Bridgeburners Posted July 3, 2013 Share Posted July 3, 2013 I feel pretty alone in saying that I really hated Tyrion for what he did to Shae at the end of aSoS. I know a lot of people don't respond very strongly to that, because Shae was a minor character, and a lot of people felt that she "had it coming". But to me, he was still completely unjustified in murdering her, even if I was upset with her betrayal. In the end, the way I see it, he murdered a poor innocent girl who didn't deserve it, and I see her as collateral damage in Tyrion's sour mood from his earlier conversation with Jamie.Now the TV show is doing a much more thorough job in developing Shae's character and making her likeable. I have a feeling that when she is forced into her situation in court to testify against Tyrion, the TV fans will have the sympathy for her that I did when I read it. And when/if Tyrion kills her, the TV fans will see it as the despicable act as I did, and be as disillusioned with Tyrion's character as I (and surely some others) were.Right now, there's mixed feelings about Tyrion altogether among the book fans. Because TV Shae is much more developed and likeable, do you think the TV fans will despise him a lot more than the book fans did after he kills her? Is it possible that the TV producers will make the writers kill her some other way, in order to maintain fan appeasement of Tyrion's character? (I certainly hope that's not the case; this series should be renowned for its lack of black and white characters.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qhorin Fivehands Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 First off you have a fantastic profile pic. Secondly, when Shae testified against Tyrion I practically begged for her death, but I do think there will be a lot of sympathy for her when she dies, and many people will rethink their undying love for Tyrion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingInTheCave Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I feel pretty alone in saying that I really hated Tyrion for what he did to Shae at the end of aSoS. I know a lot of people don't respond very strongly to that, because Shae was a minor character, and a lot of people felt that she "had it coming". But to me, he was still completely unjustified in murdering her, even if I was upset with her betrayal. In the end, the way I see it, he murdered a poor innocent girl who didn't deserve it, and I see her as collateral damage in Tyrion's sour mood from his earlier conversation with Jamie.Huh? She lied in her testimony about Tyrion and Sansa knowing full well that they will both be killed if they get convicted. How the hell is she innocent?As to Tyrion, I'm actually very worried that the show runners might change some of his actions in SoS and DwD so that people continue to love their favorite imp Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mountain That Flies Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Huh? She lied in her testimony about Tyrion and Sansa knowing full well that they will both be killed if they get convicted. How the hell is she innocent?Because she would have been tortured and killed if she didn't. While bein in Tywin's bed kind of cemented her as a backstabber to most readers, her testimony was really an act of self-preservation. Not exactly lilly white innocence, but no worse than some of the things Tyrion himself does.The the OP, TV auidiences probably need to see the darker side of Tyrion on full display. It becomes very easy to root for the guy even when reading the books, and Peter Dinkladge being as charming as he is makes him a very likeable character. Tyrion goes to some rough mental places in ADWD, and I don't think TV auidiences will buy that without seeing the hands of gold getting very cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingInTheCave Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Because she would have been tortured and killed if she didn't. While bein in Tywin's bed kind of cemented her as a backstabber to most readers, her testimony was really an act of self-preservation. Not exactly lilly white innocence, but no worse than some of the things Tyrion himself does.Do we even know that for sure? She could have easily lied about Cersei forcing her to testify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mountain That Flies Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Do we even know that for sure? She could have easily lied about Cersei forcing her to testify.No, we can't be certain of anything she says, and unfortuantly Cersei's POV never clears the matter up for us (though it's clear even Cersei was surprised at Shae being in Tywin's bed). I suppose it greatly depends n whether Cersei & Co. knew about Shae and Tyrion's relationship already, or Shae was being questioned as one of Sansa's maids and spilled the beans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Luke. Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 poor innocent girl First off, I strongly disagree that Shae was some poor innocent girl. That's exactly what she was pretending to be. But regarding your post, I'd say audiences are going to be a bit shocked, given that we've seen very little of Tyrion's darker nature on the TV show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weeping Sore Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 First off, I strongly disagree that Shae was some poor innocent girl. That's exactly what she was pretending to be.But regarding your post, I'd say audiences are going to be a bit shocked, given that we've seen very little of Tyrion's darker nature on the TV show.If Shae testifies against him in the trial and shows up in Tywin's bed, I think the audience will turn against her pretty hard. It will be a shock, but the audience will continue to like Tyrion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruella Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I doubt that Cersei even had to threaten her - I think it's pretty clear what happens to whores who don't do as they are bid by queens. I don't see why Shae would have more loyalty towards Tyrion than any other john, since his whole involvement in her life came to taking back jewelry and clothes he gave her, fucking her a lot, and slapping her in the face for rather innocent joke. Would be stupid of her to have some personal loyalty to him, and he was stupid to be upset. She was a victim of his need for self-delusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen of Whores Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 As to Tyrion, I'm actually very worried that the show runners might change some of his actions in SoS and DwD so that people continue to love their favorite imp Jesus.This is the funniest thing I've read all day. On a serious note though, I too have these concerns. It would be kind of a monumental deviation if they changed it, and would forever change Tyrion's character for the worse. He needs to have done some bad shit so that people are conflicted on their views of him. Right now, The Borgias has more morally ambiguous characters than Game of Thrones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingwholostthenorth Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm thinking they might change this in the show. Maybe hanged by Tywin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Don of Kanonji Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I don't know I never really liked Shae to begin with.She always gave me the sneaky bitch vibe, so, when she crossed Tyrion at the end it just reaffirmed my suspicion and I was more than glad to see her go.Made me like Tyrion more truth be told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steinnis Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Shae publicly humiliated him with all her lies, and 'my giant' comments. She probably was forced into it by Cersei, but people might actually sympathise with Tyrion about it. It depends how they portray it. Plus he also finds her in bed with his father, of all people, who ridiculed him for years about 'whores'.I didnt have much sympathy for her tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Glokta Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I could somewhat understand Tyrion.I mean, she didn't have to mention the 'Giant of Lanniser'-part, especially since she was the one who came up with it, that was cruel. And than the fact, that he found her in his father's bed, who has scolded him so many times for frequenting whores, was what set him in rage.It would call it a classical case of, most certainly wrong place and wrong time.edit:He came there to kill his father, if she would have screamed she would alerted Tywin and the guards.edit2:I'm also very curious, about how the producers will decide to adapt this part. With the way they have been whitewashing Tyrion in season 3, it will come as quite a shock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jentario Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I think it will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JagLover Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm thinking they might change this in the show. Maybe hanged by Tywin.Agreed, to give a reason for Tyrion to kill him when he escapes. The setup in S3 seems to be pointing this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeburners Posted July 8, 2013 Author Share Posted July 8, 2013 Huh? She lied in her testimony about Tyrion and Sansa knowing full well that they will both be killed if they get convicted. How the hell is she innocent?As to Tyrion, I'm actually very worried that the show runners might change some of his actions in SoS and DwD so that people continue to love their favorite imp Jesus.I meant "innocent" in the sense that she didn't deserve to be murdered. If we can cast the label of "innocent" off anybody we deem did something wrong, then in a sense, nobody is truly "innocent".I don't think I ever said that I agree with Shae's actions. I may have said I sympathized, but I should have emphasized that it's only to a small extent. I too, like most readers, felt betrayed when she testified against Tyrion, and again when she was found in Tywin's bed. I wish she chose to go about her course differently, though understand the limitations of her leeway. Still, that's a different issue from how I feel about Tyrion killing her, which I still think is monstrous and completely unjustified. I find it strange that a lot of readers decide that, because they (like myself) think Shae was in the wrong, that automatically dismisses Tyrion's decision to strangle her. This is not the case at all to me. I still see him as having killed an innocent girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaphodbrx Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Golden boy isn't going to kill Shae. Open your eyes, show is different from book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingInTheCave Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Maybe on the show Tywin kills Shae after he finds that Tyrion brought a whore to KL, so Tyrion kills him in return.Something like that would be terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onna Lewyys Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I will be absolutely shocked if B&W have Tyrion kill Shae. They are way too big of Tyrion fanboys to ever allow him to do something so morally dark as that, especially after changing Shae from an uncaring, opportunistic gold-digger to a woman who turns down a literal bag of diamonds because she loves Tyrion and Sansa so much.Hell, they didn't even let Cersei do a lot of the horrible things she does in the books, like having Robert's bastards killed and sending Ser Mandon to kill Tyrion, because it would have apparently made her too unsympathetic. Instead, they gave those actions to Joffrey.So I simply just don't see them having the guts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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