A Brand New MMA Thread

[Oorag]

[b]Bisping [/b]vs Leben - I think this is going to be a close fight, but Bisping is on the rise and has a more polished stand-up game. Leben could still get a knockout with his heavy hands, though.
[b]Jardine [/b]vs Vera - I think Jardine is going to win, but Vera is going to look much better than he has in his previous fights. This should be a good one.
[b]Sokoudjou [/b]vs Cane - Cane is a striker, but won't present the problems that Machida did.
Kelly vs [b]Davis [/b]- Davis has a good camp and will continue to KO British journeymen.
Taylor vs [b]Lytle[/b] - Lytle is a good gatekeeper, and I don't think Taylor's up to his snuff.
Hardy vs [b]Gono[/b] - DJ GOZMA will send Hardy back to the feeders.
[b]Carwin [/b]vs Wain - Why isn't this on the main card? Carwin is one of about two HW prospects in the UFC.
Liaudin vs Bielkheden - No pick.
[b]Stout [/b]vs Etim - Stout has looked good in some of his past fights.
Baron vs Miller - No pick.
Eklund vs Schiavo - No pick.

[Cuellar]

Dana is such a media whore. Basically the only reason they let Junie stick around was to pad ratings... he obviously should have been kicked out, and nogera was completely right in saying that the guys are here to fight, stop fucking around with the pranks. If Dana gave a flying fuck about anything besides ratings, he'd have stopped that bullshit.

Seriously, I'm getting very tired of the in-house antics, and think they probably need 2 houses, 1 per team.

[Ken Stone]

Just got done watching this weeks edition of MMA Live with Gina Carono. I think she implied that her, Randy Couture, and Kim Couture have three-somes. She didn't say it in so many words but the under current was definitely there.

[Ken Stone]

So any thoughts about UFC 89? I thought it was a pretty shitty card all the way around. The best fight was Sokudjo vs Cain. I don't know that I've ever seen such a sweet game plan. The kicks that Sok. was delivering in the first frame were sick, and I thought for sure it was a matter of time before Cain was KTFO. Cain had the plan to stick with it, absorb the kicks, and put him out when he got tired. It worked perfectly. Amazing fight all the way around.

Does anyone think Bisping deserves the next crack at the Spider? I don't know that he stands much of a shot but he has at least as good of a chance of eeking out a win as Cote does.

[Horus Ex Machina]

[quote name='Cuellar' post='1558619' date='Oct 16 2008, 16.36']Dana is such a media whore. Basically the only reason they let Junie stick around was to pad ratings... he obviously should have been kicked out, and nogera was completely right in saying that the guys are here to fight, stop fucking around with the pranks. If Dana gave a flying fuck about anything besides ratings, he'd have stopped that bullshit.

Seriously, I'm getting very tired of the in-house antics, and think they probably need 2 houses, 1 per team.[/quote]
Because of things like this is the reason that I stopped watching TUF awhile ago. DW is such a hypocrite. He likes to talk about how other organization give the sport a bad name for ratings yet he basically encourages this type of behavior on TUF by trapping a bunch of fighters in a house with no entertainment except liquer. Big surprise that shit happens.

[quote name='Ken Stone' post='1560910' date='Oct 19 2008, 14.01']So any thoughts about UFC 89? I thought it was a pretty shitty card all the way around. The best fight was Sokudjo vs Cain. I don't know that I've ever seen such a sweet game plan. The kicks that Sok. was delivering in the first frame were sick, and I thought for sure it was a matter of time before Cain was KTFO. Cain had the plan to stick with it, absorb the kicks, and put him out when he got tired. It worked perfectly. Amazing fight all the way around.

Does anyone think Bisping deserves the next crack at the Spider? I don't know that he stands much of a shot but he has at least as good of a chance of eeking out a win as Cote does.[/quote]
Sok totally lost control of that fight. Maybe he just gassed but he's looked very inexperienced and raw since coming to the UFC.

Okami deserves the shot first. Plus I think that me and Anderson want that matchup more. Then Bisping.

[Ser Barry]

Looks like Bisping will fight the other coach on TUF9 and the winner will get a title shot. I believe it will be the winner of Franklin/Henderson. Both of which I think would beat Bisping.

Vera looks like he could make MW.

Cane might be the new Liddell.

Taylor showed some improvement, as did Etim but they are still lucky to be in the UFC.

Gono's entrance was awesome. Hardy looked decent enough but very stiff, hopefully he'll improve over the next couple of fights.

Shane Carwin is coming to a main card near you soon. Ten fights and none of them have gone more then three minutes.

It seemed weird watching the post fight interviews and seeing the fighters all praise the fans when you really couldn't hear them on the broadcast. That was a real shame because it was banging in there. The crowd were loud and got invovled with all the fights. All the UK fighters got huge pops and it was crazy for Bisping. No idea why they muted the crowd noise so much.

[Ken Stone]

[quote name='Ser Barry' post='1561259' date='Oct 20 2008, 03.40']It seemed weird watching the post fight interviews and seeing the fighters all praise the fans when you really couldn't hear them on the broadcast. That was a real shame because it was banging in there. The crowd were loud and got invovled with all the fights. All the UK fighters got huge pops and it was crazy for Bisping. No idea why they muted the crowd noise so much.[/quote]

I noticed that at the UFC event I went to also. It got so loud that you couldn't hear Buffer, but on TV the crowd noise didn't come across at all.

[Oorag]

Not a lot of great fights on that card, but it was still pretty good for a free event. I really enjoyed Bisping/Leben. It went of exactly like I thought. Bisping had the technique to pepper Leben with punches, but Leben was always one big shot from a finish, and clearly Bisping knew it. Leben is a pretty solid gate-keeper, but Franklin/Henderson will be the real litmus test on whether Bisping will amount to anything. As far as a title shot, I think everyone wants to see Okami-Silva before anything else.

The Vera/Jardine fight was pretty frustrating. Like the commentators said, it seemed like they kept colliding, but nothing definitive ever really landed. I don't understand why the crowd was booing, though. It wasn't a great fight, but it's not like the fighters were stalling or inactive. I heard that the UFC was thinking about using Vera to make inroads to an event in the Philippines. I wonder if his 1-3 record in his last four fights will stymie that.

The UFC has found yet another tough LHW striker. That division is just crawling with opportunities for brawls.

And Shane Carwin is a monster. I still don't understand why he wasn't placed on the main card. A bout between him and Lesnar would be crazy.

On last quibble: if the UFC is going to keep naming its events after the final fight of the night, they're going to have to do away with this "co-main event" BS. We know what the real main event is. It's written on the poster. Don't try to hype the penultimate fight by tacking "co-main event" status on it. It's just silly.

[GSP]

Cote's gonna upset the Spider. Why do I say this? Because it seems in the entire MMA community, the result between Anderson and Patrick is a foregone conclusion. The poll at MMA junkie was all about which way Cote will loose for fuck sakes.

The last time such a conclusion was so sure was when my boy got dummied by Serra. I knew it was going to happen in my gut too. The more everyone was talking about how GSP was surely going to walk through him, the more my gut burnt, and sure enough.

The Spider's a fuckin phenom, my favourite MW champ ever. But even he is due to drop one. Might as well be to a Canuck. I've always liked Cote, and he's definitaly been counted out in this one. I aint gonna. That guy's no joke for anyone. Mark my words.

[Ken Stone]

[quote name='GSP' post='1561879' date='Oct 20 2008, 15.16']Cote's gonna upset the Spider. Why do I say this? Because it seems in the entire MMA community, the result between Anderson and Patrick is a foregone conclusion. The poll at MMA junkie was all about which way Cote will loose for fuck sakes.

The last time such a conclusion was so sure was when my boy got dummied by Serra. I knew it was going to happen in my gut too. The more everyone was talking about how GSP was surely going to walk through him, the more my gut burnt, and sure enough.

The Spider's a fuckin phenom, my favourite MW champ ever. But even he is due to drop one. Might as well be to a Canuck. I've always liked Cote, and he's definitaly been counted out in this one. I aint gonna. That guy's no joke for anyone. Mark my words.[/quote]

I actually would love to see this happen. Maybe losing is what Andersen needs to quash this retirement talk.

[Oorag]

[quote name='Ken Stone' post='1561893' date='Oct 20 2008, 13.41']I actually would love to see this happen. Maybe losing is what Andersen needs to quash this retirement talk.[/quote]
At the very least, it would make his last couple of fights more interesting as he smashes his way back up the top again, rather then tipping over everyone's ladders with his little finger, like he's been doing.

[Horus Ex Machina]

[url="http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/nov-8-elitexc-cancels-pro-elite-folds-14860"]A Sherdog.com report states that Pro Elite/Elite XC has folded.[/url] It states that Elite XC's potential sale to Showtime has cooled due to the Petruzelli vs Slice controversy. If this is the case, Seth may have killed his own career prospects since Elite was almost certain to build up his profile.

Now all other things aside, this news saddens me for one reason. Assuming that Showtime doesn't just wait for the Slice controversy to blow over and then buy the promotion anyway women's MMA, which was only showcased on Elite XC, may be gone forever. Now I train with some women, and the commitment and athleticism that they put into their craft is exceptional and has been a highlight of Elite's shows on CBS. Considering that DW is too high and mighty to support the distaff side of the sport, it is my hope that Affliction will step up to the plate and put some of them on the payroll bc it will be a shame if what has happened to Elite XC kills the ability of Gina Carano, Kaitlin Young, Tara Larosa, Shana Bazler, Cris Cyborg, Julie Kedzie, Kelly Kobald, Amanda Buckner, Roxanne Modaferi and many other women to show their skills. That's my word on the subject. I know that I always beat the drum for women's MMA sometimes to a tedium but as a guy who tends to love and admire female athletes, I usually am consistent on this stance.

BTW I may be fighting soon. I'll keep you guys posted.

[Ken Stone]

[quote name='Horus-Eternal' post='1562341' date='Oct 21 2008, 00.10'][url="http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/nov-8-elitexc-cancels-pro-elite-folds-14860"]A Sherdog.com report states that Pro Elite/Elite XC has folded.[/url] It states that Elite XC's potential sale to Showtime has cooled due to the Petruzelli vs Slice controversy. If this is the case, Seth may have killed his own career prospects since Elite was almost certain to build up his profile.

Now all other things aside, this news saddens me for one reason. Assuming that Showtime doesn't just wait for the Slice controversy to blow over and then buy the promotion anyway women's MMA, which was only showcased on Elite XC, may be gone forever. Now I train with some women, and the commitment and athleticism that they put into their craft is exceptional and has been a highlight of Elite's shows on CBS. Considering that DW is too high and mighty to support the distaff side of the sport, it is my hope that Affliction will step up to the plate and put some of them on the payroll bc it will be a shame if what has happened to Elite XC kills the ability of Gina Carano, Kaitlin Young, Tara Larosa, Shana Bazler, Cris Cyborg, Julie Kedzie, Kelly Kobald, Amanda Buckner, Roxanne Modaferi and many other women to show their skills. That's my word on the subject. I know that I always beat the drum for women's MMA sometimes to a tedium but as a guy who tends to love and admire female athletes, I usually am consistent on this stance.

BTW I may be fighting soon. I'll keep you guys posted.[/quote]

I'm not sure how to feel about this news. In some ways I am very sad because there are fights I want to see. Carano/Cyborg of course is the main one but Diaz/Alverez is a close second. I appreciate MMA on network TV and I like the idea of there being a competitor to UFC.

On the other hand EliteXC was a horribly ran promotion. It seemed like they made boneheaded move after boneheaded move. They put all their eggs in the Kimbo basket which seemed like a move destined to sink the company.

On the optimistic side of things maybe this opens up a slot for UFC to move into the Network Television space. That would be the best outcome of this whole debacle.

[Ser Barry]

UFC and CBS are at loggerheads over Zuffa refusing to give over any of the production side of the show. I think it was UFC who were approached first, or was that by another channel?

Given that UFC have benefitted greatly from the influx of fighters from Pride and IFL, fighters who may not have got a chance to develop as slowly in the UFC, this doesn't look like good news for anyone. UFC need big organisations where the fighters they release or choose not to sign can grow or recover.

Awesome Horus. Looking forward to some news on that.

[GSP]

Alway's sad to see UFC's competition die off. I love the UFC but they can't platform every top fighter' career, and competition keeps DW and the other pricks honest.

But yeah, EliteXC were boneheads.

Hope like hell the girls get another forum to show us what they've got. It would be a shame not to see Gina and the girls get it on no more.

If my ballsy upset prediction comes to pass indeed, I also hope it extends the Spider's career. I sure as hell hope he doesn't pack it up in two years like all his crazy talk seems to indicate. That would be a shame. I'm hopin Cote is a big roadblock to his plans as well, and he sticks around longer.

[Horus Ex Machina]

While I still don't blame Elite XC for trying to capitalize on Kimbo, I do fault them for how they used him. Trying to make him something that he wasn't was their first mistake. The masses still would have tuned in if they didn't try to make him out to be something that he wasn't simply out of sheer curiosity. How many times did Mike Tyson sell ppvs simply bc of who he was? It could have been the same with Kimbo.

In addition, they didn't use him to sell their other fighters like they could have. They could have used him as a mouthpiece for other fighters. They should have made sure that anyone who interviewed him was forced to ask him about other fighters then Sarah Palin him up with info on other fighters on the cards.

Back to the girls one more time, Carano and Cyborg's fight needs to happen and Affliction would be fools not to go after it. It seems taylor made to attract viewers to their next Fedor card. Most will stay tuned to see a HW title card and it wouldn't be a bad idea to try to get this on CBS to maximize exposure and make sure that the public sees how a well-run card can look minus the rock acts.

But I'm somewhat puzzled that CBS shied away considering that most casual fans who tuned in still don't know about the controversy. Plus they can always fire Shaw and clean up the organization. Perhaps it was the loss of Kimbo as a viable draw. Even with the loss he would have drawn numbers and maybe that was what they were banking on.

[Oorag]

I'm honestly glad that EliteXC is collapsing. Everything about them stank, and the criticisms have all been mentioned before in detail. I'd rather have a better product like the UFC, WEC, or Affliction take their place on network TV. In the end, though, I'm one of those dreamers who wishes all MMA fighters could be united under one quality organization, monopolies be damned.

As far as women's MMA, I was never a fan and I won't be sorry if it falls by the wayside. Gina Carano on broadcast television might be received well, but I don't think so many MMA fans are really going to appreciate a women's bout taking up a slot on the PPV they've shelled out $50 for.

[Horus Ex Machina]

[quote name='Oorag' post='1562898' date='Oct 21 2008, 12.40']I'm honestly glad that EliteXC is collapsing. Everything about them stank, and the criticisms have all been mentioned before in detail. I'd rather have a better product like the UFC, WEC, or Affliction take their place on network TV. In the end, though, I'm one of those dreamers who wishes all MMA fighters could be united under one quality organization, monopolies be damned.

As far as women's MMA, I was never a fan and I won't be sorry if it falls by the wayside. Gina Carano on broadcast television might be received well, but I don't think so many MMA fans are really going to appreciate a women's bout taking up a slot on the PPV they've shelled out $50 for.[/quote]
I'll agree to disagree on that. Fans were being created from outside of the hardcore MMA fans like you and me and I talk to them at work and so on. They were buying her as a credible female athlete ala the Williams sisters, Danica Patrick, or Mia Hamm.

Bottom line, they deserve to fight and that can't be disputed. But I don't get this attitude that is anti-women's MMA and I'm not saying that you have it, but there are alot of hardcore MMA fans that do. But I've gotta believe that anyone who's trained and sweated in a gym with one cannot have that attitude bc not me nor any of my teammates do becaused we've seen them train. And believe me, most gyms will have at least one or two.

I can understand not caring one way or another about it one way or the other, but saying that they should just model or pose for playboy is bullshit and I'll say it that plainly. I prefer women who spend their time in contructive athletic activity (bc that's my idea of bettering one's self man or woman) to those who just diet or spend money.

When I was in the Marines, we did diss on some of the WM's (woman Marines) because we felt that the Corps did not do enough to hold all of them to the physical standards that they held us to. They did not push them to better themselves and more often than not gave them slack for certain aspects of training. Not so at my MMA fight team or any other MMA gym that I've visited. In MMA, they do what we do. They work as hard as we do, and they aren't given slack. Respect comes with that because we know that what we put our bodies through, they give the same percentage. It's hard to disrespect someone who puts it on the line and will work to improve thier body instead of taking the easy way out. I'm like that, and any woman who wants to be with me better be like that too.

[Cuellar]

Problem I have Horus with women's MMA is that even the sport isn't treating it as legitimate. Personally, I don't buy it at Elite X. They basically let their superstar (Gina) get away with anything, and even the bouts aren't as long. They need to treat them as the same, and punch her in the fucking head next time she doesn't make weight (yes I'm still irritated about that bullshit from the previous fight).

[Oorag]

[quote name='Horus-Eternal' post='1562928' date='Oct 21 2008, 11.04']But I don't get this attitude that is anti-women's MMA and I'm not saying that you have it, but there are alot of hardcore MMA fans that do.[/quote]
It's not unique to MMA. I don't anticipate any women boxers showing up on the undercard of the Pavlik-Hopkins fight, and I don't recall the last time there was a WNBA thread on this board. The general public is much less interested in the female version of almost every professional sport. There are a few exceptions, such as tennis and volleyball. Women lucky enough to be talented at those sports or mixed-gender sports like racing don't have anything to worry about. Everyone else is just going to have to accept the general level of interest in their sport and decide for themselves if they want to make it a career. Strongman competitors and curling prodigies aren't going to make millions at their chosen crafts either.