Isn't Varys's next step to find Gendry?

[Cold-King]

On the other hand I don't see Aegon giving the Baratheons another chance since they were directly responsible for his family's downfall. JonCon will more likely be Aegon's choice for Storm's End

JonCon is a dying man, and in the upcoming book im sure this will become apparent to Aegon in some way or another, but JonCon knowing hes doomed regardless, i could see him doing some selfless act, like a much needed suicide mission thats vital for the cause, or taking a "bullet" for Aegon himself, who knows, granted i do think JonCon will possibly run it for a while, or play a part in holding it, but his days are numbered, so its just a matter of time before someone else gets the position!

[RumHam]

I was under the impression their initial successes were due to the element of surprise, and of course, the fact that no individual StormLord commands a massive force. After losing on the blackwater, the Stormlords swore fealty to Tommen/Joffrey and went home- I though. So ever since ACOK, there has been a reasonable force in the Stormlands minus a strong Baratheon to unite them and rebel again.

Yeah I guess many of their troops went home to harvest, but not all. Bonifer Hasty and his Holy Eighty-Six come to mind.

[Fae Boleyn]

Like others have said, Edric is of more use than Gendry in a situation like this, though anyone who's seen Renly will recognize Gendry right quick as a Baratheon, including Stormlords. Look at how Brienne reacted to Gendry.

But Edric is still Robert's only claimed child (he seems to have acknowledged Mya when he was young after a fashion by never denying her, but he never officially claimed her as he did Edric). And while JonCon and Aegon may not be thrilled at restoring any Baratheon to anything, Aegon at least could probably be convinced if it will get him Stormlord support.

However, that lord who paid for Gendry's apprenticeship? I don't think it's ever been confirmed to be Varys, but we know his penchant for disguises, we know he knew about Gendry, it makes sense that it was him. And I doubt he went to the trouble just to have more proof of Cersei's kids' paternity; Gendry's about Robb's age, Ned thinks, so by the time he would have been apprenticed there's Mya in the Vale and Edric at Storm's End, two bastards already safe. Also, someone tipped off Tobho Mott to get Gendry out of KL; again, probably Varys because who else knew about Gendry and wasn't dead like Jon Arryn, locked up/dead like Ned, or indifferent like Stannis? So he wanted Gendry alive for something. Possibly as a backup should Edric die; in which case Mya is probably noted for that too.

It's suspected, after all, that Varys is the one holding Tyrek Lannister; I wouldn't put it past him to be building a collection of backup heirs to Houses to have Aegon-supporters around.

[aryagonnakill]

Like others have said, Edric is of more use than Gendry in a situation like this, though anyone who's seen Renly will recognize Gendry right quick as a Baratheon, including Stormlords. Look at how Brienne reacted to Gendry.

But Edric is still Robert's only claimed child (he seems to have acknowledged Mya when he was young after a fashion by never denying her, but he never officially claimed her as he did Edric). And while JonCon and Aegon may not be thrilled at restoring any Baratheon to anything, Aegon at least could probably be convinced if it will get him Stormlord support.

However, that lord who paid for Gendry's apprenticeship? I don't think it's ever been confirmed to be Varys, but we know his penchant for disguises, we know he knew about Gendry, it makes sense that it was him. And I doubt he went to the trouble just to have more proof of Cersei's kids' paternity; Gendry's about Robb's age, Ned thinks, so by the time he would have been apprenticed there's Mya in the Vale and Edric at Storm's End, two bastards already safe. Also, someone tipped off Tobho Mott to get Gendry out of KL; again, probably Varys because who else knew about Gendry and wasn't dead like Jon Arryn, locked up/dead like Ned, or indifferent like Stannis? So he wanted Gendry alive for something. Possibly as a backup should Edric die; in which case Mya is probably noted for that too.

It's suspected, after all, that Varys is the one holding Tyrek Lannister; I wouldn't put it past him to be building a collection of backup heirs to Houses to have Aegon-supporters around.

A minor note here on timing, Gendry is significantly older than Edric. There is also the fact that Varys may simply have not wanted an innocent teenager to die for no reason. If Gendry had wound up on the wall there is no way in hell he would ever be called back to be king or lord.

[Fae Boleyn]

A minor note here on timing, Gendry is significantly older than Edric. There is also the fact that Varys may simply have not wanted an innocent teenager to die for no reason. If Gendry had wound up on the wall there is no way in hell he would ever be called back to be king or lord.

Edric's between ten and twelve, yes? Book!Gendry's about Robb's age; it's not so huge a gap that Edric would have been unborn by the time Gendry's apprenticed. And we don't know Varys said send him to the Wall; but the Night's Watch recruiter is a fast way out of town if all Tobho knew was "you want to get him out". If he did, well... KG vows can be broken, why not NW? He's not the only one to think it.

I think Edric is Varys' first choice anyway should there be a need for a Baratheon (or possibly he wanted to nab Shireen but never got the chance), but having a couple more Baratheon bastards secure can't hurt.

Varys not wanting an innocent teenager to die, after what he saw happen to Rhaenys and... the kid in Aegon's cradle... is also true, but why has he shown at least passing interest in Gendry twice now? If he knew about him, odds are he could easily have found out about baby Barra too, but no one tipped off her mother. I figure he's stacking the odds as best he can in terms of having backups in his pocket.

[aryagonnakill]

Edric's between ten and twelve, yes? Book!Gendry's about Robb's age; it's not so huge a gap that Edric would have been unborn by the time Gendry's apprenticed. And we don't know Varys said send him to the Wall; but the Night's Watch recruiter is a fast way out of town if all Tobho knew was "you want to get him out". If he did, well... KG vows can be broken, why not NW? He's not the only one to think it.

I think Edric is Varys' first choice anyway should there be a need for a Baratheon (or possibly he wanted to nab Shireen but never got the chance), but having a couple more Baratheon bastards secure can't hurt.

Varys not wanting an innocent teenager to die, after what he saw happen to Rhaenys and... the kid in Aegon's cradle... is also true, but why has he shown at least passing interest in Gendry twice now? If he knew about him, odds are he could easily have found out about baby Barra too, but no one tipped off her mother. I figure he's stacking the odds as best he can in terms of having backups in his pocket.

Ya I'm sure NW vows can be broken, Stannis was fine with it, Aemons brother wanted him to leave the NW, or someone did, Robb wanted Jon to leave the watch, the watch has a difficult job and I am sure any offer of 10 men for 1 would probably be accepted. But Gendry can never be proven to be anything, its not like Jon. If Gendry winds up a knight in control of BWB it's one thing, but as a blacksmith on the wall I just don't see how anyone would turn to him for anything. The examples we have are of people of prooven lineage, having their own family members, who are already the king, want them to leave the wall.

[The Great and Mighty Poo]

I doubt this will happen but when I was reading the second book I always imagined gendry starting his own house or just changing the stag to a bull maybe an iron bull or golden bull on an iron background. He has opportunity for an army the BwB and opportunity for followers the children. Though it's still a looooong shot.

A real life example of this would be the children's crusade. Even though once they got on ships they were captured and turned into slaves.

Anyway its just a thought/hope I had for gendry so please don't freak out.

ETA: I read all the books so I'm talking years ago.

[Alhazred]

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[Fae Boleyn]

Ya I'm sure NW vows can be broken, Stannis was fine with it, Aemons brother wanted him to leave the NW, or someone did, Robb wanted Jon to leave the watch, the watch has a difficult job and I am sure any offer of 10 men for 1 would probably be accepted. But Gendry can never be proven to be anything, its not like Jon. If Gendry winds up a knight in control of BWB it's one thing, but as a blacksmith on the wall I just don't see how anyone would turn to him for anything. The examples we have are of people of prooven lineage, having their own family members, who are already the king, want them to leave the wall.

A blacksmith who looks freakishly like the last Lord of Storm's End might be a useful last-ditch resort person, though. As I said, I think Edric would be Varys' first choice, and probably Mya after that. She's not officially recognized, no, but she's known to be Robert's and I'm pretty sure she's the girl Robert considered bringing to court. The one Cersei said he could bring if he wanted, but the capital isn't a safe place. I can't give you the direct quote; I only own the AFFC audiobook and Kindle book and I'm not searching through them because it'd take forever, but it's in there somewhere.

But we've yet to see Varys do anything for purely altruistic reasons. Maybe he just wanted Gendry around in case he needed to provide someone with proof that Cersei's kids weren't Robert's himself, maybe this Storm's End thing isn't it at all, but I'm sure it furthered his goals somehow to help him out. And one more stag in hand seems the only thing that could.

[aryagonnakill]

I suppose you are right.

[Mrmanakan]

My whole problem with this theory is that Aegon is worshipped of the 7 faced god. IMO there's no chance he'd join up with him because he'd look at him as just another ravager of lands. However I do think Edric would join up with him after being spurned by stannis and the kings men who left with him under the circumstances are probably all for someone other than stannis. Now with Gendry when he hears of and sees daenarys he'll follow her to the end of the earth no doubt. Which would make it pretty damn interesting if Gendry fights for her against Aegon (if Edric is with him, and assuming dance 2.0 even takes place). Brother against brother, bastard against bastard born. If I was writing the story that's what I'd do at least.

But we'll see, I'd like to see Gendry get storms end though that's be cool, he is actually what varys describes Aegon to be to kevan when he kills him at least the last part of it:

"He has lived with fisherfolk, worked with his hands, swum in rivers and mended nets and learned to wash his own clothes at need. He can fish and cook and bind up a wound, he knows what it is like to be hungry, to be hunted, to be afraid. Tommen has been taught that kingship is his right. Aegon knows that kingship is his duty, that a king must put his people first, and live and rule for them.

Aegon sounds good and varys makes him sound good but in reality he's grown vain and he seems to think the kingship is his right now and that he's not just doing this for the greater good, he's a young fool whose most like gonna end up dead In a useless battle with his crappy kingsguard who can't even save him from a stone man, in fact I believe a dwarf we all know has proven himself more kingsguard like than his current guard (minus the chastity part). He's making foolish choices. Anyways my point being is that if by some miracle Gendry became lord or even king, he'd be a hell of a lot better than Aegon and his "life long training". (Jon would be best of all if he's still breathing, sleeping, and eating which I hate to say ain't looking too good especially that whole knife between his shoulder blades and gut.)

And that a civil war involving some brothers even ones who don't know each other would be epic, not that there isn't already enough epic ness going on. GO GENDRY!

[BlueEyedCrow]

I like the history repeating part of your theory.

[Maestor Tarly]

I tend to agree with the "Edric Storm would be a better fit" idea... but I think that his arc will have something of major importance... My hope is that he finds Sansa and falls in love with her not knowing he is of royal blood and thinks that he will never have a chance and then finds out after she runs away from her wedding with Harry... pretty much like what happens in Space Balls haha

[I am of the Night]

My whole problem with this theory is that Aegon is worshipped of the 7 faced god. IMO there's no chance he'd join up with him because he'd look at him as just another ravager of lands. However I do think Edric would join up with him after being spurned by stannis and the kings men who left with him under the circumstances are probably all for someone other than stannis. Now with Gendry when he hears of and sees daenarys he'll follow her to the end of the earth no doubt. Which would make it pretty damn interesting if Gendry fights for her against Aegon (if Edric is with him, and assuming dance 2.0 even takes place). Brother against brother, bastard against bastard born. If I was writing the story that's what I'd do at least.

Whoah! That wouldn't be dance 2.0, that would be original blackfyre rebellion 2.0! I love it!

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

If Varys really wants another Baratheon, Edric is the one to choose. Edric is known to be Roberts son, is highborn on both sides of the family, and has been raised amongst the high born. Gendry is lowborn, and would never be accepted by the other highborns, kind of like the way Davos is never truly accepted by the other men of Stannis.

Aegon might not have such a big problem with Edric, even though Edric is of Baratheon blood. Edric was born long after Robert killed Rhaegar. Edric had nothing to do with it. He's just a young innocent boy who was only born because his parents got drunk and slept together once, and his mother accidentally got pregnant. Killing Edric simply because of Roberts blood, it would be the same injustice as it was when Robert wanted Aegon, Rhaenys, Viserys and Daenerys killed, simply because they were related to Rhaegar. The son is not the father, and Aegon (up until now) seems to be the kind of person who could see that.

As to Gendry, we don't know if he is the eldest boy. We know of Mya, who is born around 281 AL, and she is the eldest. Gendry is born around 285 AL. And unlike a marriage, the children don't have to be about a year appart. Each child comes from a different mother, who could, in theory, all be pregnant at the same time.

The list of known bastards (at the moment) consists of:

Mya Stone (born around 281 AL)

Bella (born in 283 AL, conceived during the Battle of the Bells)

Gendry Waters (born around 285 AL)

Edric Storm (the only acknowledged bastard, born in 288 AL)

Barra (born in 297 AL in KL to a whore)

And twin infants (born to a serving woman at Casterly Rock. They were killed. It is unknown when they were born)

these are 7 out of the 16 supposed bastards Robert has walking around. Each of the known children are years appart from each other, but since there are 9 more, and we know Mya was the first and Barra the last, there could very well be boys born before Gendry. That would make any claim Gendry could make very weak.

Edric is Varys' only real option, should the need for another Baratheon arise. I don't think Gendry will have a role to play in the whole Aegon/Dany/Lannisters/Tyrells/Iron Throne business. But he might be important still for Brienne/Jaime/Brotherhood. Though I hope Arya and Gendry will see each other once more in the story, he's close by Brienne and Jaime now, and will most likely play a role there. Since I fear Brienne will die, Jaime, who fathered all of the children Robert believed were his, will be helped by Gendry, who was actually fathered by Robert. It would be a nice thing.

[Alhazred]

The list of known bastards (at the moment) consists of:

Mya Stone (born around 281 AL)

Bella (born in 283 AL, conceived during the Battle of the Bells)

Gendry Waters (born around 285 AL)

Edric Storm (the only acknowledged bastard, born in 288 AL)

Barra (born in 297 AL in KL to a whore)

And twin infants (born to a serving woman at Casterly Rock. They were killed. It is unknown when they were born)

these are 7 out of the 16 supposed bastards Robert has walking around. Each of the known children are years appart from each other, but since there are 9 more, and we know Mya was the first and Barra the last, there could very well be boys born before Gendry. That would make any claim Gendry could make very weak.

I think we should give serious consideration to the possibility that Gendry is NOT in fact the son of Robert Baratheon.

[aryagonnakill]

I think we should give serious consideration to the possibility that Gendry is NOT in fact the son of Robert Baratheon.

With only a small amount of thought you can determine that this is not logical. The only train of thought that begins logically is that Varys set up Gendry as an illusion a long time in advance of using him. While this in itself seems perfectly plausible, knowing that a baby/child that simply has black hair will grow up to actually look like Robert is not possible. Knowing that all of Roberts bastards would come out with black hair is also not possible.

[Alhazred]

With only a small amount of thought you can determine that this is not logical. The only train of thought that begins logically is that Varys set up Gendry as an illusion a long time in advance of using him. While this in itself seems perfectly plausible, knowing that a baby/child that simply has black hair will grow up to actually look like Robert is not possible. Knowing that all of Roberts bastards would come out with black hair is also not possible.

You are making several assumptions.

Assumption #1: You are assuming that Varys set up Gendry from the very beginning. This is not documented in the books. Varys' only documented involvement with Gendry is that he may have provided him some aid in escaping King's Landing. This does not require him to have planned his black hair from the beginning.

Assumption #2: You are assuming Varys knows what Gendry's true parentage is. But this is not necessarily the case. If Ned can mistakenly believe that Gendry is King Robert's bastard son, then so can other people, including Varys.

Assumption #3: You are assuming that, if Varys knows Gendry's true parentage, he has no reason to be interested in him, except to set him up as a fake bastard of King Robert. But why would anyone want to set up a fake bastard of Robert Baratheon? He's got plenty of real bastards, and none of them have any claim to power whatsoever. If Gendry is not Robert's bastard then it must mean he is someone at least equally important, if not MORE important. Otherwise, GRRM would not have all this mystery surrounding him.

Consider this: If Gendry's mother is just some common girl, then why has GRRM left such a mystery surrounding his mother? Obviously there is more to the story.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

You are making several assumptions.

Assumption #1: You are assuming that Varys set up Gendry from the very beginning. This is not documented in the books. Varys' only documented involvement with Gendry is that he may have provided him some aid in escaping King's Landing. This does not require him to have planned his black hair from the beginning.

Assumption #2: You are assuming Varys knows what Gendry's true parentage is. But this is not necessarily the case. If Ned can mistakenly believe that Gendry is King Robert's bastard son, then so can other people, including Varys.

Assumption #3: You are assuming that, if Varys knows Gendry's true parentage, he has no reason to be interested in him, except to set him up as a fake bastard of King Robert. But why would anyone want to set up a fake bastard of Robert Baratheon? He's got plenty of real bastards, and none of them have any claim to power whatsoever. If Gendry is not Robert's bastard then it must mean he is someone at least equally important, if not MORE important. Otherwise, GRRM would not have all this mystery surrounding him.

Consider this: If Gendry's mother is just some common girl, then why has GRRM left such a mystery surrounding his mother? Obviously there is more to the story.

To add to this.

Varys was probably also the person who paid for Gendry's apprentice ship in the first place. He fits the description given.

Varys was trying to keep Roberts bastards alive, probably so he could push people in the direction of discovering the truth about Joff, Myrcella and Tommen when he wanted it to happen. Of course, it happened way too soon.

Also, Gendry does mention his mother. She was a low born woman who worked as a serving wench, and died when he was young. I don't really see a mystery here, other than the fact that Gendry doesn't mention her name, but since he was very little, he might simply not remember it.

I agree that Gendry would not be a fake, since there are too many real bastards out there, to go trough the trouble of putting a fake one in between as well.

[Alhazred]

To add to this.

Varys was probably also the person who paid for Gendry's apprentice ship in the first place. He fits the description given.

IIRC, the description was pretty vague. Almost anyone could have fit it. And, by story logic, I would say that if Varys were the person we would know about it by now. The fact that this is still hanging in the air smells fishy to me.

Varys was trying to keep Roberts bastards alive, probably so he could push people in the direction of discovering the truth about Joff, Myrcella and Tommen when he wanted it to happen. Of course, it happened way too soon.

He might do that anyway, by mistakenly believing Gendry to be Robert's bastard. Or perhaps we just don't know what his motives are.

Also, Gendry does mention his mother. She was a low born woman who worked as a serving wench, and died when he was young.

Well, I'm sure he does not remember being born.

I don't really see a mystery here, other than the fact that Gendry doesn't mention her name, but since he was very little, he might simply not remember it.

He might not have actually seen her die either. Or she might not have actually been his mother.

But if he is a bastard, one possible plot-role might be to become a dragonrider. In the first "Dance of the Dragons" apparently dragonriders were constantly getting killed, so there was an ongoing search for people with Targ blood to fill the role.