[BOOK SPOILERS] Nitpick Without Repercussion

[Ice_and_Fire]

This is a really petty nitpick I fear but...

As much as it made the visual of the battle better, I just cannot make peace with them all using flaming arrows against each other.

Brilliant way to;

1. Give away your position to the enemy so they know where to aim their arrows to take out opposing archers.

2. Give away the position of the arrow as it flies towards its' intended target allowing them a chance to dodge (as we saw Ygritte do).

I was under the impression that flaming arrows are specifically for white walkers, or if you want to set something on fire at distance. Seemed silly to me. Even my unsullied boyfriend questioned why they were all using flaming arrows saying it didn't make sense.

[Vesemir]

This is a really petty nitpick I fear but...

As much as it made the visual of the battle better, I just cannot make peace with them all using flaming arrows against each other.

Brilliant way to;

1. Give away your position to the enemy so they know where to aim their arrows to take out opposing archers.

2. Give away the position of the arrow as it flies towards its' intended target allowing them a chance to dodge (as we saw Ygritte do).

I was under the impression that flaming arrows are specifically for white walkers, or if you want to set something on fire at distance. Seemed silly to me.

Because it is silly. In medieval times, it was used only to light buildings up on fire in a siege. I dare to say, they were never used in a battle.

[protar]

@protar ok nothing 100% confirmed (i think that most of the savage Wildlings are with the Weeper)

Well sure you could argue it's just a myth, but unlike the Skaagosi the Ice River Clans are very minor. So there's no reason to confuse the story by lying about such an inconsequential detail.

[Ice_and_Fire]

Because it is silly. In medieval times, it was used only to light building up on fire in a siege. I dare to say, they were never used in a battle.

Glad I'm not alone!

[roxWolfox]

long time reader, first time poster here.

I have a couple complaints & praise to share. first of all, the diologue in this show is getting embarassing & laughable. jon & sam's conversation about sex was really silly, long winded & took up too much screen time. sometimes this show manages it's time very poorly (like with last weeks beetle scene, wtf!?).

yrgitte's little speech before the wildlings marched up to castle black was a nice moment where we see for a moment that, yeah, the wildlings are people too, not all senseless monsters going about for no reason. I loved the wildings in the novels, but the show always makes them look so weirdly one dimensional. I felt like yrgitte's screentime was wasted by her repeating over & over about how she's going to kill jon snow but I get this was thrown in so show watchers get reminded of why she's important.

that being said, the visuals were astounding along with the epic doomy music! I loved watching this episode with the giants & mammoths looking grim & badass together. very cool.

I need to rewatch it again, but my first impression was "stop talking everyone because you all are embarassing & totally cheesy" but like I said, the actual battle visuals were really satisying to me.

I loved ygritte & jon's relationship in the novels (they're both two of my favourite characters) but this ending for them seemed a little weak. didn't even cry even though I did during the read.

ah well.

Welcome to the boards! :cheers:

Though I didn't care for the Jon/Ygritte stuff (book or show), I'll admit that I had tears in my eyes when when Jon pressed his forehead against hers during my re-watch. :crying:

eta: As for the music, I chuckled. Dog Soldiers is one of my all time favourite movies (Neil Marshall!) and the theme starts off with heavy drumming very similar to the theme played at the end of this episode. My inner geek almost exploded. xD

[Bori]

Episode 8 we find out that there are 103 men of the night's watch including people like Aemon. How many were killed? I'm waiting for some dedicated person to actually make a count of how many died.

Well, I was so pissed off, that I did.

The butcher's bill so far:

41 members of the Night's Watch died or went down on screen + Grenn + Pyp. So, 59 left to defend...

versus

36 widlings died on screen from Mance's army (including the climbers) + 2 giants; 26 wildlings died on screen from Tormund's raiders + Ygritte + Styr. So, 99936 left to attack...

My little nitpick: "I need him more than I need you." What? and the look on Sam's face. As if he is about to loose the Great Other on the world...

And why Jon leave him behind when going to kill Mance? And how does he plan to accomplish that without a sword?

[Banner Without Brothers]

Well, I was so pissed off, that I did.

The butcher's bill so far:

41 members of the Night's Watch died or went down on screen + Grenn + Pyp. So, 59 left to defend...

versus

36 widlings died on screen from Mance's army (including the climbers) + 2 giants; 26 wildlings died on screen from Tormund's raiders + Ygritte + Styr. So, 99936 left to attack...

My little nitpick: "I need him more than I need you." What? and the look on Sam's face. As if he is about to loose the Great Other on the world...

And why Jon leave him behind when going to kill Mance? And how does he plan to accomplish that without a sword?

My Hero :wub:

So weird I was reading this thread when you posted

[StarkContrast]

Well, I was so pissed off, that I did.

The butcher's bill so far:

41 members of the Night's Watch died or went down on screen + Grenn + Pyp. So, 59 left to defend...

versus

36 widlings died on screen from Mance's army (including the climbers) + 2 giants; 26 wildlings died on screen from Tormund's raiders + Ygritte + Styr. So, 99936 left to attack...

My little nitpick: "I need him more than I need you." What? and the look on Sam's face. As if he is about to loose the Great Other on the world...

And why Jon leave him behind when going to kill Mance? And how does he plan to accomplish that without a sword?

Yeah. "Don't celebrate yet. They still outnumber us 1000 to 1." No Edd, you're being too optimistic. They now outnumber you 2000 to 1...

[Bori]

My Hero :wub:

So weird I was reading this thread when you posted

I never actually thought that you will read my answer, but I'm happy you did :)

[Pod The Impaler]

I was under the impression that flaming arrows are specifically for white walkers, or if you want to set something on fire at distance. Seemed silly to me. Even my unsullied boyfriend questioned why they were all using flaming arrows saying it didn't make sense.

Possible reason: Find range for your next bunchy of arrows, maybe set some shit on fire.

Actual reason: Flaming arrows help a night combat scene be filmed better and look better.

[Amber W]

Just watch the episode and my main complaint is that some of the 'tactics' were just laughable. Why on earth did they let that giant get in without shooting arrows or aiming rocks/oil/pitch/whatever at him? How on earth did they think they were successfully going to keep a giant from getting through a gate with a sword? Why weren't there any arrows or spears involved? Why is it that the only command anyone seems capable of giving is 'nock, draw, loose'? Seriously, I think they know how to shoot by now. They weren't firing nearly enough though, and kept letting everyone get way too close. And what's up with those flaming arrows? It looked good visually, but what was the point?

Seriously, I think I'd make a better battle commander than half the people in this show :p

Another think I didn't like was Sam and his storyline. Why did they have to push the romance with Gilly, with Sam almost rubbing it in Pyp's face, and why did everyone act like having a girl's the only reason you'd want to live? And why was he being such an ass to Pyp, without doing shit himself? And why was he barking at Olly, forcing him to pick up a weapon - he is a child, not a man of the Night's Watch, that's what you are supposed to be, Sam. Get him to go fetch Jon or let Ghost loose and do some work yourself, geez.

And finally, why did Ghost just start eating people? I'd hoped for at least a few nice direwolf kills. And did everyone else think the fight constantly looked like it was going very badly for the Night's Watch, only to have it turn around way too suddenly? And what's with all that useless filler dialogue these past few episodes?

That being said (and I do apologise for the rant :p), there were a few things I did like. The scythe, Dolorous Edd, Alliser Thorne, Jon's fight with Styr (even though he almost lost, again??), Tormund etc. were all really well done. And all the major deaths really gutted me; I cried a grant total of three times, which even by my standards is ridiculous. Pyp took me completely by surprise, and while I got a nasty feeling when Grenn was sent to defend the gate, I hoped against hope he was going to live. Props to them both, and to Rose Leslie of course, who absolutely nailed it.

[Duckface]

When you watch the episode on 50% of speed, then everyone sounds retarded and for me as viewer everything they do starts to make sense

[Veltigar]

When you watch the episode on 50% of speed, then everyone sounds retarded and for me as viewer everything they do starts to make sense

:lmao:

[Wun Drop]

Elaborate preparations like "The Scythe" outside the wall, but ZERO defenses in the tunnel (traps or siege preparations) just in case the outer Gate is breached?!? The entirety of the Plan is "send 6 guys as an afterthought"?

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Elaborate preparations like "The Scythe" outside the wall, but ZERO defenses in the tunnel (traps or siege preparations) just in case the outer Gate is breached?!? The entirety of the Plan is "send 6 guys as an afterthought"?

Another nitpick on the Scythe. Didn't it look like an awfully shiny and modern piece of equipment for the medieval, run down installation that the NW is presented to be?

[Amber W]

Elaborate preparations like "The Scythe" outside the wall, but ZERO defenses in the tunnel (traps or siege preparations) just in case the outer Gate is breached?!? The entirety of the Plan is "send 6 guys as an afterthought"?

I agree, that was ridiculous.

Another nitpick on the Scythe. Didn't it look like an awfully shiny and modern piece of equipment for the medieval, run down installation that the NW is presented to be?

I was too busy being all 'wooaah, cool!' to notice at the time, but you're absolutely right.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

I agree, that was ridiculous.

I was too busy being all 'wooaah, cool!' to notice at the time, but you're absolutely right.

I didn't notice it at the time either, not the first time nor on the rewatch. I only saw in my memory now, reading the previous post. That thing is damn shiny, even just in my memory. The funny video posted in the book spoiler discussion thread could be responsible for my noticing it, too. I can't take credit for finding it, that would be the fabulous JonCon's Red Beard who brought it to the thread, but I'll repost it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUXTYy96cXk

[JonCon's Red Beard]

And why was he barking at Olly, forcing him to pick up a weapon - he is a child, not a man of the Night's Watch, that's what you are supposed to be, Sam. Get him to go fetch Jon or let Ghost loose and do some work yourself, geez.

That I don't agree. If the wildings reach inside, and he's without weapon, he's not safe. With a sword, or anything, he has more chances to even escape or help someone, which indeed happened.

Another nitpick on the Scythe. Didn't it look like an awfully shiny and modern piece of equipment for the medieval, run down installation that the NW is presented to be?

Shut up it was awesome, k? k.

[Amber W]

I didn't notice it at the time either, not the first time nor on the rewatch. I only saw in my memory now, reading the previous post. That thing is damn shiny, even just in my memory. The funny video posted in the book spoiler discussion thread could be responsible for my noticing it, too. I can't take credit for finding it, that would be the fabulous JonCon's Red Beard who brought it to the thread, but I'll repost it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUXTYy96cXk

That video literally has me :lmao: Just noticed the Ygritte one too, I can't!

[Amber W]

That I don't agree. If the wildings reach inside, and he's without weapon, he's not safe. With a sword, or anything, he has more chances to even escape or help someone, which indeed happened.

To me it didn't sound like he said it out of concern, but more in a 'get off your lazy arse and kill some people' kind of way. You might very well be right though - I was already biased after the whole 'Oh, is it over? Well then!' incident :p