[Book Spoilers] EP110 Discussion

[straphe]

Awesome. Just simply awesome. And the dragons are beyond fantastic. I'm so glad the CGI team could make them look so effing real, man. And Emilia Clarke... Even though she was more "broken" in the series than in the books, she did rise up as a queen, ruling over all of them. And Drogon hissing and flapping his wings was a really nice move. Loved it.

The King in the North scene just came out of nowhere, but I have to say, it was powerful. And Theon, making his oath is just heartbreaking. Poor kid. Jaime's and Cat's scene, however... I'm not so sure. I know D&D plans on moving Jaime's story along at a faster speed, but having the "There are no men like me. There's just me" line here and now makes me think that his escape will be succesful early in the second season. But then no Jaime & Brienne scenes, at least until they hook up later on, supposing that they do. Ehh...

Pycelle's scene was hilarious. I'm not a big Ros fan, by now we know her inside and out, and some of her scenes could've been cut or shortened, but if she takes on the role of Alayaya (I sooo love writing here name down, Alayaya, Alayaya) I'm gonna be more than fine with that. Gives Ros some meaning.

[iheartseverus]

Hey!!! Hahaha yeah. I was looking at his teeth and thinking OW NURSING OUCH.

Um. So who was it who died early? Did I miss something? I was trying to watch in a loud breakroom at work.

Ran popped into the thread earlier to say that it was Marillion that GRRM had been referring to and that either GRRM had gotten confused about Marillion's fate in season 1, or the script had been later changed (to having his tongue ripped out.) Someone else then came in with an interview with D&D wherein they were asked why they moved Marillion into season 1 and they basically said they 'couldn't resist.' So, my take on the whole thing is, he'll still be 'available' later at the Eyrie, if/when needed, just won't be doing any singing...

[ZombieWife]

I don't mind Roz, but was that her with Pycelle? I thought Roz had darker hair and was less vapid-looking.

[Monday]

The scenes were kind of hit or miss for me in this episode. Sophie nailed it, Maisie too. The Lancel/Cersei scene made my day..."when you were young" :lol: Lena's expression was priceless. Dragons were great. Dany was great

....but the wig survives to see next season. Boo.

I think this is the first nitpick I've ever voiced, but I was actually really disappointed that they kept the hair. For me the bald head was an exclamation point at the end of her transformation in aGoT (I suppose the dragons played a part in that too ;) ) It highlights her other-worldliness, it's iconic in the series. Right? Riiiight?

.... Maesterobics....

:lmao:

Is it just me or has this Shae essentially become Tyrion's Yoko Ono?

:lol:

ETA- KiTN scene felt off. Rushed? Anti-climactic?

[iheartseverus]

I don't mind Roz, but was that her with Pycelle? I thought Roz had darker hair and was less vapid-looking.

Really? Isn't she a redhead?

[Marsala]

The only thing that I felt was a bit underplayed was the Mirri Maz part where you realize she was at fault for Drogo's festering wound/death, then his creepy return to life. I remember feeling so utterly betrayed when reading the book and in the series adaptation, she came across as so sympathetic. Perhaps it's just a testament to the actress who played Mirri.

Was Mirri responsible for Drogo's wound going bad in the book? There, it was a much more serious wound from the beginning and Drogo stopped using her poultices and went with significantly less sanitary ones made by the Dothraki. In the book, I got the impression that Mirri was helping him at first and never directly betrayed Dany but rather gave her what she wanted until it led to destruction.

In the show, it was a small scratch that barely bled (actually, it should have bled much more) and shouldn't have gotten infected so badly without betrayal.

[fitheach]

I don't mind Roz, but was that her with Pycelle? I thought Roz had darker hair and was less vapid-looking.

Yeah, Roz looked tired in that scene (or bored), none of her usual sparkle and toothieness. I imagine working as a whore for LF and spy for Varys is exausting.

(That and all the negative posts she's been getting, must be keeping her up at night...:rolleyes:)

[Lady Blackfish]

ETA- KiTN scene felt off. Rushed? Anti-climactic?

One because of the other, IMO. I really missed the mixture of the plea for peace in with the cries for war and independence. I also thought that Jaime's scene lost a lot of oomph the way HBO did it here.

But I adored Sophie and Emilia in this episode though, they really upped their game and especially Sansa's scenes stood out to me. Jon's part was well done, but honestly that's no surprise since HBO clearly has *got* that character from the start. Bran and Arya scenes were heartbreaking, Tyrion scenes were fine. I think it was a nice episode with some good to great parts, but like last week I feel like these parts could be put together into a more artful whole.

[Spring Bass]

I just finished watching it, and I'll probably re-watch it again. Mostly because my HBO GO was having issues, so I watched it on the Xfinity main website. That was a mistake - it was constantly freezing on scenes, something that I've never had happen over at HBO's site. It seems to have sorted itself out, so I'll give it another watch.

I liked

• 
  
• Daenerys's emotion at the whole situation. She genuinely came across as upset and distraught, including with Miri Maz Durz (the witch woman). The only thing that felt off to me was the witch's lack of emotion. In the book, she's genuinely angry and upset, particularly in the description of how the previous three Dothraki warriors raped her by mounting her like a "dog mounts a bitch" or something like that. Her line to Daenerys, about how life is when everything else is gone, is a gut-punch. That said, she almost made up for it with her death, where she transitioned from singing to screaming when the fire got her.
  
  
• Daenerys's ending and the dragons. I was worried that the dragons would seem too cheesy, but I think they did a good job with them. I particularly loved how it ended with the dragon cries, just like the final line in the book (about how after hundreds of years, the night was full with the music of dragons).
  
  
• Jon's ending. Props to Mormont, who was great in his scenes. The final shot of Jon and Mormont's narration was my favorite character arc ending in this episode.
  
  
• All the scenes with Robb and Catelyn. The best scene in the episode, in my opinion, was the scene where grief-stricken Cat embraces grief-stricken Robb. I was almost teary-eyed myself.
  
  
• Sansa's scenes. Sansa in the film is definitely an improvement on Sansa in the books. My third favorite scene was the instant when she almost pushes Joffrey off the ledge, but gets pulled back by the Hound. He then tells her, "Save yourself a lot of pain" or the like, but you know he's not just talking about further beatings.
  
  
• The spat between Littlefinger and Varys. It's always great to see Westeros's "spiders" fighting each other with veiled insults, boasts, and threats.
  
  
• Theon . . . there's not a lot I can say, other than that it's going to seem tragic. I hope they do his storyline right.
  
  
• Tyrion was good with Tywin, as usual. You can still tell that his father terrifies him, but he's also pleased at getting his father's praise and need.
  
  
• Poor Arya. She's got so much crap coming, and she never gets home. And yes, short-haired Arya is a cute little kid.
  

I was pretty meh towards

• 
  
• Jon's scenes. I really think the scene where he gets rounded up by his brothers was too short. It wasn't helped by the fact that he did not seem that upset - he needs to be angry. They murdered his father! He is a bastard with no name, no mother, and now not even a father.
  
  
• Shae. She's better than last episode, but she still feels kind of off.
  
  
• Bran's scenes. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the whole thing felt underwhelming. Maybe it was just the fact that Rickon wasn't as upset, or that we don't have as much
  of a connection with Maester Luwin (he's close to Bran in the books).
  
  
• Pycelle's sexposition. It was somewhat interesting to hear him talk about the Kings he's served, but still a rather slow scene.
  

All in all, a good ending to Season One.

On to Season Two! I'm particularly looking forward to it because it's based on A Clash of Kings, which is my favorite book in the entire series.

[SnowBastard]

Did anyone else catch the green wildfire flame in the "play resumes" bit?? Nice nod to the readers!

[Spring Bass]

Now I understand the Pycelle scene. I've got to re-watch that episode again, without the damn freezing of scenes. On to HBO GO!

[The Knight of Grasses]

My wife, a non-reader, after the Joffrey-Sansa scene: Who gets Joffrey?

Me: I don't understand.

Wife: Who kills King Joffrey? At then end. Somebody's got to do it. Is it Robb? Who?

Me: Nobody kills him. He lives.

Wife: You mean he wins? Jesus, what did you show me this thing for?

Me: You know, you've been very sick, and you're taking this show very seriously. I think we better stop now...

Well, the conversation didn't go EXACTLY like that. But my wife, who is just about the most nonviolent person you would ever meet, wished aloud for Joffrey to die a very gruesome death after she saw that scene (which was fantastically done - my second favorite scene of the episode, behind "King in the North"). My response to her was appropriately coy.

[Brewmaster]

Truly awesome. I promise I'm not this kind of person, but I was quite literally getting up and fist pumping multiple times this episode. I'm really quite calm and collected watching TV, but when I saw dragons, I was up swinging my fists and saying "fuck yeah!"

Shaggydog and the King of the North also inspired fist pumps from me.

I will say this though, THIS EPISODE MADE ME FEEL LIKE AN ASSHOLE! Never again will I dislike Sansa when I read Game of Thrones. How could you see her on the wall and not have your heart break?

As somebody that is generally in the Cat/Sansa dislike in of the spectrum when it comes to the book, both characters are much more sympathetic to me in the show. Cat, particularly. My eyes were tearing up when she walks into the woods and breaks down, after maintaining control walking through her troops. The show has actually done a better job with her, IMO. I remember reading once that GRRM was surprised at the amount of dislike readers had for Cat. I wonder if he didn't suggest a few changes to improve on that. She's not drastically changed, but you get more of the sense that she's a tough woman in the show that didn't come across (for me) in the book. She didn't feel deserving of Ned, truth to be told. She does, in the TV show.

Another point on Cat tonight that I didn't see mentioned (though I'm only up to page 9 of this thread) is the foreshadowing of Lady Stoneheart. That look in her face when she says "and then we will kill them all..." is planting the seed for Lady Stoneheart. There may be some changes there, I bet its not a 3 day old corpse that comes back, but Lady Stoneheart's "mission" was solidified right there in that scene.

I also was starting to wonder/worry that she might be releasing Jaime right there when she had that conversation with him. But they held off, and he didn't finish what he had to say about Bran. I expect they'll have a series of conversations next season now...

The Tywin and Tyrion scene was fucking nails. Tywin looses his shit over losing Jaime and Tyrion is truly baffled that he treats him like his son for the first time.

And did I mention Dragons? Fucking Dragons? That was great. Yeah, yeah, they didn't burn off her hair...who cares. She woke up with excellent (and I dare I say even cute) looking baby dragons nursing at her breast. Drogon screeching on her freaking shoulder, the first birthing of dragons in hundreds of years.

Poor Theon...Poor unspoiled watchers...They are really setting up the non-readers to be betrayed. He went down on his knee and practically busted out with Aragorn's "If by my life or my death I can help you with your quest..."

LOL @ Hot Pie.

THE KING OF THE NORTH!

[julandro]

Okay, yeah, we got dragons...but guys, way more importantly...

WE GOT NAKED LANCEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Where the hell is julandro?!

Thanks HBO for showing the ass beautiful Eugene Simon.

I am eagerly awaiting the second season. Without a doubt, show the sex scenes.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

I like Catelyn a lot more in the show then in the book, she was annoying in the book.Sansa is sorta the same to me, I sympathized with her in the book a lot too.

[Spring Bass]

Blarg. HBO GO must be getting hammered with people watching, because it's freezing too (again, this has never happened before when I was using it). I'll try again tomorrow afternoon.

[A'shaman]

Just want to pop in and say the dragons were amazing, and thanks to Drogon for my new avatar :D :D :D

[Lord Godric]

Blarg. HBO GO must be getting hammered with people watching, because it's freezing too (again, this has never happened before when I was using it). I'll try again tomorrow afternoon.

Clearly you didn't try to get the episode a week early did you? HBOGO has many bugs they have yet to work out.

[Lord Godric]

Okay, I have one nitpick (we're allowed those once in a while right?). When Tyrion said that his father was the "richest man in the whole country" I cringed. It just sounded so out of place to hear of Westeros, the Seven Kingdoms, be referred to as a country. Perhaps I was the only one bothered by it. But it was like nails on a chalkboard for me.

That is the one problem I have with the episode, which means it was as close to perfection as possible.

[CloudFlare]

Awesome episode, and season!

Jack Gleason really stood out in this episode. He played Joffrey the confident/crazy way I always read him in the books. Sophie Turner has been getting a *lot* better as well.

Ros: I am beginning to think she's going to be an 'escape hatch' for the writers. If the show goes a full seven seasons they may need some way of transferring knowledge from one character to another. She'll probably boff Joff next just to keep their options open.

Overlooked Detail from the Books I: In the books King Robert talks about how the women in KL wear silk due to the heat. Ros's outfit fit that description. I thought that was a nice touche.

Overlooked Detail from the Books II: Pycelle getting jiggy wasn't totally out of character. He did sleep with his serving girl in the book, which would indicate he's still got some sap left in him. He's been at KL forever, so it's not unreasonable that he's learned to play the game by staying under everyone else's radar.

Everything else was just pretty damn awesome.

Edit: Cersei bedding seemed a little off. In the books it took until season 2 for that to come to light. I can see her finding the need for a replacement Jaime, but you would think it would take longer. Jaime and Cersei have always had long breaks in their relationship due to privacy issue.