Krafus Posted January 3, 2006 Share Posted January 3, 2006 While TOR is guilty of the travesties that are Lustbader, Goodkind, McGarry, Douglass, Modesitt, Perhaps I'm coming off as an asshole or some sort of elitest, but if the quote you wish to be known by is something said by a vendor in a video game, you should be keeping your mouth shut on forums about books. You might actually learn something. While people may differ on what constitutes good and/or writing, demeaning writing just because it happens to appear in a computer game is laughable, pathetic elitism. BTW, I'm a gamer to some extent. Baldurs Gate was ok, and BG2 was far better. Neither were Neverwinter, and NWN is no WoW. As much as I enjoy games, I see them for what they are.....completely mindless entertainment. (keyword = mindless) The keyword for me is entertainment. If it entertains me, it's worth my time and money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infidel Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Some of the best spec. fiction I've read, period, has been in PC games. Star Control 2, ferex.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stego Posted January 4, 2006 Author Share Posted January 4, 2006 I believe that film is a pathetic bastard child of literature. (as is theatre) It was created for minds incapable of grasping complex ideas and concepts,a nd had to be shown everything. In short, film was developed to entertain the young and the stupid. That it expands beyond those original horizons at various times is a credit to filmmakers, but that doesn't make it a challenging art form. Video games are at worst interactive films, and at best vastly complex puzzles. Sometimes I like to test my fast-twitch fibers against others in FPS even, but video games are what they are....... mindless entertainment. Infidel, if your comment is true, I'd be happy to point out some decent stuff to read. Ashara, is English your second language? I honestly don't know how to reply to your post until I know this. Krafus, Robert J Sawyer, RA Salvatore, Orson Scott Card and others have written the plots of video games. They all sucked, too. Like I've said a million times on the Gamespot forums, if you're playing a video game for the story, you desperately need to read a decent book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bastard of Godsgrace Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Re: abortion - R. Scott Bakker has his No-God do something very much alike in PoN. I wonder if Abraham ripped it out of him. I happen to think it is one of the scariest things imaginable (well, Bakker certainly managed to scare me with his "for eleven years every womb was a grave" line). Besides it is still not done to the death, which has to count for something. You know, not everybody who shows abortion as a bad thing has to be an evil fundamentalist. Certainly nobody could accuse Bakker of being one. Eastern setting is also good thing in my book. I am really sick of Western European medieval setting, and I don't really want to read another book in such setting - unless it is ASIAf class, of course, and how likely is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eurytus Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 I believe that film is a pathetic bastard child of literature. (as is theatre) It was created for minds incapable of grasping complex ideas and concepts,a nd had to be shown everything. In short, film was developed to entertain the young and the stupid. That it expands beyond those original horizons at various times is a credit to filmmakers, but that doesn't make it a challenging art form. Film was not "developed to entertain the young and the stupid". That is total nonsense. I suppose the early German impressionistic works were for the young? Or were they for the stupid? Which is it to be? And as for shown everything, many times a direct comparison can be made between a film and book, and the book will show far more than the film. Not least because a book is better able to deal with presenting the thoughts of a character. The film and book of 2001 are easy examples of a case where the film shows less than the book and demands more of its audience. It seems obvious to me that your prejudice against films and video games has blinded you to their qualities. There is just as much trash in literature as there is in these areas and much of it top selling to. But since Mormont asked us to leave it at that I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Ashara, It's just such a weird combination of Biblical curse You're associating it as a weird mix of "Biblical curse" with the Orient, whereas I'm quite certain curses of this kind were found in a wide variety of cultural traditions -- including Oriental. It might not be any kind of "mix" at all, and just be purely calquing Eastern myth, legend, etc. rather than trying to mix up a rather random stew. It sound quite interesting to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashara Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 The only region that I can think of that could realistically combine monks, cotton and curses in Medievalish setting is probably India, but the blurb and expanded description sounded rather like China/Japan to me. Which is a pity, since I would have liked to see an interesting fantasy book set in a quazi-Indian setting, rather than in Chineese/Japanese one. But without mass-infertility, please. I'd rather expect the land to lose its fertility, dust storms, water starvation etc when one talks about the cotton crops. Ashara, is English your second language? I honestly don't know how to reply to your post until I know this. Yes, I am an ESL, and no, you do not have to reply on my posts, because the moderator, Mormont, had specifically asked us to stop that pointless bickering. I got your point - everything but the books are for the bovine masses. I happen to disagree, but I don't intend to argue with you, neither I intend to drop my hobby of four years and run away in tears. I added a book quote to my signature to calm your frayed nerves. Take it for a victory if that what rocks your boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krafus Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Krafus, Robert J Sawyer, RA Salvatore, Orson Scott Card and others have written the plots of video games. They all sucked, too. Like I've said a million times on the Gamespot forums, if you're playing a video game for the story, you desperately need to read a decent book. I play a video game for the same reason I read a book: to be entertained. If the story of a video game contributes to my entertainment, so much the better. I acknowledge that video games are quite often lacking in the story department, but I also acknowledge that there are some good - i.e. to me good meaning entertaining - stories, which is what you seem to refuse to do. And to tell Ashara to "shut your mouth" in this forum because she happens to like words from a computer game enough to use them as a quote smacks of rudeness and arrogant elitism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brys Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 BTW, I'm a gamer to some extent. Baldurs Gate was ok, and BG2 was far better. Neither were Neverwinter, and NWN is no WoW. As much as I enjoy games, I see them for what they are.....completely mindless entertainment. (keyword = mindless) I don't think of all games as mindless - I'm no more going to dismiss computer games as a medium than I am fantasy novels - the potential for games to be intelligent is there, it's just that as with books, that doesn't sell as well, and unlike books, making a game costs a lot of money. On the subject, the Elder Scrolls series is the only game I've seen create a decent, original fantasy setting - if you appreciate worldbuilding in fantasy, then I don't see how you can complain about it in a game (this is filled with books - ie short stories, information about the world), decent plot (ok, so few games have even average plots, but they can do) They all sucked, too. Like I've said a million times on the Gamespot forums, if you're playing a video game for the story, you desperately need to read a decent book. True - and converting one form of entertainment to another is also likely to end up in something terrible - film to game, game to book, film to book all tend to have awful results, and the only one that works, occasionally, is book to film. But there can be entertaining plots which add to a game. Most games tend to be mindless entertainment, but there are a few that aspire to be more than that. The average novel though is very little more than mindless entertainment either. Back to the topic - A Shadow in Summer looks like a very interesting novel, and it just goes to show that epic fantasy isn't dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 SFX Magazine (Britain's biggest-selling SF and fantasy magazine) is asking on their forum which authors they should be interviewing in 2006. I put forward L. Scott Bakker, Daniel Abraham, Brandon Sanderson (writer of Elantris) and Scott Lynch (writer of The Lies of Locke Lamora). I fully expect them to instead interview David Gemmell (again), Terry Pratchett (again) and Iain Banks (again), but I live in hope that they will be bolder this year. http://forum.sfx.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=39 I'm convinced Stego is pulling our collective legs here in an effort to relieve boredom. There is no other explanation. But we've been told to leave it by the mod, so I suggest we do so. There is little further ground to cover here. Move along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobodymN Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 I'm going to second that, good print interviews are great for an author for now both Lynch and and Abraham will have to settle for me - as FBS wil be intreviewing both. Looking very forward to talk about The Lies of Locke Lamora, and see what kind of reaction it gets! I loved it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanrn Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Screw that, I object to having Computer Games insulted. Anyway Fallout 1 and 2 are the best cRPGs ever made, it is known. So are you calling Rome : Total War mindless fun? You play that without a mind your Empire will be dust within a handful of turns. Fallout 1 and 2, Planescape, BG 1 and 2, all have better stories than 95% of Fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry. Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Interviews are good indeed - interviewed Bakker again a couple of months ago, Sanderson a month or so ago, and perhaps I need to see about also getting Abraham and Lynch in the coming months - if I can find the time! I do hope, however, to be devilishly busy with work in the coming months. I need the money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morcant Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 The summary doesn't really catch my eye. If I wanted to learn about removing seeds from cotton I'd go to a plantation. Maybe I'll read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaco Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 I put forward L. Scott Bakker, Daniel Abraham, Brandon Sanderson (writer of Elantris) and Scott Lynch (writer of The Lies of Locke Lamora). Is The Lies of Locke Lamora out yet? It doesn't seem to be according to Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk. Unless maybe it's only now being translated into English? (I realize Jay, Dylan and probably Stego all have ARCs, but I'm talking general release.) And I realize I'm taking the thread even further afield, but how is Elantris? The reviews at Amazon sound interesting, but this thread is the first I've heard of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry. Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Actually, I don't have ARCs of it yet and the author is American, so English is the native language, I do believe. I haven't yet read Elantis (but I will in the near future), but based on what people have said, it's a stand-alone fantasy and just about everyone that's talked about it has reviewed it positively, so it probably is a book well worth your time to read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobodymN Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 Is The Lies of Locke Lamora out yet? It doesn't seem to be according to Amazon.com and Amazon.co.uk. Unless maybe it's only now being translated into English? (I realize Jay, Dylan and probably Stego all have ARCs, but I'm talking general release.) It's not out until July in the UK, and June in the U.S to my knowledge. I read the manuscript a couple of months ago, and excpecting the compelted UK version anytime now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcelo Rebelo Firqoralas Posted January 4, 2006 Share Posted January 4, 2006 This book by Daniel Abraham and The Lies of Locke Lamora, together with In the Eye of Heaven by David Keck are the upcoming epic fantasy novels that seem most interesting to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infidel Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Infidel, if your comment is true, I'd be happy to point out some decent stuff to read. Notice the qualifier, "some of"? I've read plenty of "decent stuff". In light of your ignorance of said subject (the writing quality of Star Control 2), I excuse your being an dolt this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gylfie Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Stego, You really feel that way about film; that the medium inherently devalues the art? Coming from a family of both authors and filmmakers I have to confess I'm rather stunned at that assesment. It's similar to saying painting is superior to music, or green is a better color than orange. I have to conclude that you are stirring the pot here, your other posts don't seem to show such a simple view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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