is it just me or do stupid names in fantasy annoy everyone?

[elmis]

I've just started reading The Darkness That Comes Before, by R. Scott Bakker, and I have to agree that the names of some places and characters annoy me.

I have no problem with crazy names (though I prefer names that are somewhat easy to pronouce and remember), but I don't really like the usage of û, ï, ü, ä, â ë, ê, letters left and right. It seems too much like a high school kid writing a fantasy story and just discovered the char map on his computer: "This'll really make the name all fantasyesque!"

Other than that, the book is promising - just 60 pages into the story so far.

[Errant Bard]

It's gibberish unless someones told you it's actually real.

Question: what's "real"? If I tell you: vi estas grandega kreteno is "real", what do you make of it?

[kungtotte]

This was completely ruined for me simply because the swedish translation decided to translate the "Dark" part of his name.

So the evil wizard-tyrant is named Mörken Rahl.

Localisation :angry:

It's like when they translate "elves" to "älvor".

[Galactus]

Localisation :angry:

It's like when they translate "elves" to "älvor".

I think my favourite one is the Warhammer: Dark Omen manual. It translated "Night Goblins" to "Natttomtar". Was even better in norwegian: "Nattnissernes buedrenge"

[kungtotte]

Haha, I know I would be afraid of an army of 'natt-tomtar' :)

[Thor85]

I get totally turned off if the name has more than two apostrophes. Something's definitely wrong when you have hard time thinking the character name, much less pronouncing it aloud. Then its much worse if it is a main character.

[Vethnar]

I think my favourite one is the Warhammer: Dark Omen manual. It translated "Night Goblins" to "Natttomtar". Was even better in norwegian: "Nattnissernes buedrenge"

That's not Norwegian, but Danish.

Easy mistake to make, of course. The two languages are difficult to tell apart, at least in written form.

[Happy Ent]

I have no problem with crazy names (though I prefer names that are somewhat easy to pronouce and remember), but I don't really like the usage of û, ï, ü, ä, â ë, ê, letters left and right.

This are pronunciation guides. I find them very helpful. How else do you propose to write Eleäzaras?

[niamh]

I couldn't really tell you anything about the other one, though, other than all those soft consonants mean someone's trying really hard to make a language that sounds "pretty."

Ahah! yes.

It's entish, and as such, nonsense to humans.

As all Tolkien languages go, it's the most outlandish and the weirdest (and very sketchy),which is why I used it here really. It really suits Ents, which are, well, trees.

I didn't want to make it a page long, as it's irrelevant here, but every language in there is totally suited to its speakers.

Which leads me to another thing that really annoys me, that is the "Tolkien rip-off" category.

While I know nothing about the author (sue me), a name like Anasurimbor (pseudo Dwarvish) Kellhus (pseudo celtico latin), annoys me straight out. I find it easy to pronounce (familiar languages to me), but as a name combination it's lazy and inconsistent and implausible. Like something out of a bad Tolkien fandom

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

Ahah! yes.

It's entish, and as such, nonsense to humans.

As all Tolkien languages go, it's the most outlandish and the weirdest (and very sketchy),which is why I used it here really. It really suits Ents, which are, well, trees.

I didn't want to make it a page long, as it's irrelevant here, but every language in there is totally suited to its speakers.

Which leads me to another thing that really annoys me, that is the "Tolkien rip-off" category.

While I know nothing about the author (sue me), a name like Anasurimbor (pseudo Dwarvish) Kellhus (pseudo celtico latin), annoys me straight out. I find it easy to pronounce (familiar languages to me), but as a name combination it's lazy and inconsistent and implausible. Like something out of a bad Tolkien fandom

Considering that Bakker is pretty far from a Tolkien ripoff, I'd say that your criticism is invalid in this case. Also, if you are approaching it from the perspective of human languages, his names resonate well. Thunyeri has the harsh syllables of Germanic, Sheyic recalls both Latin and Greek, and the name Anasurimbor could actually be the name of a Sumerian king, for all I know.

[fitheach]

I have more of a problem when character names are too similar, as in the Tolkien Rings trilogy. Otherwise I don't have an issue with stange names, as long as they're not too ridiculous or twee.

[jurble]

While I know nothing about the author (sue me), a name like Anasurimbor (pseudo Dwarvish) Kellhus (pseudo celtico latin), annoys me straight out. I find it easy to pronounce (familiar languages to me), but as a name combination it's lazy and inconsistent and implausible. Like something out of a bad Tolkien fandom

Anasurimbor Kellhus is supposed to be pseudo-Sumerian/Akkadian if anything. Jeez, just look at that List of Sumerian kings that was listed earlier. When I read the books, I instantly recognized the Ancient North was supposed to be ancient Mesopotamia.

Compare Anasurimbor and Nebuchadnezzar (Akkadian)

[Prince Who Was Promised]

I've recently started reading TDTCB, and I can't say I have much of a problem with the names. I didn't expect the semi-European sounding names that some fantasies have. I expected something more eastern, and wasn't surprised, so it's not a big deal to me.

Plus, playing Assassin's Creed at the same time kinda helped ;)

[Lord O' Bones]

Question: what's "real"? If I tell you: vi estas grandega kreteno is "real", what do you make of it?

Esperanto?

[Errant Bard]

Esperanto?

Yes :)

So: real or not real? It is an invented language, after all, and it carries meaning the same way tolkien-elf does

[Lord O' Bones]

Yes :)

So: real or not real? It is an invented language, after all, and it carries meaning the same way tolkien-elf does

I'd say it's real as I tried to learn it in high school.* Aren't there millions of speakers, even now? I see what you're getting at though, it was created by a linguist rather than evolved speach. Like Tolkien's Elvish. The difference I suppose, is that it was meant to be functional whereas Elvish was probably not. In the sense that Klingon was not meant to be functional as a useful language other than not sounding shitty in the movies, but made so by nerds.**

* I can only remember how to say "Kio estas supre, go?" and I think "hundoj" means 'boy.'

** Granted, I only wanted to learn Esperanto from reading a lot of Harry Harrison.

ETA: I found an Esperanto translator. Nice one, anusulo. :P Also, "hundoj" means 'dogs.' Which makes more sense, in context.

[Poobah]

This are pronunciation guides. I find them very helpful. How else do you propose to write Eleäzaras?

As a native English speaker reading a book in written in English, by an English speaker I find them highly annoying. Those letters do not exist in the English language and I have absolutely no idea how to pronounce them, so they do no good to me whatsoever. I'd pronounce Eleäzaras exactly the same as Eleazaras because I know no better, having never studied any language but English in any detail, and while I did a little German a long time ago I've no idea what the umlaut would do in this instance.

If I read a book with a load of random accents, apostrophes, umlauts and the like I just think that the guy is trying too damn hard to make his character names / fake language seem Tolkinesque or exotic or whatever - "look it has funny letters, so it's fantastical" - not "this guy is helping me to pronounce his names by taking care to use symbols that tell me the exact pronunciation". I have to think that the great majority of readers will, like me, be entirely clueless about the pronunciation of the various accented letters and shit. Even most European languages don't use loads of different accents, so I'd assume French speakers wouldn't know what to do with an umlaut and German speakers what to do with a û or whatever.

TL:DR version : I don't see accents and all that as helpful, quite the opposite.

[Lord O' Bones]

As a native English speaker reading a book in written in English, by an English speaker I find them highly annoying. Those letters do not exist in the English language and I have absolutely no idea how to pronounce them, so they do no good to me whatsoever. I'd pronounce Eleäzaras exactly the same as Eleazaras because I know no better, having never studied any language but English in any detail, and while I did a little German a long time ago I've no idea what the umlaut would do in this instance.

If I read a book with a load of random accents, apostrophes, umlauts and the like I just think that the guy is trying too damn hard to make his character names / fake language seem Tolkinesque or exotic or whatever - "look it has funny letters, so it's fantastical" - not "this guy is helping me to pronounce his names by taking care to use symbols that tell me the exact pronunciation". I have to think that the great majority of readers will, like me, be entirely clueless about the pronunciation of the various accented letters and shit. Even most European languages don't use loads of different accents, so I'd assume French speakers wouldn't know what to do with an umlaut and German speakers what to do with a û or whatever.

TL:DR version : I don't see accents and all that as helpful, quite the opposite.

I agree with this in principle, but you to have allow that many authors don't care how you pronounce it; but it looks/sounds cool to them.

[Galactus]

Anasurimbor Kellhus is supposed to be pseudo-Sumerian/Akkadian if anything. Jeez, just look at that List of Sumerian kings that was listed earlier. When I read the books, I instantly recognized the Ancient North was supposed to be ancient Mesopotamia.

Compare Anasurimbor and Nebuchadnezzar (Akkadian)

Calling something "Sumerian/Akkadian" is kind of like calling something "basque/spanish". The languages aren't related. (akkadian is a semitic language, related to hebrew and arabic, sumerian is one of those funky isolate languages)

[Bastard of Godsgrace]

As a native English speaker reading a book in written in English, by an English speaker I find them highly annoying. Those letters do not exist in the English language and I have absolutely no idea how to pronounce them, so they do no good to me whatsoever. I'd pronounce Eleäzaras exactly the same as Eleazaras because I know no better, having never studied any language but English in any detail, and while I did a little German a long time ago I've no idea what the umlaut would do in this instance.

Those are not umlauts but diacritics marking diaeresis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diaeresis

They mean that a letter so marked is supposed to be an independent syllable, not a part of a diphtong. In this function they are used only in English and French, AFAIK (some other languages may use different marks). That means Eleäzaras is not foreign, but particularly English spelling signifying eä part should be pronounced as two distinct syllables - eh-ah (In German pronounciation would be very different).