The Official Appreciation Thread for Sansa, Queen in the North v. 2

[Grail King]

Hmm. Well I know that red dye was added, but would this automatically make the sword represent "fire"? It's a Lannister color, it wasn't intended to represent fire.

I just read that Ice stood around 6 feet tall, roughly (as tall as a grown man).

It is said and I forget where that Valaiyrian swords have a memory so to me it would come back as ICE, unless ICE is a reforge of a prior Sword ( Lightbringer)?

I lean ever so slightly that Light Bringer is the Watch and the LC, ICE is my close second.

[Zmeischa]

Hmm. Well I know that red dye was added, but would this automatically make the sword represent "fire"? It's a Lannister color, it wasn't intended to represent fire.

I just read that Ice stood around 6 feet tall, roughly (as tall as a grown man).

No dye was added, in fact, the new colour was unexpected.

To continue on from your crackpotting, if Ice isn't reforged, then the smaller sword Widow's Wail would be a good step up from Neddle for a certain little girl.

I don't think Arya would want a step up from Needle. It is her sword, after all.

I'm in two minds about Sansa. I want her to be Queen in the North, but I can't see her with the sword. She is... not a sword person.

[Grail King]

I really think it would have to be a strong wargger and as much as I like Sansa to come full circle and bad ass, I think we are more likely looking at Bran he will fly, Arya has the Nymeria pack thing going.

So I think Dany, Bran and #3 ??

[Silmarien]

No dye was added, in fact, the new colour was unexpected.

I don't think Arya would want a step up from Needle. It is her sword, after all.

I'm in two minds about Sansa. I want her to be Queen in the North, but I can't see her with the sword. She is... not a sword person.

No, dye is added. And specifically asked for by Tywin, and carried out by the forger.

Tyrion IV, ASoS

"The colors are strange," he [Tyrion] commented as he turned the blade in the sunlight. Most Valyrian steel was a grey so dark it looked almost black, as was true here as well. But blended into the folds was a a red as deep as the grey.

skip some stuff

"I confess, these colors were not what I intended, and I do not know that I could duplicate them. Your lord father had asked for the crimson of your house, and it was that color I set out to infuse into the metal."

Above, Tobho Mott, the armorer, is speaking. He infused a dye into the swords.

[headtrip_honey]

No, dye is added. And specifically asked for by Tywin, and carried out by the forger.

Tyrion IV, ASoS

skip some stuff

Above, Tobho Mott, the armorer, is speaking. He infused a dye into the swords.

Or some chemical intended to change the color of the blade, at the very least, if not a traditional "dye"

[littlespider]

I called her such, here it is. I think it would be epic.

As to the theories floated about lately, my personal opinions:

1. Dragon-warging:

---I give a big thumbs up to this idea! This would definitely float with me. To me I could see Sansa being very happy at having the freedomof flying away as a dragon. I mean, caged bird no more? I think it would please her. In general I would much rather her having something to do with a dragon rather than........Tyrion, for example. (sigh).

And I would like to expand on this theory. I think the three dragons currently alive will be ridden by "reincarnations" of the first three famous riders: Aegon, Rhaenys, & Visenya who came and took over Westeros. I think obviously Drogon + Dany make the pair of Aegon and his dragon - they are the conquerors, the leadership of the pack. I could easily see Sansa riding/warging Rhaegal, as the "new" Rhaenys - she seems to resemble the Rhaenys herself. SEE HERE. Younger, pretty, graceful, more playful than stern... mmhmm.

So if the theory is correct, then we need a "Visenya" candidate to ride Viserion. SEE HERE.

I would find it very interesting since all the dragons that were hatched were considered "male" if the three dragon riders were all female. But it's probably not necessary.

2. Sansa, the Virgin Queen:

I give this a thumbs down. No, it's not a bad idea, but honestly I would be very disappointed with this reality at the end of the series. For me despite all the naivete breaking incidents Sansa has endured over the books, I want her to retain quite a bit of who she started as, the things tha make her her. And for me this includes being somewhat of a romantic. Clarifying, I don't want her to be dependent on a man/woman, but I would like for her to have a loving companionship with someone who is dear to her. I very much want Sansa to have power if that's what she decides on. I would like to see her "Independent". But I would be saddened if she never got close to any one. I just would.

Visenya sounds like the spitting image of Arya. In fact, I can't think of any other woman in the series who would fit her better. (Brienne is a warrior, but doesn't have the same temperament.) Arya needs to come back, darnit, and Sansa needs to absorb a little of her ferocity, and Arya a little bit of Sansa's tact.

Now as to the VQ. Elizabeth was certainly a romantic, and the whole "I'm a virgin" thing was possibly true, but also quite possibly a genius PR schtick. She did seriously consider marrying a couple of times, and it's likely that she would have had she not seen her sister's marriage seriously fuck up Mary's reign (but in all fairness, Mary was a bit fucked up to begin with). But Elizabeth had her long time favorite, Robert Dudley -- and probably would have married him if her counselors had not basically said "ok, you go do that. Then you'll get booted from the throne." I see where you are coming from about Sansa retaining a bit of that girlish romantic. The romantic part is already getting suppressed as she's gradually realized that she's considered a desirable object for her claim, and she thinks she'll never marry for love.

Is it akin to Jon snow having to "kill the boy" to let the man grow? This is possible. But it's also possible that the dreamy romantic side of Sansa could emerge in having her man/men (like POD) on the sly but not marrying, or, since she's such a fan of the songs, in her patronage of the arts. I know the second option sounds kind of silly, but this is one of the things Elizabeth is known for so well, and it would sorta kinda dovetail with the young Sansa's interest in the songs. Though I would guess that Queen Sansa would have developed a strong interest in tragedy by the time she gains the throne.

Of course, the other side: she could do all of these things and keep a man-harem in her basement. Actually this is my preferred option. You can never go wrong with a man-harem.

[headtrip_honey]

Or as Alexia suggested to me once: Have lots of suspiciously tall grey-eyed puppies, and just say, "I bed down with direwolves" a la the HBIC Mormont women.

[Silmarien]

Visenya sounds like the spitting image of Arya. In fact, I can't think of any other woman in the series who would fit her better. (Brienne is a warrior, but doesn't have the same temperament.) Arya needs to come back, darnit, and Sansa needs to absorb a little of her ferocity, and Arya a little bit of Sansa's tact.

Now as to the VQ. Elizabeth was certainly a romantic, and the whole "I'm a virgin" thing was possibly true, but also quite possibly a genius PR schtick. She did seriously consider marrying a couple of times, and it's likely that she would have had she not seen her sister's marriage seriously fuck up Mary's reign (but in all fairness, Mary was a bit fucked up to begin with). But Elizabeth had her long time favorite, Robert Dudley -- and probably would have married him if her counselors had not basically said "ok, you go do that. Then you'll get booted from the throne." I see where you are coming from about Sansa retaining a bit of that girlish romantic. The romantic part is already getting suppressed as she's gradually realized that she's considered a desirable object for her claim, and she thinks she'll never marry for love.

Is it akin to Jon snow having to "kill the boy" to let the man grow? This is possible. But it's also possible that the dreamy romantic side of Sansa could emerge in having her man/men (like POD) on the sly but not marrying, or, since she's such a fan of the songs, in her patronage of the arts. I know the second option sounds kind of silly, but this is one of the things Elizabeth is known for so well, and it would sorta kinda dovetail with the young Sansa's interest in the songs. Though I would guess that Queen Sansa would have developed a strong interest in tragedy by the time she gains the throne.

Of course, the other side: she could do all of these things and keep a man-harem in her basement. Actually this is my preferred option. You can never go wrong with a man-harem.

Cool point about Arya! I like the 3 dragon riders being ladies. And Needle is kinda like Dark Sister, no?

[headtrip_honey]

My biggest desire is for all the women in this series to turn the Westerosi political system on its head and to motherfucking RULE like it's no one's business.

The three dragonriders being ladies would be excellent, per this desire.

The ladies in this series are the best, tbh.

[littlespider]

My biggest desire is for all the women in this series to turn the Westerosi political system on its head and to motherfucking RULE like it's no one's business.

*high five*

Men fuck everything up when they try to enter politics, gawd!

[brashcandy]

*high five*

Men fuck everything up when they try to enter politics, gawd!

Oh yes!

What Robb could have learned from Dany: Having sex is one thing, marriage is another.

What Joffrey learned from Margaery: There's only so much shit you can spread until you end up choking on it.

What LF will learn from Sansa: Mixing business with pleasure will cost you the game every time, daddy dearest.

[littlespider]

The men are all dumb sluts too. Seriously, I lost so much respect for their abilities as rulers when they just fucked all these nasty-ass women.

[Silmarien]

My biggest desire is for all the women in this series to turn the Westerosi political system on its head and to motherfucking RULE like it's no one's business.

The three dragonriders being ladies would be excellent, per this desire.

The ladies in this series are the best, tbh.

I agree (well.....not Cersei, of course, but she's the only real exception).

[Hound's She-wolf]

I agree (well.....not Cersei, of course, but she's the only real exception).

I dunno, I think it would be friggin awesome to have a totaly cracked Cersei on dragonback. KL would be toast, she would spend all day picking off Tyrells and Sparrows.

[Lemon Cake]

Arya needs to come back, darnit, and Sansa needs to absorb a little of her ferocity, and Arya a little bit of Sansa's tact.

...and a little bit of Sansa's self-control too, although to be fair I think self-control might be the one good thing Arya is learning from the FM.

Seriously, though, yes YES YES to this comment. More than any of the other Stark kids, I think Sansa and Arya are the ones who need to find each other the most. I hope all the Stark kids, including Jon, are reunited eventually, but I would honestly be happy to give up any other Stark reunions if it meant Sansa and Arya would definitely meet again.

[Slacker]

First of all, Rickon is still alive..! so if Sansa wishes to be the "Queen of the North", she'll have to... take care... of her baby brother first..!

Yes, Sansa doesn't know he's alive.. but if Sansa suddenly comes out saying "Hey guys, I'm Sansa Stark. Winterfell and the north is mine!" then word would sooner or later reach little Rickon who'd like to see his sister again... I know I would if I thought my entire family had been killed and then a lost sister pops up...

Bran is slowly turning in to a tree (so to speak), Jon is on the wall (and still a bastard, since Robs will is most likely gone), Arya is training to become a Faceless One.. and Rob is dead... BUT little Rickon is still alive, and a boy/male and thus before Sansa in the line of succession.

[headtrip_honey]

First of all, Rickon is still alive..! so if Sansa wishes to be the "Queen of the North", she'll have to... take care... of her baby brother first..!

Yes, Sansa doesn't know he's alive.. but if Sansa suddenly comes out saying "Hey guys, I'm Sansa Stark. Winterfell and the north is mine!" then word would sooner or later reach little Rickon who'd like to see his sister again... I know I would if I thought my entire family had been killed and then a lost sister pops up...

Bran is slowly turning in to a tree (so to speak), Jon is on the wall (and still a bastard, since Robs will is most likely gone), Arya is training to become a Faceless One.. and Rob is dead... BUT little Rickon is still alive, and a boy/male and thus before Sansa in the line of succession.

I have a deep deep desire that the Dornish way of dealing with succession will spread to the rest of Westeros.

And anyway, Rickon is off on Skagos with a wildling woman. Do you think he'll really have the skills to be able to navigate court politics?

I personally want Sansa to claim the North, and when he's old enough, Rickon can be her battle commander and/or Lord of the Dreadfort. Mmm, Shaggydog and the Dreadford. Me like.

[Lemon Cake]

Even assuming Rickon survives the series and becomes either the King in the North or the Lord of Winterfell, the fact remains that he will at the very least need a regent for many years, until he's matured and has had the necessary training to fulfill his role. Enter Sansa. And I see no reason why she couldn't call herself Queen in the North while she was regent; after all, Cersei is regent but is called Queen. Not that I want Sansa to be like Cersei in any other way, I'm just sayin'.

[Alexia]

I see where you are coming from about Sansa retaining a bit of that girlish romantic. The romantic part is already getting suppressed as she's gradually realized that she's considered a desirable object for her claim, and she thinks she'll never marry for love.

Which seems like it could make it very likely for her to make a mistake. She wants to be loved -- that's all that Sansa really wants. And with somebody like Sandor, who she knows wanted her and not her claim, she might easily say "eff all the rest of you" and marry him, or publicly take him as a lover (a la Dany). Which would be a mistake... but a very believable one.

Of course, the other side: she could do all of these things and keep a man-harem in her basement. Actually this is my preferred option. You can never go wrong with a man-harem.

:agree:

First of all, Rickon is still alive..! so if Sansa wishes to be the "Queen of the North", she'll have to... take care... of her baby brother first..!

Maybe Rickon's (that unknown, half-crazed wildcard) purpose in the plot is to show how Sansa or Jon (because I think one of the two will end with Winterfell in the end, at least I hope so) has become much colder by snatching the kid up, claiming Winterfell, and cutting him out of his inheritance and making him swear to one of them as a bannerman. Maybe he'll get the Dreadfort from one of the two. ;)

[SelaBela]

That's what I mean by not being sure how this could be done convincingly. She'd have to start warging things pretty much right now to be in any shape to get control of a dragon in ADOS.

But she's so sweet natured maybe she'll tempt Rhaegal with treats and kisses, and then have a vicious dragon with a pink bow tied around his neck, eating out of her hand? I could see that...

A pink bow would look much better on Viserion IMO :D