Is the Black Fish Gay?

[SingleMort]

Maybe I'm just jumping to conclusions but that whole feud between him and Hoster because he wouldn't marry someone seemed like there was more to it. I mean why would it be so bad if he didn't marry it's not as if he was likely to be heir to Riverrun, and that's the only other reason I could think of for Hoster to argue with him about it so much. Or is that whole feud merely a result of some skeleton in the closet??

[Lady Blackfish]

Common ideas:

- He just wants to stay a bachelor because he enjoys being a bachelor

- He had or has some lover that he could not be with and doesn't want to marry for reasons other than love (this lover could be of either gender; some have floated around the idea of his sister-in-law, Minisa Whent)

- He is a contrarian and expressly is avoiding doing what Hoster told him to do

- He is gay

[alguien]

I once wondered if he'd had a lover (male or female--take your pick) that was killed during the War of the Ninepenny Kings. The sort of thing that could provoke him to a rage that made him the formidable warrior that the Kingslayer worshiped in his youth.

Would be interesting to one day hear a little backstory on this.

[Datepalm]

Common ideas:

- He just wants to stay a bachelor because he enjoys being a bachelor

- He had or has some lover that he could not be with and doesn't want to marry for reasons other than love (this lover could be of either gender; some have floated around the idea of his sister-in-law, Minisa Whent)

- He is a contrarian and expressly is avoiding doing what Hoster told him to do

- He is gay

Her takes a contrary political position to Hoster dynastic expansionism, and as part and parcel of that is opposed to the political matched Hoster made for his children and the callous treatment of Petyr and Lysa's abortion, and his refusal to give Hoster a similar control over his own life is symbolic of the wider tactical issue of house policy.

[Alexia]

I don't know if the Blackfish is gay or not, but I always thought his story of refusing a marriage was meant to be seen alongside Lysa's forced marriage as an example of how men are able to make choices in that society and women are not.

[ice snake]

I've suspected that Blackfish might be gay.

[Datepalm]

I've suspected that Blackfish might be gay.

But is refusal to marry actually any indication of gayness in westeros? Renly and Lyn Corbray (and Xaro Xhoan Daxos) have no problem getting married for political utility. I don't think any of them are thinking in terms of a gay rights, legalize marriage movement and holding out for recognition and civil ceremonies.

[Lady Blackfish]

But he may not want to marry some woman that may expect an emotional relationship from the marriage, knowing he wouldn't be capable of giving it. That could obviously work with any sexual orientation on the Blackfish's part, but homosexuality might add an extra level of "I know this could never work" *shrugs*

[delete this account pls]

He's broken more than a few lances, if you know what I mean.

[dolorouseddwasright]

Does it really matter? I don't think about the Blackfish's sexuality, why he didn't marry at Hoster's command is his decision and I do not need the details. The important thing is that the Blackfish makes his own decisions, and he is a very competent knight. It doesn't matter why he refused Hoster's order to marry, all that matters is what he is doing in the current story line. And he is being a serious and dangerous foe to the Lannisters and Freys. I don't think we really need to worry about his sexuality, it is his business. Just enjoy the bad-assitude the Blackfish brings to the story.

:)

[snake]

Is the Blackfish gay?

No.

[Namorath]

i feel that the Blackfish is of that small minority of people who are asexual and is only interested in his knightly duties then any sexual daliances

just because is chooses to not get married doesnt necessarily mean that is is an example of the extreme opposite

[SingleMort]

I haven't seen any real evidence that he is but it did seem that there was more to his and Hoster's feud becuase why would Hoster care so much about something fairly inconsequencial?

[PestilencE]

I don't know if the Blackfish is gay or not, but I always thought his story of refusing a marriage was meant to be seen alongside Lysa's forced marriage as an example of how men are able to make choices in that society and women are not.

Yep. Sounds right to me.

[The Usurper]

I had never considered him being gay, as there's no real evidence apart from him not marrying. I don't really care if he is or not, I don't see how it can impact the story.

By the way this made me think of: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAxailJPU5Q

[trio]

But is refusal to marry actually any indication of gayness in westeros? Renly and Lyn Corbray (and Xaro Xhoan Daxos) have no problem getting married for political utility. I don't think any of them are thinking in terms of a gay rights, legalize marriage movement and holding out for recognition and civil ceremonies.

Yes - I actually think if he were gay not only would it be a badly held secret - like Renly and Lyn Corbray - but that also he'd probably not have any ideological objection to marriage.

I think he's just not interested in any kind of domestic life. He wants to be a Knight, and to be able to be unencumbered. And because his older brother had a son, he doesn't get why he should be forced to change his life.

[Rockroi]

I think that the subtext is that the Blackfish is gay, but that's not the main point. The main point is that he consistently disobeys his liege lord's command to marry and that in doing so he is shirking his duty. I think the Blackfish has made it pretty plain that he will "never" marry. While the reader may be concerned with the "why", its readily apparent that Hoster Tully is not.

The Blackfish's reasons for not marrying are not acceptable at ANY level- be it an emotional attachment to someone else, liking the bachelor lifestyle or being gay, none excuse him from meeting his obligations. One obligation is to, in effect, sustain the household through inter-dynastic marriage and producing heirs. The fact is, as Alexia pointed out, if he were Lysa (not saying Lysa is a lesbian- she obviously is not), he would have no say or choice in the matter, but because a man's sword hand and military acumen are prized, he can do as he pleases even if it really is an affront to his household to stay unwed.

The fact that Blackfish is gay (and that seems clear only insofar as he states he will never be married, and being gay seems to be the only status that would keep that door closed) is not as important as the fact that he has basically insulted his lord brother by refusing to do his duty.

[dolorouseddwasright]

The fact that Blackfish is gay (and that seems clear only insofar as he states he will never be married, and being gay seems to be the only status that would keep that door closed) is not as important as the fact that he has basically insulted his lord brother by refusing to do his duty.

But being gay doesn't keep that door closed. Renly was gay and he married a woman. To get the Tyrells to support his cause, yes, but it was still a political marriage. I don't think gay men in ASOIAF really have a problem with getting married. They will do it to further their own ambitions, and those of their House. I think there needs to be more of a reason for the Blackfish to refuse his brother's orders to marry. He could have married and just done his duty once a year (like Stannis, I believe) and kept gay lovers on the side.

Again, though, does it really matter to us, the readers, what his sexuality is ? He is there, he commands respect, even amongst his foes, we need to let him be himself.

:)

[Mad Monkey]

Why would anyone think that he's gay? His name is the blackFISH. That should be a telling clue that his proclivities swing towards more piscine tendencies.

[Daena the Defiant]

He's broken more than a few lances, if you know what I mean.

He's also crossed a few swords in his day, if you know what I mean.