The Death Penalty

[The Evil Hat]

I never said I believe there are murder genes passed down,

Okay, I'd agree with you.

I said I do not want their genes passed down.

Uh, why? You just said that you don't think it matters, so why do you then go on to say we should do it anyway?

Lack of reading comprehension and all that.

:shocked:

[Tyrellius]

:lmao: :lmao:

I missed the Yuku-bomb?

[The Mance]

Not to pile on, but I spent a lot of time cutting and pasting....

Eugenics

Eugenics is "the study of, or belief in, the possibility of improving the qualities of the human species or a human population by such means as discouraging reproduction by persons having genetic defects or presumed to have inheritable undesirable traits

You do understand that when you say....

I want murdering pieces of crap executed before they can continue breeding.

or

I said I do not want their genes passed along

.....that is pretty much exactly what is meant by "discouraging reproduction by persons presumed to have inheritable undesirable traits", right? All thats missing from the textbook definition of eugenics is an intent to improve our species.

I am not trying to improve the human species in any way by denying them the right to breed. It is not Eugenics.

So, you just want that particular brand of crazy removed from the gene pool because of..... what, aesthetics? Balance in the Force, what?

[sologdin]

if propensity to commit murder is not heritable, then the disputed statements are still consistent insofar as they hearken for an easier time when felonies resulted in both the death penalty and the attainder of descendants, with confiscation of all property by the state.

it's very old testament--visiting the fruits of crime on the fourth generation, and suchlike.

but, yaknow, evolving standards of decency that mark the progress of a maturing society, &c.

[Lord O' Bones]

I admit, Chanur, that I did indeed fail in my reading comprehension. I foolishly assumed, like I imagine did the rest of my poorly-read comrades, that you had a reason to say that based on science, or arcane lore, or something. Not as it turns out purely from spite.

Apologies, apologies, apologies.

I can only hope that your presence will usher in a new era of competency to this stagnating towards insipidity, forum.

[DrownedCrow]

I am not trying to improve the human species in any way by denying them the right to breed. It is not Eugenics.

Dude, you should have just embraced the eugenics label rather than tying yourself in knots trying to avoid it. What with recent advances in genome sequencing and analysis, a rational eugenics policy might actually be possible. Although your proposed method of selecting inferior biological specimens is crude at best.

[Spastic Plastic]

Does anyone know what Chanur is talking about? Is he telling me he has a big penis? Am I being hit on?

He was hitting on me, and only me. Don't be such a jealous girl.

You also seem to suffer from a terrible lack of reading comprehension.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Chanur,

If you aren't "attempting to improve the human species" why stop murderers from having children?

[Lord of Oop North]

Because logically their children will grow up and seek vengeance against the state.

We can't be in the business of creating rebels. They might decide to topple over our guillotine, and then we'd be fucked!

[Ocean of Notions]

Because logically their children will grow up and seek vengeance against the state.

We can't be in the business of creating rebels. They might decide to topple over our guillotine, and then we'd be fucked!

We should probably take it a bit further just to be safe. At what generation should we stop the executions?

[Spastic Plastic]

At their great-great-grandkids, maybe. The previous generations deserve to be executed by abortion while still in the womb, preferably live on TV.

[Lord of Oop North]

We should probably take it a bit further just to be safe. At what generation should we stop the executions?

Great-grandchildren sounds fine. Also, we should look into exterminating their ancestors, as well. I suggest execution by time-traveling guillotine.

[Ocean of Notions]

What about cousins?

And LoON, I'm not sure how I feel about screwing with the time-space continuum, despite for a good cause.

[The Evil Hat]

But if we kill the descendants with a time travelling guillotine, the reason we were killing them will cease to exist, so there will have been no reason to kill them, so we'll be murderers. I don't think that state can just kill people. No, much better to just exterminate the line for ever after while letting the past stay in the past.

[Old Nan]

I'm in support. Death is the least cruel of all punishments, as it cannot be remembered.

[Ocean of Notions]

I'm in support. Death is the least cruel of all punishments, as it cannot be remembered.

So... if we can figure out how to make people forget it, torture is acceptable?

[Old Nan]

Possibly, though I'd say removing the memories of a still-sentient being is a torture all of its own. And I have no real interest in sci-fi ethical hypotheticals, really.

[JungianQueen]

(Coming to the debate late)

This is a tough one for me. I could get all sanctimonious and start sputtering off "I'd never," and "It's so inhumane."

But I also believe that there are some crimes that are unforgivable, that are worthy of the death penalty. Certainly, my conscience works against me when I think about the fact that some innocent people may be sitting on death row now, might have been executed in the past. And I imagine the various methods of execution (past and present) and how truly horrific they are--despite how "humane" they are made out to be. I also know how messed up our justice system is (on so many levels). It's not just black and white for me.

As a mother, I cannot say for sure that I could take the higher road if someone sexually assaulted/murdered my child. Maybe I'd kill the S.O.B. myself if I had the chance, maybe I'd want him executed, maybe not. But, I think it's a bit obtuse for me personally to sit here and say, "oh, no, never would I agree with the death penalty." I have ideals and aspirations to be a thoughtful, compassionate member of society. But, I am also not an automaton.