Best Fighters of Westeros

[SerArthurHeath]

I'm pretty sure that in this period of history, a well trained professional soldier is almost exactly the definition of a knight?

[Mike]

Because he consistently gave Jon a whipping when they sparred. He is the best swordsman at the Wall, after Halfhand's death. He just appears to be a very skillful young swordsman. And from the looks of it the Night's Watch does weapon training almost every day - in fact, they appear to be the closest thing to professional soldiers in the entire Realm. Contrast that to knights who prance around in their cloaks and armour all day long and seem to do actual weapons practice maybe once a week.

He's never described as the best sword on the Wall, but I would probably agree with you about that. As well as your assumption that he is a skillful young swordsman. Of course, there are plenty of skillful young swordsmen in Westeros who wouldn't be considered among the very elite.

The Halfhand was a complete badass, and from what we know and have seen of him, it wouldn't be a stretch to believe that he belonged to that upper echelon. But he was much better than Jon, per Jon's own admission, and Jon is nearly a match for Emmett (and when he is pissed about not being the Lord of Winterfell, he's better).

From what we've seen, I wouldn't think that Emmett is at Balon Swann's level, much less Loras or Garlan or The Hound. No shame in that. Swann whipped ass on the Blackwater.

[Talleyrand]

From what we've seen, I wouldn't think that Emmett is at Balon Swann's level, much less Loras or Garlan or The Hound. No shame in that. Swann whipped ass on the Blackwater.

Everyone keeps criticizing the new Kingsguard but they forget about Balon Swann. He's described as being excellent with a morningstar and one of the best with a bow, hell he was in the final for the archery.

[Ranzadule]

It's like I tell one of my skinny friends: "They have weight-classes for a reason."

Relying on your armour to absorb those blows that get past your parry can show a lot of skill. Winning a fight is all about threat range and risk v reward. I have studied and then taught Karate and Kung Fu since the 1980's. I have sparred with students, other instructors and strangers in tournies. Sparring is a lot like playing a game of tag. Any contact can score points. In sparring, quickness and technique are the keys. I was also a bouncer for a few years and was in several 2v2, 1v2, 1v1 type fights. In fights, you will get hit. It is not a question of "If you will get hit" but more about where and what power and so on. I have taken body blows to get in head shots, taken glancing head shots to get in more solid ones and run through kicks to drop an elbow on someone. I am no Gregor or Robery, but I learned over the years that I am big enough to take some punishment and I adapted that to my style. 6'1" and over the years, anywhere between 220 and 285 lbs. I have some armour. It is all about getting into range/position with my feet under me and blasting someone. I have and will take blows on the way in and I know how to make them less effective as I close.

Victarion has great armour and incorporates that in his style. He doesn't merely sit and accept blows until his opponents drops dead of exhaustion. He uses his toughness and armour offensively. That is a skill and is/was very effective. That is the reason we had in our world, a period of time where knights in armour was the most badass mofos on the planet. The best fencer is not that same thing as the best fighter.

[SerFelixCulpa]

It's like I tell one of my skinny friends: "They have weight-classes for a reason."

Relying on your armour to absorb those blows that get past your parry can show a lot of skill. Winning a fight is all about threat range and risk v reward. I have studied and then taught Karate and Kung Fu since the 1980's. I have sparred with students, other instructors and strangers in tournies. Sparring is a lot like playing a game of tag. Any contact can score points. In sparring, quickness and technique are the keys. I was also a bouncer for a few years and was in several 2v2, 1v2, 1v1 type fights. In fights, you will get hit. It is not a question of "If you will get hit" but more about where and what power and so on. I have taken body blows to get in head shots, taken glancing head shots to get in more solid ones and run through kicks to drop an elbow on someone. I am no Gregor or Robery, but I learned over the years that I am big enough to take some punishment and I adapted that to my style. 6'1" and over the years, anywhere between 220 and 285 lbs. I have some armour. It is all about getting into range/position with my feet under me and blasting someone. I have and will take blows on the way in and I know how to make them less effective as I close.

Victarion has great armour and incorporates that in his style. He doesn't merely sit and accept blows until his opponents drops dead of exhaustion. He uses his toughness and armour offensively. That is a skill and is/was very effective. That is the reason we had in our world, a period of time where knights in armour was the most badass mofos on the planet. The best fencer is not that same thing as the best fighter.

This is a good point, though the reverse should be borne in mind: coming to rely on your armor to get you past things can become a handicap as well, particularly where more observant fighters have been able to evaluate your style in armor. Or at any rate, this is the way GRRM sees it re; the duel between Bronn and Ser Vardis Egan. Heavy armor, in particular, is only an advantage insofar as your style does not rely on speed and is adjusted to counter it as well.

[SerFelixCulpa]

I'm pretty sure that in this period of history, a well trained professional soldier is almost exactly the definition of a knight?

No, the medieval concept of the knight is bound by several discrete concepts: the notion that the warrior is mounted; that he is armed and fights in a certain mode and style; and bound by a code of behavior (chivalry) as well. It was also almost universally a de facto requirement that the knight come from acceptable stock, or at least, be bankrolled sufficiently to allow him to meet the foregoing requirements. (Which in effect meant he had to come from acceptable stock.) Money by itself could not necessarily buy knighthood either, you had to be acceptable to the knightly/noble community to gain admittance.

There were plenty of highly competent professional soldiers who did not meet these requirements. And many a knight that was incompetent despite meeting them.

[Lucian Efalas]

1) Arthur Dayne

2) Barristan Selmy

3) Syrio Forel

4) Sandor Clegane

5) Eddard Stark (after the fight with Arthur Dayne, he has to "level up" so to speak, and since fighting and surviving the Sword of the Morning makes him deserving of the rank) - Jaime Lannister (two hands, [i'm gonna have a tirade with this] but I believe he's in par with Ned, imho)

6) Bronn

7) Gregor Clegane

8) Robert Baratheon (in his youth)

9) Gerold Hightower

10) Garlan Tyrell

[The Sword of 11:28 am]

I prefer to think about this not so much as who the most skilled is, but who I would LEAST like to meet on their chosen field of battle (Victarion on sea, Loras in a joust, Strong Belwas in a fighting pit). I also am going as far back as the Battle of the Trident.

1. Barristan the Bold.

I am an attacker trying to kill Dany. We are both in armor and he has a shield and sword. I can't think of anybody in this entire world who would be tougher to kill under these circumstances. I believe I read somewhere on this site that GRRM said Arthur Dayne would best Selmy with Dawn, but I am not Dayne, nor do I have Dawn. There is a reason he is still alive and all the others from the "Golden Age" are not.

2. Arthur Dayne. At the Tower of Joy. Nuff said. I have read in several places where people say that Dayne may not have been as good as Ned said and that Jamie telling Loras that he could kill all 5 with his left hand while pissing with the other is just hero admiration. I do believe that people tend to lionize the dead, but Jamie's recollection of how he beat the Smiling Knight, and that he actually broke the SK's sword and made him get another one so he could crush him a little more tells me that Dayne was every bit the warrior that Barristan, Jamie, and Ned say and not what Darkstar said.

3. Robert Baratheon. I would not want to fight him during his greatest moment. It was said by Cersei that Rhaegar was a match even for Arthur Dayne, or course that was in joust, but i imagine he was not fun to see in the field either. Robert hilled him at the Trident in essentially single combat.

4. Khal Drogo. Anywhere, anytime. I would not want to face him in a fighting pit, in the field, in a tent as I just insulted his wife. One thing that I really wanted to see was how the Khal fought against the knights of Westeros. Oh well. Jorah did say that when he first came over he thought they were savages, but as he spent more time with them he started to realize that they could definitely be quite a handful to deal with. Remember, the Khal died without ever cutting his hair. That is saying something.

5. Jamie Lannister. I would hate to face him as the King with my back turned... Just joking In his prime he, in his own words, was a bigger stronger faster version of Loras. He was knighhted by Dayne, and I would not want to see him in the field with a sword and shield in his hand pre-Whispering Woods. He has a reputation as one of the fiercest and best knights of this era, and reputation is a large part of the psychological battle.

6. Victarion Greyjoy. If I were a merchant vessel and he pulled up next to me and jumped on my ship, I would probably release my bowels and hide in a barrel. That is the reputation the Ironborn have, and we have seen more of Victarion fight than anybody else, so we dont have to rely on secondhand accounts with him like we do with some others.

7. The Hound. Not as strong or large as his brother, but I also dont think he is as prone to mental lapses and I think he has more actual skill as a swordsman. I wouldnt want to fight him in a small area, like the Inn or in an underground cave.

8. Rhaegar Targ. I would not want to face him on the opposite side of a jousting field. It is implied, and maybe even actually said, that he was the best jouster of his day. I can't remember any flashbacks of him actually losing a joust. I don't think that Jorah beat him, just broke several lances against him. I think he beat Dayne too. I could be wrong about that, and just don't want to rifle throught all 10 kajillion pages of aSoIaF books right now to find out if I am wrong. If I am I know somebody will be more than happy to tell me.

9. Mountain. The reason I don't have him higher is that we now know there is a gameplan to beat him. Now granted, I am no Viper, but if I had to fight the Mountain, I would certainly employ that gameplan. Not the poison, but the spear and quicknes keeping distance between us and waiting until he got exhausted in that huge plate mail and made a mental mistake. Obviously, like I said, easier said than done, but we do now know that there is a gameplan to beat him. And learning is fun, cause knowledge is power

10. Strong Belwas. In a fighting pit.

Honorable Mention:

Garlan Tyrell

Syrio Forel

Oberyn Martell (reminds me so much of Achilles in Troy. I actually went back and watched some of that movie just to get an idea of how I thought he would fight)

Loras Tyrell (lots of people will argue for him to be higher but we havent see him in battle yet, but I hope we do in tWoW when it comes out in 2024)

Qhorin Halfhand

Tormund Giantsbane

Brienne

Bronn

Meera Reed (VERY unorthodox style)

I obviously took several liberal views with this. I included people not in Westeros, and I didnt make a "whos the best", but a "who would I NOT want to fight" list instead. I tried to base it off of people that we had the most information about, not just people we heard about one time or say in only one fight. Unless of course the reputation was as the greatest knight in the land (Dayne).

[StannisandDaeny]

1. Black Lorren from the Iron Isles. He died, but he took many of Bolton's men (7 I think it was) with him. Andrik The Unsmiling is said to be the only one better than him but Andrik is clearly a captain while Lorren is just a raider so that might influence people's opinions.

2. Barristan Selmy. "Even now I could still cut through all of you like cake!"

3. The Hound.

4. Victarion. His magical arm now gives him an edge.

5. Jorah Mormont. The tank. He can take an extreme amount of punishment.

6. Thoros of Myr: won the melee and was first into the breach during Balon's rebellion and survived.

[Negator]

_{I always felt that the Hound was the par excellance, so to speak, because he is the most multi-disciplined. He is like Albert Pujols, who is the perfect combination of balance and power. If Pujols swung any harder, he would be like Arod, prone to wild swings. If he aimed for balance, he would make weaker contact. Sandor is similar in that he is the very biggest "swordsman" you can find; any bigger, and you end up with more of a berzerker with little balance or speed.}

[Brutusk of the Blackwater]

I think that not enough respect has been given to Mance Rayder in this thread. In terms of one-on-one combat, he seems to fair quite well. I am not saying he is in the "top 10," but it seems he should at least be in the discussion. In a society that values strength over all, Mance was able to rise to a position of dominance in a relatively short period of time. At the least, he should be the wildling representative in the place of someone like Tormund.

In terms of the best living fighter, it seemed to me that GRRM gave the impression that it was the Hound. Of course, his status as "living" is questionable.

[The Sword of 11:28 am]

That is a very good point about Mance and one I didn't think about until last night. I had actually forgot about him, but then I remembered when...

In aDwD he handed Jon his ass in the sparring session. Granted, Jon didn't have Longclaw, but he remarked how incredibly strong and fast "Rattleshirt" was with the greatsword and that he didn't even manage to make him break a sweat.

So he does probably belong in my honorable mention with Giantsbane, or perhaps even ahead of him considering his background as a man of the NW

[RhymesWith_FREAK]

I think in the forthcoming books we will see Randyll Tarly in action and do some serious damage with Heartsbane

Daemon Blackfyre seems to be underrepresented in this thread as well

[Talleyrand]

Mag Mar Tun Doh Weg. Come on who else can be involved in a 1v15 situation and have it so no-one walks away from it.

[Rob the God]

i'll only include fighters from Aerys rulling on

Top Tier:

(random order)

Arthur Dayne

Bariston Selmy

Khal Drogo (can't believe everyone forgets about him)

Jaime

The Hound

Oberyan Martell

Hightower

Elite Tier:

Galand Tyrell

Bronn (He's good, but i don't think he is on one level with the guys mentioned above, maybe oberyan though)

Loras Tyrell

The Mountain

Greatjon Umber

Strong Belwas

Brienne

Victorian

Still Great Tier:

Jon Snow

Arys Oakhart

Ned Stark

Ser Jorah

the list might be missing some good fighters, can't remember every name at the moment

[1000 Needles]

5) Eddard Stark (after the fight with Arthur Dayne, he has to "level up" so to speak, and since fighting and surviving the Sword of the Morning makes him deserving of the rank) -

Lol. This conjures up an image of Ned and Howland posing victoriously while the camera pans around them in a circle and the final fantasy victory theme plays.

[Black Crow]

Bronn (He's good, but i don't think he is on one level with the guys mentioned above, maybe oberyan though)

Depends whether he's expected to fight fair

[Onarjyo Khsatriya]

i'll only include fighters from Aerys rulling on

Khal Drogo (can't believe everyone forgets about him)

Khal Drogo is not from westeros

[Son of Jon Snarkgaryen]

Arthur Dayne

In no particular order, after Dayne:

Robert Baratheon (on the Trident, of course)

Ned Stark (he must have been, to contend with the Sword of the Morning)

Jaime Lannister

Mance Rayder & Jon Snow...... just have a feeling, call it foreshadowing, if you want....

Barristan Selmy

Oberyn Martell

Jaime Lannister

Rhaegar Targaryen

Bronn of the Blackwater (of House Stokeworth) (maybe)

Brienne Tarth (maybe)

Victarion Greyjoy (maybe)

Garlan Tyrell (Loras is supposedly fantastic, and he admits Garlan is even better than him with a sword)

Sandor Clegane (maybe)

[Stormcloak]

With every fighter in their prime I'd say:

The Elite:

• Daemon Blackfyre
  
• Ser Arthur Dayne
  
• Ser Barristan Selmy
  
• Aemon the Dragonknight
  
• Ser Serwyn of the Mirrorshield
  
• Prince Oberyn Martell
  
• Khal Drogo
  
• Mance Rayder
  
• Robert Baratheon
  
• Jaime Lannister
  
• Sandor Clegane
  

Second tier:

• Brynden ‘the Blackfish’ Tully
  
• Qhorin Halfhand
  
• Gregor Clegane
  
• Bronn
  
• Syrio Forel
  
• Garlan Tyrell
  
• Victarion Greyjoy
  
• Great Jon Umber
  
• Rhaegar Targaryen
  
• The Smiling Knight
  
• Brandon Stark
  
• Andrik the Unsmiling
  

Worth thinking about:

• Eddard Stark
  
• Rickard Stark
  
• Howland Reed
  
• Loras Tyrell
  
• Thoros of Myr
  
• Brienne of Tarth
  
• Darkstar
  
• Areo Hotah
  
• Lord Gerold Hightower
  
• Tormund Giantsbane
  
• Rattleshirt
  
• The Weeper
  
• Iron Emmet
  
• Benjen Stark
  
• Jason Mallister
  
• Jorah Mormont
  
• Bronze Yohn Royce
  
• Lynn Corbray
  
• Shagga Son of Dolf
  
• Timett Son of Timett
  
• Jaqen H’Qarr
  
• Strong Belwas
  
• Dagmer Cleftjaw
  
• Euron Crow’s Eye
  
• Bloodraven
  
• Bittersteel
  
• Maelys ‘the Monstrous’
  
• Balon Swann
  
• Randyll Tarly
  
• Jon Connington
  
• Daario Naharis
  
• Ser Hosteen Frey
  
• Ulmer
  
• Balon Greyjoy
  

Yet to reach their prime (or won't get to reach it):

• Jon Snow
  
• Robb Stark
  
• Arya Stark
  
• Theon Greyjoy
  
• Asha Greyjoy
  
• Waymar Royce