Danny's hate for Starks...permanent?

[smallfolktypeperson]

I would think that what she heard from Jorah wouldn't resonate so much with her now, since he admits he fled Westeros because he planned to sell some men to the slavers (poachers, was it? I can't recall exactly). Given her view about slavery at this point, and Jorah's proven untrustworthiness, you'd think she'd go back and chew over what he had to say about Ned some more.

[jarl the climber]

It would have been hard for her to make a peace with Ned Stark but hes dead. With Robb dead you have the four living kids and Jon Snow. I think her initial reaction will be somewhat condescending even if she is willing to be open minded. She will see the Starks misfortunes as being the product of their betrayal of her Father. She, in her infinite goodness will forgive them and agree to send help for the Wall that may or may not ever arrive and will take a year or two to get there in any event. This is assuming that Marwyn gets there and tells her about the situation at the Wall and the downfall of house Stark, Jon as Lord Commander and Stannis is there with a skeleton army. She will think initially that she can take control of the North with a few thousand men and potentially have the Bastard of Winterfell as its ruler. She will be well disposed to towards Jon because of his freindship with Jorahs Father, Maester Aemon and Sam Tarly whose Father she regards highly.

By the time she actually gets to Westeros the situation will be completely different and probaly shatter her earlier hopes.

[mcb]

Im not disputing its justification. My point is, she and her brother suffered greatly from it. They arent going to look at those events logically and unbiased. Its easier for people who have not suffered from it, to look at it logically. All they see is a bunch of dead family members at the hands of the "Usurper" and his "dogs".

Let's consider another family that has suffered greatly during the Robellion. Ned lost his father, his brother, his sister. And yet the last time he has given the Targaryens any thought, was when he stood up to his king and best friend, trying to save Daenerys' life. After that, it's fucking hard not to feel disappointed with Dany's attitude.

[eggs]

Thats like telling Arya that Freys arent bad people. Or telling the Martells that Lannisters are decent folks She will probably be cool if she meets one and keeps hearing good stuff about them. Like Jon and Tyrion

the difference being that the starks are actually good.

[Son of the Smiling Knight]

''It's not the time.'' And when is it time, then? She's had enough time as far as I'm concerned, and Selmy tried to bring it up a couple of times but decided not to go through with it. In those particular instances, he's a coward to me, and Daenerys is acting like a five-year old. It is past time she realized. She knows her father wasn't all good, but she doesn't realize the consequences yet.

He will tell her when she's anywhere close to the Starks or any other House in Westeros. The situtation they are in at the time is pretty dire and telling her that her family was crazy doesn't help that

[Kienn]

If I remember correctly every time Barristan has started going into details about Aerys or the Starks he is interrupted pretty quickly.

Saying Dany is stubborn or ignorant etc is just kind of dumb, she hasn't been in a situation to deal with the Starks so until then the issue hasn't been urgent to get better info than what her brother told her.

If she lands on Westeros and runs into Rickon and lops his head off before getting the story... then you can call her ignorant.

[eggs]

Dany is by definition both stubborn and ignorant. She doesnt have to take action to be a brick.

[Ame]

Unfortunately I would say never; whatever Tyrion says is poison he is a man who comes with advice related to being willing to kill civilians with your enemies like poisoning wells who failed the game of thrones; murdered his father and brags about it; worst in Dany's view killed an innocent woman and shows no public remorse, was convicted of kinslaying a child in court and in trial by combat etc.

Tyrion telling her the Starks are good would be like Theon Greyjoy telling the Martells Wildlings are good after killing Balon; it just won't come with any credibility because the Martells will have superficial knowledge about Theon's past including his killing children and father.

The only Targaryan who was alive relatively recently who Dany wants to hear about is Rhaegar; she doesn't want to learn her father was a nutjob or that Ned Stark was the most honorable man in the realm or that the wealth of Lannisport will make reconciliation with them much easier then conquest. She might not even be on her way to Westeros.

[The Broke Howard Hughes]

When the hell is someone going to reveal to Danny that the Starks are actually freaking awesome and very in line with her beliefs?? I like both her and the starks but I'm tired of her talking trash on them every time they are brought up. I mean really all Barristan has to do is be like hey... your dad freaking murked Brandon and Ned's dad and made them watch each other's cruel deaths....for no reason. She would actually agree with everything the Starks did in the past, and what they've done in the war of the five kings. They are honorable and often just and i'm not talking stannis just.

They care for the sanctity of children (tons of examples of this with Robb and Ned)

They aren't all about money aka they care for the greater good not just the good of their house

They obviously aren't about slaves and are open to helping those who are weak and who can't help themselves (Jon' shows this with helping the wildlings)

I mean really it's just ridiculous she has these preconceived notions. I get Viserys has brain washed her but I mean they call her dad the MAD KING and she knows Viserys was a loser... you think she'd use a little deductions and ask a couple questions about WHY the rebellion happened... at this point.... She's either dumb or feigning ignorance.

In all honesty i think it's hight time Ser Barristan manned up, and told her what's good with her Dad and that the stark's are chill.

*I also know a lot of this stuff that aligns the starks with Danny's beliefs isn't common knowledge at this point but people are loyal to the Starks in the north for a reason...they inspire respect and loyalty through their actions all throughout history and if Danny poked her nose into just a little history instead of talking to her hand maids once and while she might figure this out.

Now I agree with you, but....

If you're raised to belive a certain thing it's sometimes hard to just push those preconcieved notions aside and believe something different Even if it is obvious. I believe once Dany gets to Westeros she'll learn the truth about the Starks and reshape her opinion. Her biggest fault to date is she makes decisions about Westeros and the people in it without having once been there. Once she gets the whole story, the unfiltered unedited version she'll have to face up to the facts, maybe not wholly but enough to move from being the blind idiot to someone simply guilty of making snap judgments but is trying to be better.

[Sasha Steelsong]

Let's consider another family that has suffered greatly during the Robellion. Ned lost his father, his brother, his sister. And yet the last time he has given the Targaryens any thought, was when he stood up to his king and best friend, trying to save Daenerys' life. After that, it's fucking hard not to feel disappointed with Dany's attitude.

Ned is a 35 (or so) year old man who lived through the events. Dany is a 14-15 year old girl, with no real knowledge of what happened. How on earth can you say she should be at the same place? At 35 you've lived enough to see the various shades of grey. At 14-15 you're just starting to see that the world is not black and white. And as has been pointed out, the last time she thought of the "Usurper's Dogs," she immediately started reflecting on her own actions and realizing she wasn't totally innocent herself. Not to mention she was ready to listen to Barristan before Hizdar interrupted at which point she got married and had the whole mess in Meereen as her top priority (understandably an army at your gates will have most of your attention, not the actions of people a decade and a half ago even if it did majorly impact your life).

[Bran Swift]

I've always wondered how she would respond to the fact that Ned threw himself on the line to try to save her from Robert's assassination attempt.

Like any character, she is flawed. I think Dany is reasonable so she may change her opinion if the facts are presented in the right way. Then again, the Starks may be her stubborn point, much like Ned's refusal to talk about Jon's mother.

[eggs]

^What? Dany is 17 with tons of life experience. You make her sound like some innocent child.

[TheMysteriousOne]

^What? Dany is 17 with tons of life experience. You make her sound like some innocent child.

Almost 17

[Faint]

I think this is pretty fair. At this point, there's no need for her to like them, and equally, they have no good reason to like her, either. If she never ends up liking them, frankly I see it as a big fat, "... So?" It's not as if the Starks actually have a use for her or require her assistance, so I'm not really going to clutch my pearls wondering if she won't like them. They don't owe her anything, including their fealty. And she doesn't owe them anything either.

I actually think she does owe them recompense. And, oddly enough, if Jon decides to take that mantle, so does he. The Starks, on the other hand, I do not think owe the Targaryens anything, because their rebellion basically amounted to self-defense and was just. The aspects of it that were wholly unethical did not involve the Starks at all. As for those crimes, Daenerys and/or Jon will have to take them up with Casterly Rock.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I've always wondered how she would respond to the fact that Ned threw himself on the line to try to save her from Robert's assassination attempt.

I'm pretty sure that Barristan explained exactly this to her and she was unmoved.

[mcb]

Ned is a 35 (or so) year old man who lived through the events. Dany is a 14-15 year old girl, with no real knowledge of what happened. How on earth can you say she should be at the same place?

You know, that's a fair question: how can I? And actually, did I?

At 35 you've lived enough to see the various shades of grey. At 14-15 you're just starting to see that the world is not black and white.

She was way better at it when she was two younger. Back then, she at least knew that Viserys was full of shit.

[Faint]

What is probably going to end up happening is that Tyrion is going to confront her with the truth, because he honestly will not be able to help himself, and Barristan is going to grudgingly confirm everything. At that point, she is going to dig out all the information that Barristan and Tyrion have on the subject and come away shell shocked (albeit, somewhat mitigated by Rhaegar in comparison to her father).

[Theda Baratheon]

Soon, I fucking well hope; I'm fond of Dany but if I have to read ''USURPER'S DOGS'' one more bloody time...

[Blackaz01]

How and why are people comparing what the freys did to the starks and what the starks did to the targs?

As far as history goes the starks really didn't do shit to them until the mad king killed Brandon and his father and Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna (not proven to be 100% the case but as far as history goes in westeros its the general consensus) and this is compared to the boltons and freys turning cloaks on their liege lord and breaking guest rules? I could understand if you said Dany will never forgive the Lannisters for betraying her father or Robert and the Baratheons for killing Rhaegar. But as far as the starks are concerned her family started it.

Oh and as far as forgiving them goes? She will have to or she will die.

[TheMysteriousOne]

How and why are people comparing what the freys did to the starks and what the starks did to the targs?

As far as history goes the starks really didn't do shit to them until the mad king killed Brandon and his father and Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna (not proven to be 100% the case but as far as history goes in westeros its the general consensus) and this is compared to the boltons and freys turning cloaks on their liege lord and breaking guest rules? I could understand if you said Dany will never forgive the Lannisters for betraying her father or Robert and the Baratheons for killing Rhaegar. But as far as the starks are concerned her family started it.

Oh and as far as forgiving them goes? She will have to or she will die.

What did the Starks do to the Freys before Robb became king? What did the Freys do to the Starks before that also? Nothing. The Targaryens did nothing to the Starks before Aerys and the RR, so I don't see why you think they aren't comparable?