I'm going to make a Brienne prediction

[smegma]

Er. Why?

We'll be doing very well if she is 6 foot. All the tall actors have been reduced in size. Doubt they'll bother with elevator shoes for her.

A couple inches below 6 foot and she'll still look bigger than all the other actress in the show probably.

Yeah. Actors, especially those for tv and film, are typically (but not always, obviously) short. A six foot tall actor is usually one of the tallest onscreen. Obviously with GRRM's characters, some required even taller than that. But Conan is going to look MONSTROUS onscreen at 7 foot. The average height for a screen actress is less than five and a half feet tall. A six foot tall woman would be plenty, especially with camera angles and tricks.

[lacuna]

I saw a tall girl in the new Robin Hood movie today, Andrea Ware. She's 6'2", which ought to be ok. If she can act, and learn to use a sword (and possibly gain a little muscle, but padding would help), the make-up department ought to do the rest.

And even better, on the same casting site I found Becky Wingham. She is only slightly shorter, but closer to Briennes age, has a slightly more similar build, and with stage combat training. Again, the make-up department will have to pitch in, but they were always going to have to do that. She even has diving experience, so the escape from Riverrun can be done without a stuntwoman/double.

[Dennai]

I saw a tall girl in the new Robin Hood movie today, Andrea Ware. She's 6'2", which ought to be ok. If she can act, and learn to use a sword (and possibly gain a little muscle, but padding would help), the make-up department ought to do the rest.

I'm assuming you're refering to Little John's paramour. I mentioned her before as a possible Brienne, but in the film she was little more than a glorified extra, so I don't know how good she can act. Do you know how old she is? She looked youngish enough to me to make a proper Brienne.

[lacuna]

I'm assuming you're refering to Little John's paramour. I mentioned her before as a possible Brienne, but in the film she was little more than a glorified extra, so I don't know how good she can act. Do you know how old she is? She looked youngish enough to me to make a proper Brienne.

All I know is what's on that link to her profile. It says her playing age is 25, so not too bad. I still like Becky Wingham better, though...

[Guy That Dies On p250]

All I know is what's on that link to her profile. It says her playing age is 25, so not too bad. I still like Becky Wingham better, though...

Agreed: Becky Wingham looks perfect - six feet and fifteen stone (that's 210 'pounds' in American) with combat training and a face that could certainly be made quite unlovely with some make-up. Unless they stoop to casting somebody like one of the women from Gladiators, they're not going to get a better physical fit.

Great find.

[nightwisp1956]

Becky does look like a good fit. She is also active in sports which would be a plus. Is she being considered for Brienne? If not she should be.

[Kinski]

A few commentators on WiC have suggested Gwendoline Christie, who looks like being an interesting choice. She's British and extremely tall, coming in at around 6'3", with a number of stage credits and what appears to be a small role in Terry Gilliam's latest film. She appears in an excerpt from Cymbeline

at the 1.45 mark and a following interview.

Looks like an interesting choice. She's quite attractive, but HBO can probably 'plainify' her for the role. She has quite noticeable eyes as well, a notable characteristic of Brienne's. And she appears to be a good actress, from the clip shown.

My top choice for Brienne at the moment as well!

[MyDogIsNamedDanerys]

I'm impressed by the casting you guys have come up with, particularly Becky Wingham. At the WiC forums everyone suggested is either too old (there's this 40 year old stunt woman that keeps getting suggested) or too hot (Katie Sackoff?? Arrgh!).

Anyway there MUST be many unknown large unattractive women actors. This is because MOST large unattractive women actors REMAIN unknown, or have bit character roles because of a lack of roles that fit them. Brienne would be a HUGE break for any <25 yo homely, 6'0" actress.

[SteveWestenra]

I'm impressed by the casting you guys have come up with, particularly Becky Wingham. At the WiC forums everyone suggested is either too old (there's this 40 year old stunt woman that keeps getting suggested) or too hot (Katie Sackoff?? Arrgh!).

Anyway there MUST be many unknown large unattractive women actors. This is because MOST large unattractive women actors REMAIN unknown, or have bit character roles because of a lack of roles that fit them. Brienne would be a HUGE break for any <25 yo homely, 6'0" actress.

THIS. I find it ridiculous that HBO wouldn't try to cast someone who physically fit the part, as I imagine there are a lot of "homely" looking actresses who are talented but who simply don't get big breaks like this specifically because of their looks. One of the reasons I love Brienne as a character is that she does represent those of us who are not attractive and who, consequently, have been ostracized at whatever time during our lives (not saying that's the only reason she is treated poorly, but just that it is an important one). I would actually be pretty offended if they prettied Brienne up or tried to pull an Ugly Betty on the audience. :/ To me it would be a huge cop-out.

[Padraig]

To me it would be a huge cop-out.

In fairness, it is a very tricky role to cast. I think we'll have to give the producers some leeway when it comes to their eventual choice. She has to portray a certain vulnerability and innocence combined with a certain stubborness and strength. Just focusing on her build or her looks would be wrong IMO. Those can be changed but the actress either can portray the spirit of the character or she can't. No filming tricks will work there.

[Dennai]

Honestly, I can't understand why some people find so hard to believe that HBO won't cast an actress who will look to a certain degree like "book Brianne" and they'll go instead for a pretty actress acting tomboyish.

Natalia Tena's example is simply not valid. Book Osha isn't hot, but her lack of hotness isn't important, besides being uncertain. We have the opinion of several and different characters in the book and all agree Brienne is downright ugly, not buts or ifs, she's ugly as sin.

Osha, by the other hand, is only judged not pretty for Bran, a kid, and besides, he doesn't find her particularly ugly, just hard to tell it's a woman. It could be the way she dresses, the short hair, a weatherly appearance. But the fact is, she was attractive enough for Stiv the deserter to carry her along, attractive enough for the Winterfell cook to be kind and lenient in exchange, and attractive enough to distract a Ironborn guard from his duties.

I'm sure there are a lot of actresses who are big and plain enough who can fit the role without need of tons of make-up. If just a matter of finding a young Sigourney Weaver. She cleans up quite nicely, but her size, lack of curves and square jaw allows to turn her into as unattractive tomboy just as easy. Some fluffy hair, crooked teeth and nose, and you have Brienne of Tarth.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

she won't be a gargoyle, but she won't be hot either. I think she'll just be plain, maybe with a slight build.

[Myrish swan]

i don't know if i agree. did you watch deadwood at all? they certainly didn't make calamity jane a beauty. and yeah, i could see them doing something like taking a character that's supposed to be attractive and making her very hot, or something, but brienne's unattractive looks are so essential to who she is and her and jaime. i don't think that it would make a whole lot of sense to have jaime riding around calling some hot chic "wench" and making cracks about her ugliness when she's obviously a babe. i don't think anyone would buy it.

you do have a point about american tv, and tv in general, i hear you, but we have to remember this is not tv it's HBO :)

www.educatedpony.wordpress.com

Apologies for responding here to a posting that is, like, 10 months old, but I just wanted to comment that I don't think Calamity Jane from Deadwood is an example of an ugly woman on TV. If you look at webpages about the actress playing Calamity Jane, it's clear that out of her clothes and makeup for the show, she's actually an attractive woman. George Clooney went out with her, for crying out loud-- and if you look at Clooney's other girlfriends, I think we can all agree that the #1 thing the guy is not personality. In short, I'd say Calamity Jane is a fine example of "tv/ movie ugly." Very different from real life ugly.

I'm not sure how I feel about the casting of Brienne. On the one hand, I want them to remain authentic; on the other, I think that their are few (if any) actresses that even mildly resemble GRRM's description of Brienne. Nearly all actresses are slender and graceful (aside from the few significantly overweight gals always hired to be "the chubby best friend/ comic relief part), whereas Brienne is big, strong, and muscular. The vast majority of TV/ Movie (and even stage) actresses also have conventionally pretty faces, so there will be real trouble there as well.

Of course, in TV, as in any other artistic medium, its important to give the general feeling of something more than the thing itself. That is, it's okay that Tyrion is being played by a pretty dang cute actor rather than one who is hideous and malformed as book Tyrion is; we still get the impression from his dwarfism that he's an outsider and seen as an embarrassment by his family. So guess they just have to show us Brienne the outsider. Bug again, I wonder how they're going to do that. With Brienne, being ugly, huge, and freakish is pretty much the basis of her character-- all of her amazing qualities-- and her bad ones-- seem to come out of the fact that she's a total outsider, who cannot do what she is supposed to do in her society (attract a husband and have baby's.) Furthermore, her being big/ super muscular are what allows her to be just as good a warrior as a man.

Still, even if HBO did the unthinkable and got a huge, genuinely unattractive girl to play Brienne, I think that that could lead to its own problems. First, it might be kind of awkward for the actress hired, knowing she's been hired because she is unattractive. Secondly, it might be kind of awkward for viewers to watch her-- I'd kind of feel weirdly embarrassed for a truly unnattractive girl surrounded by all of the other gorgeous, hollywood types. Finally, could you imagine what some of the idiots online would be saying on message boards about how they don't want to watch an "ugly chick?" Yikes.

[Padraig]

Still, even if HBO did the unthinkable and got a huge, genuinely unattractive girl to play Brienne, I think that that could lead to its own problems.

I don't think it matters what the actress who plays Brienne looks like (as long as she is reasonably tall). Its how she looks in costume that matters. That's why Calamity Jane was mentioned. HBO didn't choose to glamourise her (even if the actress who played her was attractive).

Brienne will be an outsider because she goes around as a knight. She can't be attractive and she must be awkward. After that, HBO has license to play (depending on the actress they choose).

First, it might be kind of awkward for the actress hired, knowing she's been hired because she is unattractive. Secondly, it might be kind of awkward for viewers to watch her-- I'd kind of feel weirdly embarrassed for a truly unnattractive girl surrounded by all of the other gorgeous, hollywood types.

I don't think the first thing there is an issue. She has to be somewhat self-aware of her image if she is in the acting business. And the second might be ideal. GRRM wanted us to ask questions about why a woman couldn't do what she wanted to. If it makes us feel embarrased...that's our issues. :)

[Inglorious Pencil]

And even better, on the same casting site I found Becky Wingham. She is only slightly shorter, but closer to Briennes age, has a slightly more similar build, and with stage combat training. Again, the make-up department will have to pitch in, but they were always going to have to do that. She even has diving experience, so the escape from Riverrun can be done without a stuntwoman/double.

This seems like a really good suggestion :thumbsup: the stage combat training is a big plus, though I'd love to see a full figure picture as well. She might still be a bit too pretty compared to book!Brienne, but yeah, some make up might do the trick.

I find it ridiculous that HBO wouldn't try to cast someone who physically fit the part' date=' as I imagine there are a lot of "homely" looking actresses who are talented but who simply don't get big breaks like this specifically because of their looks.[/quote']

My thoughts exactly. :agree:

[SamanthaofHodorsfield]

I'm definitely a Becky Wingham fan. Sure, she would need uglifying, but that's what the make-up department is for.

[Inglorious Pencil]

For the record, WiC.net has just put up a Brienne casting post. What do you guys think about their suggestions?

[MyDogIsNamedDanerys]

My perception of the character is that if her fairy godmother showed up and offered her the choice between becoming a traditionally beautiful woman or becoming a man, Brienne would choose the option of becoming male with delight.

I disagree with this. The only reason that Brienne even considered becoming a knight is that she was unable to follow the female role - and she TRIED HARD. She put on the trappings, was kind and polite, and tried to be the perfect lady to her male suiters... but they rejected her because of her looks.

She was forcibly ejected from being a Westrosi lady... being a knight was essentially a last resort. She's very lucky she happened to be good at it (of course her physicality was part of the reason she was rejected).

I suppose now that being a knight is such a part of her persona, she would have a harder time deciding - but to begin with she wished with all her heart to be a "proper lady" that could have hope of finding love and happiness in the traditional way. I don't think she wishes she were a man at all.

[Inglorious Pencil]

I disagree with this. The only reason that Brienne even considered becoming a knight is that she was unable to follow the female role - and she TRIED HARD. She put on the trappings, was kind and polite, and tried to be the perfect lady to her male suiters... but they rejected her because of her looks.

Um, I don't really think this is the case. When she is sixteen and bethroted to that Humfrey Wagstaff old dude, he says he'll marry her if she stops going around in chainmail. If Brienne was so eager to just be accepted as a lady and be done with it, she would simply have said yes. Instead she challenges him telling him she would only marry someone who could outfight her, and proceeds to break his bones. She attempts the whole lady shtick because she feels hard pressed to, because she knows her father loves her but her unmarriageability is a problem to him. But even when she crushes on Renly, the thing she wishes for is "to serve and protect him", because she *wants* to be a knight and she reasons in that perspective.

Sure - she does think that if she had a normal lady's life, things would have been easier - all insecure kids want to fit in, to an extent. But she also finds herself to be somewhat "relieved" that things hadn't gone that way. So... yeah, Brienne wants to find love and wants to be accepted. But she also wants to be a knight. And I don't think she has ever been willing to trade one thing for the other. That's her tragedy - and one of the reasons she's my favorite character :thumbsup:

[Padraig]

Yes, while I think she tried to adapt to what was expected of her, she wasn't comfortable at all in that position. And the older she got, the less comfortable she became (helped by how she was treated), which led her to been even less willing to try.