Boarders Writing a Novel Thread 4

[Arthmail]

Congratulations!!!

But if i might make a suggestion? Or at least, i'll tell you how i'm proceeding. I finished the first book of my series, the Darker Wars, almost a year ago...thats including proof readers. The book in its original draft was actually 800 pages or so, single spaced, size 10 font. Fucking massive. Hearing of how the business of publishing works, i knew that getting it out might be near impossible.

So i split it in half. Then cut 50,000 off the first half, which became book one, and retooled it. Then i sent it out to one, and only one so far, agent. He said the size scared him.

So, while i decide on who to send it to next, i'm writing a single stand alone novel set in the same world, with some events leading up to the original series, but with none of the main characters or place from the Darker Wars.

There might be a chance that your first series does not get published, and if you write all three novels, you might have lost a great deal of time. What i would suggest, is start something fresh as well. Just so you don't have all of your eggs in one basket.

[Ealdorman Halasahr]

I wrote one long prologue at a time when I thought I knew what the hell I wanted to put in it. Then I finished the entire novel, 21 chapters, nine POVs, blood and death, and a little melancholich mayhem on top of that.

At that point I realised I had to change the prologue. So I wrote a new one, pretty much from scratch. And it's a much better - and shorter - one, I'm glad to tell you.

So, to answer Arthmail's question, I have rewritten the prologue twice. But I've edited the damn thing - and all the rest - six or seven or eight times now. The editing never really ends, does it?

On the topic of WASP and "waspy" names, unlike Eloisa's my surname is pretty uncommon, un-waspy even in Swedish, so I guess I'm clear of danger. In fact, my name is a pretty darn good one, when I think about it. It ought to be perfect on the back of a book, upon the shelves in the bookstores. Oh, yeah.

SerNotAppearingOnThisBoard (phew, long name!), I agree with you regarding publishers' willingness to change names and titles. So, I know I shouldn't get to attached to my own names should they all be dramatically altered in the future. But until then, I'll stick with them, and like them.

[SerNotAppearingOnThisBoard]

Congratulations!!!

But if i might make a suggestion? Or at least, i'll tell you how i'm proceeding. I finished the first book of my series, the Darker Wars, almost a year ago...thats including proof readers. The book in its original draft was actually 800 pages or so, single spaced, size 10 font. Fucking massive. Hearing of how the business of publishing works, i knew that getting it out might be near impossible.

So i split it in half. Then cut 50,000 off the first half, which became book one, and retooled it. Then i sent it out to one, and only one so far, agent. He said the size scared him.

So, while i decide on who to send it to next, i'm writing a single stand alone novel set in the same world, with some events leading up to the original series, but with none of the main characters or place from the Darker Wars.

There might be a chance that your first series does not get published, and if you write all three novels, you might have lost a great deal of time. What i would suggest, is start something fresh as well. Just so you don't have all of your eggs in one basket.

Currently, I've got two standalones in progress, totally disconnected from this world, no desire to turn them into series. At this point, writing is still something I do for fun, not a way I expect to make a living yet. I figure I'm young and have other marketable skills, so I have time to indulge my hobby. :) I do take comfort in knowing that I know some published authors, so if and when the time comes that I decide to take this seriously, I have people to go to for help.

[Zoë Sumra]

SerNotAppearing - many, many congratulations. :) Whatever you do next, I hope it's fun.

[awesome possum]

Congrats Ser! Before you do anything else, take a moment or ten to enjoy the feeling of accomplishment at completing a draft.

[Myrddin]

I've kept this thread open all morning, trying find something to say. Now, I do.

Oh my god, TSB is done!!

:cheers:

Awesome! Congrats, SerFinishedHisBook!

:cheers:

[Starkess]

I think I have a serious problem.

The main defining element of my world is that eye color is an indicator of intrinsic magical differences which has led to an informal caste system between the "rare-eyeds" and the commoners. One of main characters has a huge plotline revolving around the fact that his inventor father has made a way for him to disguise his brown eyes. The only way I could think of was some sort of lens, and I built this into my entire novel. I know it's out there for the level of technology I've established, but I was hoping I could kind of hand wave it...but as I get some critiques, I realize that was really stupid of me. But what else could his father invent that would have the same results?? I'm totally stuck, and now I'm freaking out that I have to trash my whole novel...

[Mathis Waters]

The main defining element of my world is that eye color is an indicator of intrinsic magical differences which has led to an informal caste system between the "rare-eyeds" and the commoners. One of main characters has a huge plotline revolving around the fact that his inventor father has made a way for him to disguise his brown eyes. The only way I could think of was some sort of lens, and I built this into my entire novel. I know it's out there for the level of technology I've established, but I was hoping I could kind of hand wave it...but as I get some critiques, I realize that was really stupid of me. But what else could his father invent that would have the same results?? I'm totally stuck, and now I'm freaking out that I have to trash my whole novel...

Eyedrops.

[awesome possum]

Maybe some type of alchemical eye-drops that are temporary and only work with the special lenses created by the father?

[ErikConrad]

Grats SerNotAppearingOnThisBoard! :thumbsup:

Starkess: Or maybe magical contacts?

[Starkess]

You know, that could really work! His father is a yellow-eyed (fire magic), so if he could somehow work that into the lenses, then it won't be quite so implausible. Or, failing that, eyedrops makes more sense too, as it seems more believable than the medieval contacts I've got going on...

thanks guys! novel saved! :grouphug:

[Arthmail]

The thing about fantasy, is its just like Star Trek. Have the engineer twiddle with the doo-hickey and the warp core doesn't explode, or that black hole collapses into a delicious bowl of rasberries. Yea!!! Thanks Scotty.

It could be as simple as having someone drink the juices from a very rare plant. It doesn't matter, its your world.

[Myrddin]

Eyedrops.

I've been doing alot of research into 15th alchemy lately for my next WiP, so I'm going to take Matthias' cool idea and take it a step further.

The character's father found a rare flower/spice/plant/berry/something organic (on a journey perhaps?*) and discovered that if injested, it temporarily changes eye color. He takes this edible item back to his home and starts experimenting (he brought back a quantity of dried flowers/spices/etc). By the time his son is older, he has invented the eye drops that last longer than a few hours and offers his son the gift of being in the higher caste.

If the drops are based on the rare item, then you can add tension by establishing there is only a limited supply.

Cool idea, Starkess. Good luck with it!

*Maybe the father found it on a remote island where he thought all the natives were of that caste because they all had the given eye color. Later he noticed the color wore off before the next meal, only to reappear again afterwards. Whatever spice or herb they use to flavor their food causes the change. Being seperated from civilization, they place no attachment on the eye color. It's natural for them.

[Starkess]

The problem with that scenario is that their nation is a very isolated island (the other landmasses are nothing more than myth). Although I've revised up the size (it's something about the size of Greenland now), it still doesn't seem that there is something natural that no one has discovered, as they've covered the land pretty well. So it would have to be something like a unique combination of plants.

The impetus is that Shrenik's mother is a green-eyed and his father is a yellow-eyed, so they were horribly disappointed to have a brown-eyed son. That isn't unheard of, of course, but his mother is slightly off her rocker due to her feline bondmate dying. She wants Shrenik to have a feline (sort of live vicariously thing), but only blue-eyed males can bond felines. Which is all proving rather difficult to work into the story, as I nixed Shrenik's "opening chapter" as it was rather clunky and delayed the real start of the book.

Hmm...fun problems! It's been so long since I've had to plot (I outline insanely, so I've been in pure writing mode for like a yaer now), I've almost forgotten how!

[Zoë Sumra]

Which is all proving rather difficult to work into the story, as I nixed Shrenik's "opening chapter" as it was rather clunky and delayed the real start of the book.

Dribbling information can work for this. Chapter 1: it is an established fact that people bond to mystical felines. Chapter 2: only certain people can do this, and there's a class implication. Chapter 3: this situation impacts on the characters in X way. It is difficult at the start of books, but doable.

There are still six or so pages of Rough Diamond to which red pen needs adding, but as today was a nice day - sunny, neither too hot nor too cold - I went a-wandering looking at locations for a non-SF book about football that I may or may not write some day. Rather pleased because I'd thought I would need to knock down several buildings belonging to an international drinks conglomerate to make way for a stadium, but it turns out that said buildings have a patch of wasteland next to them big enough for three football stadia, so yay. I also sorted out a prospective location for where an old stadium could have once been, depending on what was where the local multiplex now is, and found the precise location of an old train line I'd want to resurrect for the purpose (it used to be a goods-only siding going straight into a factory), though I picked up a few strange looks running backwards and forwards across the road looking at the old railway cutting from both sides of its bridge. It's nice to sort out things like that, even if I never write the thing.

[Foreverlad]

The problem with that scenario is that their nation is a very isolated island (the other landmasses are nothing more than myth). Although I've revised up the size (it's something about the size of Greenland now), it still doesn't seem that there is something natural that no one has discovered, as they've covered the land pretty well. So it would have to be something like a unique combination of plants.

The impetus is that Shrenik's mother is a green-eyed and his father is a yellow-eyed, so they were horribly disappointed to have a brown-eyed son. That isn't unheard of, of course, but his mother is slightly off her rocker due to her feline bondmate dying. She wants Shrenik to have a feline (sort of live vicariously thing), but only blue-eyed males can bond felines. Which is all proving rather difficult to work into the story, as I nixed Shrenik's "opening chapter" as it was rather clunky and delayed the real start of the book.

Hmm...fun problems! It's been so long since I've had to plot (I outline insanely, so I've been in pure writing mode for like a yaer now), I've almost forgotten how!

When you think about contact lenses, they're thin...well, lenses, that improve eyesight. Any reason the father can't have a brilliant idea and slice or chemically reduce (insert animal here) bladder or intestine very thin, dye it, and sew it into a dish shape? near translucence + color would do the trick.

Going that route, you can add weakness: your character's eyesight is slightly impaired, almost foggy, due to the makeshift contacts covering his corneas.

[Ebenstone]

Back to titles for a second. Being an English teacher, I'm big on motifs and I notice them in my writing....a lot. My titles reflect that. Winter's Discord is part of a series I've dubbed "Seasons of Destiny" and each of the titles reflects the season: Winter's Discord, Spring's Tempest, Summer's Sacrifice and Autumn's Glory. Unintentionally, the first two books have a Shakepearean bent to them too. The "Summer" book has changed names several times and I keep joking that I'm going to have to split the book...therefore completely screwing up the continuity of having one book for one season!

I'm at yet another crossroads with Sisters of Khoda. This damn book doesn't know what it wants to be. I've got to try and nail it down or I'm just going to abandon the project and move on to a different one. It's frustrating. The beginning of school, and the district mandated changes, have put a real damper on my writing, but I'm figuring I'll get the balance down right sooner than later. I may save this plot monkey that's jumping around for NANO (a sure way to kill a project for me).

As for Winter, I got a rejection today that was nice, but still felt like a punch in the gut. Not trying to burn bridges, but the agent said this:

"You're a talented writer, and there is a lot to admire about this ambitious novel. In the end, though, I'm afraid that I am just not the right fit for the book, having a limited and taste for this type of story. It's a credit to your writing that I got pulled into it as I did. Fiction is so subjective; I'm certain you'll find an agent who can get behind your work with the enthusiasm it deserves and encourage you to keep writing."

Nice, but frustrating.

Anyway, there's where I am....don't mean to hijack the great discussion about eye colors. I think the alchemical way might be the right path. Though there may be nothing wrong, if it fits in the context of the story and you world, with a Faustian deal by the mother. An old but effective trope.

[Alaerien]

My friend just sold her debut novel to Doubleday for over half a million dollars.

There is no secret handshake. Unknown authors do sell. :)

[Zoë Sumra]

Good for her. :)

[Myrddin]

That's great news, Alaerien. Let us know when your friend's book is coming out.

My own progress lately has been... stunted. Part of it is my relunctance to keep sending out agent queries until I figure out how to cut more out of my manuscript, part of it is waiting on beta reader feedback, part trying to figure out how to incorporate current feedback, and partly having trouble trunking this novel to start writing my next one (which is now researched and roughly outlined).

Oh and I'll probably (hopefully) be moving back to the States soon, so I've been doing all the fun stuff that international moves require.

One bit of feedback I've recieved from beta readers actually ties in to feedback on my query: How does part 1 really tie-in to the rest of the novel? Is it about escorting the heir to the imperial capital or him returning to his homeland and the mystery that awaits him?

Part 1 involves a traveler escorting the imperial heir back the capital on his way home and hilarity ensures. I mean, and he starts seeing clues about the great mystery he'll be spending the book unraveling. THings like huge spectral hounds, a crazy woman in a haunted wood, and a secret society that worships a demon. The beta reader wanted to know what happened the heir (who only makes a brief cameo later, since her story won't be resolved until later books) and didn't really catch the clues enough to connect them to later revelations. Not good.

Last night, insomia hit, and I thought of a solution to the story problem, though it does nothing to help the high word count (currently 178k). It involves taking another main character who really doesn't get started until chapter 22 and instead start her story around chapter 4. Introduce her and the world the traveler returns to earlier and start laying the ground work for what the traveler finds when he returns home. Also this shuffling of characters and events would downplay the heir's overall role (delete around 6 chapters) and give the heroine more page time and give her more scenes with the traveler before they part ways (add 4 more chapters), with an additional 2 chapters to condense/restructure the trip with the heir.

Anyway. Sorry for the ramble. Trying to make sense of it and determine if it'll actually fix anything or just waste my time rewriting 6 new chapters and tweaking 9 others to fit the new continuity.

Or should I just trunk the novel for now, write the historical fantasy I've been researching/outlining (which will be shorter and more publishable), and come back

to this monster later.

Not sure yet. I have a second interview with a company in NC to prepare for on Friday...