The Official Appreciation Thread for Sansa, Queen in the North v. 2

[SelaBela]

That still skeeves me out. I mean, picturing poor Sophie Turner (who plays Sansa on the HBO series, and is 15) with George Clooney is pretty disgusting to me. He could be her grandfather!

(He is 50 years old).

ETA: I don't think Mance is anywhere near as old as George Clooney. Probably closer to 30. Actually, it's possible to start graying quite young. My uncle started going gray by age 17.

Eeep! I didn't realize he was that old. I was thinking of Clooney in his Batman movie... but still... I can see how that would still be kinda skeevy.

[Lemon Cake]

Eeep! I didn't realize he was that old. I was thinking of Clooney in his Batman movie... but still... I can see how that would still be kinda skeevy.

That's okay, imagining him in the role definitely makes Mance Rayder more interesting to me. ;) But yeah, he'd be waaaaaayy too old for any romantic scenes with Sophie Turner. But then, so are McCann, Dinklage, and Gillen. :ack:

[Candor]

Who's your choice here?

Arya was who came to mind! But if it's going to be a man my guesses would be Jon or Jorah. Or Stannis!

Yeah, you see I don't want Tyrion on a dragon... Soz Tyrion.

[Candor]

Visenya sounds like the spitting image of Arya. In fact, I can't think of any other woman in the series who would fit her better. (Brienne is a warrior, but doesn't have the same temperament.) Arya needs to come back, darnit, and Sansa needs to absorb a little of her ferocity, and Arya a little bit of Sansa's tact.

Now as to the VQ. Elizabeth was certainly a romantic, and the whole "I'm a virgin" thing was possibly true, but also quite possibly a genius PR schtick. She did seriously consider marrying a couple of times, and it's likely that she would have had she not seen her sister's marriage seriously fuck up Mary's reign (but in all fairness, Mary was a bit fucked up to begin with). But Elizabeth had her long time favorite, Robert Dudley -- and probably would have married him if her counselors had not basically said "ok, you go do that. Then you'll get booted from the throne." I see where you are coming from about Sansa retaining a bit of that girlish romantic. The romantic part is already getting suppressed as she's gradually realized that she's considered a desirable object for her claim, and she thinks she'll never marry for love.

Is it akin to Jon snow having to "kill the boy" to let the man grow? This is possible. But it's also possible that the dreamy romantic side of Sansa could emerge in having her man/men (like POD) on the sly but not marrying, or, since she's such a fan of the songs, in her patronage of the arts. I know the second option sounds kind of silly, but this is one of the things Elizabeth is known for so well, and it would sorta kinda dovetail with the young Sansa's interest in the songs. Though I would guess that Queen Sansa would have developed a strong interest in tragedy by the time she gains the throne.

Of course, the other side: she could do all of these things and keep a man-harem in her basement. Actually this is my preferred option. You can never go wrong with a man-harem.

And I see the possibilities of still being the VQ but having "X" off to the side, but damn it, the notion still doesn't satisfy me. I want her to be able to be open about what/who makes her happy. :P

Though for anyone else a secret man harem wouldn't disappoint.

[Grail King]

Arya was who came to mind! But if it's going to be a man my guesses would be Jon or Jorah. Or Stannis!

Yeah, you see I don't want Tyrion on a dragon... Soz Tyrion.

I did a follow up on that where I explained why as much as I like Sansa (and I do) it's not her, and Arya is busy with the Nymeria pack, if you really think it may be three females (outside two max) you have to look some where else, Brienne maybe I think if there's going to be a stark more likely Bran, Jon's to busy in the wall morphing, Rickon a no show and I wouldn't trust him with dragons he has enough problems with Shaggy.

So if I split the difference with you I see either, Dany, Bran, Brienne?? or Dany, Bran, #3 total ????.

[Grail King]

Eeep! I didn't realize he was that old. I was thinking of Clooney in his Batman movie... but still... I can see how that would still be kinda skeevy.

So ladies tell us how you feel about cougars.

[Silmarien]

So ladies tell us how you feel about cougars.

Well, Cersei immediately springs to mind (she did seduce her 16-17 year old cousin). She is nowhere near as old as George Clooney, though.

[Grail King]

Well, Cersei immediately springs to mind (she did seduce her 16-17 year old cousin). She is nowhere near as old as George Clooney, though.

Ok so Cersei is a rapist and poor George is being paired to a 15 year old without his consent LOL you gals got warped minds.

Through out history it looks like older men paired with young girls (I didn't say younger I said young) which to me has always been well less than kosher.

And I sort of feel the same way if roles were reverse.

[Grail King]

Arya was who came to mind! But if it's going to be a man my guesses would be Jon or Jorah. Or Stannis!

Yeah, you see I don't want Tyrion on a dragon... Soz Tyrion.

I was just reading the riders of dragons and Sarella Sands was brought up, she be more likely than Sansa, Arya or even Brienne.

[mor2]

what do we know about sansa character?

[Grail King]

what do we know about sansa character?

Naive, kind, at least now not physically aggressive (Though there are hints she can be), can be spoiled, manipulative, caring, has a strong inner strength that she hides wants people to love/ like her for herself not her title very feminine .

[voodooqueen126]

Which seems like it could make it very likely for her to make a mistake. She wants to be loved -- that's all that Sansa really wants. And with somebody like Sandor, who she knows wanted her and not her claim, she might easily say "eff all the rest of you" and marry him, or publicly take him as a lover (a la Dany). Which would be a mistake... but a very believable one.

:agree:

Maybe Rickon's (that unknown, half-crazed wildcard) purpose in the plot is to show how Sansa or Jon (because I think one of the two will end with Winterfell in the end, at least I hope so) has become much colder by snatching the kid up, claiming Winterfell, and cutting him out of his inheritance and making him swear to one of them as a bannerman. Maybe he'll get the Dreadfort from one of the two. ;)

This is actually why I would prefer Sansa not to end up as Lady of Winterfell/Queen of the North, but instead to be Rickon's regent (and call herself Queen regent or get a moninker like the Queen of Ice), because as Lady of Winterfell she would have to marry one of her bannermen to maintain her position, or end up as the Virgin Queen (which is frankly sucky, because even if she takes lovers, she can't have children). Where as the Lady of the Dreadfort, but made powerful by her position as Rickon's regent, Sansa can marry Sandor, without it being a colossal mistake.

[Raksha the Demon]

That's okay, imagining him in the role definitely makes Mance Rayder more interesting to me. ;) But yeah, he'd be waaaaaayy too old for any romantic scenes with Sophie Turner. But then, so are McCann, Dinklage, and Gillen. :ack:

I imagine that if the TV series gets to ASOS, then the Tyrion/Sansa wedding night will be watered down considerably, since young Ms. Turner will still be less than 18; not that I mind; they can still convey Sansa's fear and revulsion without showing all the skin. I thought the scene was well-written in the book, but I don't need to see the unhappy pair naked on television to appreciate it.

I would think that Sansa would be able to deal much better with a bridegroom 10-12 years her senior when she is 17 or 18; she was much too young to be married to anyone, much less Tyrion, at 12. Of course, it's even worse for poor little Jeyne Poole, since she's handed over to a brutal serial killer; Tyrion wasn't perfect, and his remark about desiring Sansa sexually even while knowing she was a child makes me squeamish, but he wasn't in Ramsey Bolton's league.

[Alexia]

I'm wondering if for the wedding night, they will have Tyrion proposition her fully clothed without making her strip, or simply have him tell her that he thinks she's too young and he plans to wait. I tend to think the first because the other one will water down his brand of chivalry too much. It'll be interesting to see -- that was an absolutely horrible scene in the books.

[Alexia]

This is actually why I would prefer Sansa not to end up as Lady of Winterfell/Queen of the North, but instead to be Rickon's regent (and call herself Queen regent or get a moninker like the Queen of Ice), because as Lady of Winterfell she would have to marry one of her bannermen to maintain her position, or end up as the Virgin Queen (which is frankly sucky, because even if she takes lovers, she can't have children). Where as the Lady of the Dreadfort, but made powerful by her position as Rickon's regent, Sansa can marry Sandor, without it being a colossal mistake.

She could claim to bed down with direwolves. ;) Or she could name Rickon's son or daughter her heir.

[Grail King]

I'm wondering if for the wedding night, they will have Tyrion proposition her fully clothed without making her strip, or simply have him tell her that he thinks she's too young and he plans to wait. I tend to think the first because the other one will water down his brand of chivalry too much. It'll be interesting to see -- that was an absolutely horrible scene in the books.

I would think so, but by that time she may be 16 and lots of movies had females nude at that age, I really hope that doesn't happen as the imagination and suspense would be stronger but this is HBO.

[Alexia]

I would think so, but by that time she may be 16 and lots of movies had females nude at that age, I really hope that doesn't happen as the imagination and suspense would be stronger but this is HBO.

She's British, though. According to my understanding, Daenerys was aged up to 18 because it is illegal to show minors in sex scenes in England. And I'm given to understand that they can't do a body double for her that young, either.

We'll see though. Honestly, I hope they don't. That scene was horrible enough on the page without having getting to see it verbatim. And they didn't depict MMD being raped on the screen either...

[Grail King]

She's British, though. According to my understanding, Daenerys was aged up to 18 because it is illegal to show minors in sex scenes in England. And I'm given to understand that they can't do a body double for her that young, either.

We'll see though. Honestly, I hope they don't. That scene was horrible enough on the page without having getting to see it verbatim. And they didn't depict MMD being raped on the screen either...

Olivia Hussey was 16 when she did Romeo and Juliet, Brooke Shields real young when she did pretty baby, Thora Birch 16- American Beauty, Kiera Knitely - 16 the Hole?? Jane Marsh 17 - The Lover

Shields, and Marsh were older men and young girls so it's not like it hasn't been done, but I'm not totally knowing of British law as I'm on the other side of the pond.

[Hound's She-wolf]

Alexia's right, from what I understand, neither the actress nor the character can be under a certain age, hence Dany's character had to be aged up for the show. It will still be a super creepy scene even with Sophie fully clothed.

[Alexia]

There are some folks over in the TV forums who actually know a lot about it. I'm basically parroting them from conversations a couple years back, but if you want to ask someone who actually knows what they are talking about you should make a post in the TV forum. ;)

Another thing to keep in mind though, is not all actors are willing to do nude scenes and none of the Stark children were cast with that in mind (as opposed to Dany). So I'd be surprised if we end up getting a nude scene out of any of them, ever (even when they are all growed up and filming ADOS).