The Killer Snark Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 Just started reading Lord of the Rings for the first time, and am sure it's probably been brought up before, but: Common Speech/Westron = Common Tongue/Westerosi, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anarcho Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Rhaegar and Lyanna have already been compared to Paris and Helen, but there's a couple of other similarities between Robert's Rebellion and the Trojan War:- Tywin's Sack of King's Landing is basically the Trojan Horse but without the horse.- A single battle down to a personal duel between Robert and Rhaegar also happened in the Trojan War with Achilles and Hector.Tolkein homages:- For me, Valyrian steel seems to be a homage to Tolkien's mithril. Both are the strongest, most valuable metal in existence, but in both cases, no more can be produced; both Valyria and Khazad-dum have been lost and are very dangerous to go to.- If L+R=J turns out to be true, this LOTR line from Denethor will be very fitting: I will not bow to this ranger from the north!- Lightbringer seems to me like a homage to Narsil/Anduril.Someone's already claimed that the inspiration for the Red Wedding was something else, but for me it's reminiscent of the St Bartholomew's Day Massacre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drowned God Posted August 9, 2013 Share Posted August 9, 2013 Rhaegar and Lyanna have already been compared to Paris and Helen, but there's a couple of other similarities between Robert's Rebellion and the Trojan War:- Tywin's Sack of King's Landing is basically the Trojan Horse but without the horse.- A single battle down to a personal duel between Robert and Rhaegar also happened in the Trojan War with Achilles and Hector.Tolkein homages:- For me, Valyrian steel seems to be a homage to Tolkien's mithril. Both are the strongest, most valuable metal in existence, but in both cases, no more can be produced; both Valyria and Khazad-dum have been lost and are very dangerous to go to.- If L+R=J turns out to be true, this LOTR line from Denethor will be very fitting:- Lightbringer seems to me like a homage to Narsil/Anduril.Someone's already claimed that the inspiration for the Red Wedding was something else, but for me it's reminiscent of the St Bartholomew's Day MassacreI always saw Valyrian Steel as a reference to Damascus steel: sharp, high-quality, and the secret of its production has been lost to a collapsed empire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasick Drake Posted August 10, 2013 Share Posted August 10, 2013 At the end of a spaghetti western called Django Kill, a.k.a. If You Live, Shoot, which is something of a cult classic, one of the villains gets his comeuppance when he tried to retrieve his ill-gotten gold from his house as it burns down in a fire. Well, he gets it - it's gone molten, and it pours down all over his head. When I first saw Game of Thrones I was reminded of this moment before I'd read the first book. It's my opinion Martin may have lifted it. There's also the story of a conquistador called Pedro Gutiérrez de Valdivia, who was allegedly killed by being forced to drink molten gold, and I think a Greek myth that refers to someone suffering the same. Gold being poured down his throat is how Marcus Crassus was meant to have been killed by the Parthians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Killer Snark Posted August 10, 2013 Share Posted August 10, 2013 That's right. That's what I was thinking of; the incident is alluded to in Purgatorio by Dante. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Posted August 13, 2013 Share Posted August 13, 2013 Castellan, I think Martin took the image from norse mythology.Here´s one of my posts about that.Yes that tale sounds like an influence but it made me think of Cersei trying to ensure the crown stays with her rather than Westeros in the abstract. Cersei has surrounded herself with small people in the belief they cannot threaten her but they are exploiting her. They could be the three Kettleblacks and Taena. In one of the scenes with Taena, Cersei dreams she is chained up in a dungeon and Tryion or a dwarf who reminds her of him bites off her nipple, or something like that. Definitely has her breast being gnawed off which reminds me of this vision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julios Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 Lewis Tully is a character in the Ghostbusters movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First of My Name Posted August 19, 2013 Share Posted August 19, 2013 90% percent chance this is a coincidence, but in the Nintendo DS game Pokémon SoulSilver Version, there is a fisherman named Tully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lykos Posted August 19, 2013 Share Posted August 19, 2013 First of My Name, it could have been a reference to Game of Thrones by the game developers, but I´m sure it´s the Tully-Fisher relation they were thinking of.I´m fairly certain Martin wasn´t thinking of astronomy though. I think he named Hoster Tully after Tullus Hostilius, though I would like to think that he was also thinking of the Tullifield, a shire in germany that is mentioned quite often in medieval history. Of course that´s my german bias. (Here´s a link to the german wikipage.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conmaicne Mara Posted August 19, 2013 Share Posted August 19, 2013 First of My Name, it could have been a reference to Game of Thrones by the game developers, but I´m sure it´s the Tully-Fisher relation they were thinking of.I´m fairly certain Martin wasn´t thinking of astronomy though. I think he named Hoster Tully after Tullus Hostilius, though I would like to think that he was also thinking of the Tullifield, a shire in germany that is mentioned quite often in medieval history. Of course that´s my german bias. (Here´s a link to the german wikipage.)Tully is a pretty common Irish surname. Originates from my home county of Galway. One of my best friends is a Tully. It means "flood" in Gaelic, which is interesting as the ASOIAF Tullys are based in the Riverlands. If I recall correctly, their coat of arms has 3 wolves heads on it and their motto is something to do with unity and strength, so a bit more Stark-ish than Tully-ish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lykos Posted August 19, 2013 Share Posted August 19, 2013 Conmaicne Mara, that makes a lot of sense. I was looking for the etymology, but somehow I only got the page now when typing Tully etymology into google. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morienthar Posted August 20, 2013 Share Posted August 20, 2013 - If L+R=J turns out to be true, this LOTR line from Denethor will be very fitting:- Lightbringer seems to me like a homage to Narsil/Anduril.Someone's already claimed that the inspiration for the Red Wedding was something else, but for me it's reminiscent of the St Bartholomew's Day MassacreSmall nitpick Jon's not a Ranger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Its probably been pointed out in one of the history threads, but Cersei's walk of shame derives from Jane Shore's walk of penance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey family reunion Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) Now that this thread is reaching 60 unwieldy pages, has there been any thought about restarting this topic in three different threads? One thing that I've noticed is Martin's homages range the gamut from actual historical events to mythology/folklore to literature and even a smattering of pop culture. One thread can be devoted to actual history, another thread to mythology and folklore while a third thread can reference his literary and pop culture references. Just a thought anyway to make this topic more reader friendly. Edited August 21, 2013 by Frey family reunion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First of My Name Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Now that this thread is reaching 60 unwieldy pages, has there been any thought about restarting this topic in three different threads? One thing that I've noticed is Martin's homages range the gamut from actual historical events to mythology/folklore to literature and even a smattering of pop culture. One thread can be devoted to actual history, another thread to mythology and folklore while a third thread can reference his literary and pop culture references. Just a thought anyway to make this topic more reader friendly.I don't know about 3 new versions, but after 1178 posts, a new one would be be welcome I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mushroomshirt Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 Now that this thread is reaching 60 unwieldy pages, has there been any thought about restarting this topic in three different threads? One thing that I've noticed is Martin's homages range the gamut from actual historical events to mythology/folklore to literature and even a smattering of pop culture. One thread can be devoted to actual history, another thread to mythology and folklore while a third thread can reference his literary and pop culture references. Just a thought anyway to make this topic more reader friendly.A fourth category could be references and homages to GoT or aSoIaF that appear elsewhere. I posted something elsewhere about a GoT reference in the TV show Parks and Recreation and the mods moved it here. So this thread has turned into really a grab bag of any reference to or by aSoIaF and GoT, even though the OP was specifically about references and homages appearing in aSoIaF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey family reunion Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 I don't know about 3 new versions, but after 1178 posts, a new one would be be welcome I guess.The main reason I suggested dividing the thread up is to streamline the threads a little bit. It's become apparent to on second and third rereads that the sheer number of references and homages he puts in his books are massive. Also I'm personally more interested in the number of both overt and subtle references and homages to mythological tales within the books, and I think a thread incorporating these references deserves to stand on its own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenedstark Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) “We fought the Unsullied at Astapor,” the big man said. “I said real Unsullied. Hacking off some boy’s stones with a butcher’s cleaver and handing him a pointy hat don’t make him Unsullied. That dragon queen’s got the real item, the kind that don’t break and run when you fart in their general direction.” .. Edited August 21, 2013 by thenedstark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First of My Name Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 (edited) ..:rofl: I knew I recognized that from somewhere when reading it! Edited August 21, 2013 by First of My Name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanes_son Posted August 21, 2013 Share Posted August 21, 2013 When Jaime is meeting with the Freys and Lannisters outside where Edmure Tully is being threatened with hanging, he says 'this is a war council, not a war' I'm wondering if it is a reference to the no fighting in the war room scene in Doctor Strangelove.I suspect this has been pointed out before :uhoh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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