhaegar used blood magic as the witch used blood magic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Tradecraft said: The dragon lord prophecies are about dragons! What else could they be about? Swans?! Geese?! Chocolate bars?! What are "the dragon lord prophecies", something you just came up with? @Craving Peaches my point was that if Rhaegar becoming "obsessed w/ prophecy" turns into this, ie, deciding he had to sacrifice someone(s) to hatch dragons' eggs b/c he needed dragons to fight the others, and the "clue" we get is "at one point he became obsessed with prophecy"... then IMO it it will have been very poorly done, unlike Martin and a huge asspull worthy of D&D. Edited July 16, 2023 by kissdbyfire Craving Peaches and LongRider 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaffronLady Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: What are "the dragon lord prophecies", something you just came up with? To put it nicely, Tradecraft here has a thing for ... original terminology. Despite the thing he is talking about already has canon terms to describe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, SaffronLady said: To put it nicely, Tradecraft here has a thing for ... original terminology. Despite the thing he is talking about already has canon terms to describe. Yeah, I thought that was what they were trying to get at, but such things are referred to using certain terms/words/phrases for a reason. But more importantly, I was waiting - but definitely not holding my breath - for them to reply w/ a quote showing Rhaegar had dragon dreams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 44 minutes ago, Tradecraft said: Melisandre"s rubies prove Rhaegar used blood magic as the witch used blood magic! Does it? How so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 21 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: What are "the dragon lord prophecies", something you just came up with? @Craving Peaches my point was that if Rhaegar becoming "obsessed w/ prophecy" turns into this, ie, deciding he had to sacrifice someone(s) to hatch dragons' eggs b/c he needed dragons to fight the others, and the "clue" we get is "at one point he became obsessed with prophecy"... then IMO it it will have been very poorly done, unlike Martin and a huge asspull worthy of D&D. The Targaryens are dragon lords. After they lost the dragons, some of them became obsessed with prophecy. Aegon V in particular was obsessed with bringing the dragons back to change the balance of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kissdbyfire Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 Just now, Tradecraft said: The Targaryens are dragon lords. After they lost the dragons, some of them became obsessed with prophecy. Aegon V in particular was obsessed with bringing the dragons back to change the balance of power. And? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongRider Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 3 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said: And? Mel’s magic rubies told Rhaegar’s rubies all about the blood magic in a dragon dream that they were his to use for blood magic but it turned out Robert’s hammer had more blood magic than Rhaegar’s rubies which was why Rhaegar died in a river with his chest stove in and his blood magic and fancy rubies bleeding out into the water. So Dany had to raise the dragons and she didn’t have any magic rubies so she burned up Mirri for blood magic instead because hey why not? What did I win? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradecraft Posted July 16, 2023 Author Share Posted July 16, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, LongRider said: Mel’s magic rubies told Rhaegar’s rubies all about the blood magic in a dragon dream that they were his to use for blood magic but it turned out Robert’s hammer had more blood magic than Rhaegar’s rubies which was why Rhaegar died in a river with his chest stove in and his blood magic and fancy rubies bleeding out into the water. So Dany had to raise the dragons and she didn’t have any magic rubies so she burned up Mirri for blood magic instead because hey why not? What did I win? 2 hours ago, kissdbyfire said: And? Melisandre is a sorceress who wears rubies and performs blood magic. Why do you think Rhaegar wears rubies? Edited July 16, 2023 by Tradecraft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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