Denam_Pavel Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 That still doesn't give Stannis evidence. The only way he could ever know that he was the true heir would be if Cersei or Jaime confessed. Even then, with Dany running around Essos, his claim is still suspect. He's just another lord scrambling for power.Ned should't have been able to know but he decided that he did, and made the call that was his to make. And he choose Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambraigne Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Ned should't have been able to know but he decided that he did, and made the call that was his to make. And he choose Stannis.That doesn't give Stannis the right. Ned had no power to name the king as regent. He could have argued that the Baratheon children were bastards, but his only proof was hair color. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeethGrinder Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Nope. Mel seen herself walking along the battlements of Winterfell. No mention of Stannis. She seen the Bolton's banners come down, not the Baratheon banners going up. All of this after we see the first cracks emerge in the Stan/Mel relationship. This episode 100% confirmed that Stannis is going to die. Soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denam_Pavel Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 That doesn't give Stannis the right. Ned had no power to name the king as regent. He could have argued that the Baratheon children were bastards, but his only proof was hair color.They AREN'T the Baratheon children. And you comprehend that they don't have our legal system, right? Ned doesn't have to be prove it to a jury of his peers. He's the law. And whatever he should have done, Joffrey had Ned, the lawful Regent killed. And Tommen is nothing but the inheritor of Joffrey's treasonous rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogonthedread Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 i have to ask what will stannis do if davos asks "what is the life of one girl against a kingdom" having said that he is going to die that is clear and i am thinking selyse will burn shireen with the help of MEl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 To be fair, Renly was going to kill him too.Not much moral ambiguity there for either party. Stannis attacked first, he is the guilty party in this scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truly Just Man Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Stannis attacked first, he is the guilty party in this scenario. He is the rightful king, his younger brother usurped the throne that is his by right. So, no, He isn't the guilty party in this scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aFeastForDragons Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 The sellsword part they shoved in to make his position worse was sloppy. No mention of it before. In fact the whole Iron bank thing was a mess and never explained. Davos said they are still a long march from Winterfell. Will they meet Asha? Will Bolton ride out to meet him? Riders of the Vale helping Stannis? Whats Brienne going to do? Its quite different from the book so I wonder if we will get a different outcome on the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeethGrinder Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 LOL at the Brienne's in this thread bringing up Renly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minuteman Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 The sellsword part they shoved in to make his position worse was sloppy. No mention of it before. In fact the whole Iron bank thing was a mess and never explained. Davos said they are still a long march from Winterfell. Will they meet Asha? Will Bolton ride out to meet him? Riders of the Vale helping Stannis? Whats Brienne going to do? Its quite different from the book so I wonder if we will get a different outcome on the show. It is very different from the book. One thing not yet addressed is that in the show Stannis has at present only the men he brought with him from Dragonstone. What about the other northern houses? Staying with the show you have the Umbers, Mormounts, and Manderlys still loyal to the Starks which presumably means they oppose the Boltons (in the books he has them already). In the show Roose makes reference to how tenuous their hold is in response to Ramsey flaying some lord for not paying his taxes. So the show has left open plenty of avenues for Stannis to receive reinforcements. And we still have the Vale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follmann Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 What could "break the internet" on ep. 10:- Stannis' army defeats the Boltons. Maybe he receives surprise reinforcements led by the Blackfish or the Greatjon.- Stannis himself dies, maybe by Brienne's hand.- Mel and Selyse panic and burn Shireen to raise Azor Ahai from the dead.- Nothing happens to Stannis, but at the wall Jon opens his eyes.- Roll credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambraigne Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 They AREN'T the Baratheon children. And you comprehend that they don't have our legal system, right? Ned doesn't have to be prove it to a jury of his peers. He's the law. And whatever he should have done, Joffrey had Ned, the lawful Regent killed. And Tommen is nothing but the inheritor of Joffrey's treasonous rule.If you want to argue that they don't have our legal system, then you have to admit that Joffrey's treason was simply the will of the King. And even if any of this was legally admissible, it still does not change that Stannis' actions have been morally reprehensible, especially considering that the Baratheons are not the "true" heirs to the Iron Throne anyway. Any way you slice it, Stannis is a treasonous rebel with a history of using blood magic - even against his own brother - to get his way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barristan-b Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 The sellsword part they shoved in to make his position worse was sloppy. No mention of it before. In fact the whole Iron bank thing was a mess and never explained. Davos said they are still a long march from Winterfell. Will they meet Asha? Will Bolton ride out to meet him? Riders of the Vale helping Stannis? Whats Brienne going to do? Its quite different from the book so I wonder if we will get a different outcome on the show. I'm thinking the same thing. If Ramsay and a decent sized Bolton force head out of Winterfell to confront Stannis, it makes the Sansa/Theon escape seem likely with them running into Brienne & Pod. They've made it different but highly interesting. I just think it'd be cool to get a Stannis-Reek interaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denam_Pavel Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 If you want to argue that they don't have our legal system, then you have to admit that Joffrey's treason was simply the will of the King.Yes. The will of the King who was deemed not of a sufficient age to rule and thus had a Regent who ruled in his stead.And even if any of this was legally admissible, it still does not change that Stannis' actions have been morally reprehensible,I never said it did. especially considering that the Baratheons are not the "true" heirs to the Iron Throne anyway.right of conquest was an acknowledged part of Aegon's rule and in the Targaryans rule Great Councils have been called when heirs were deemed unfit. Robert WAS next in line after Viserys, his distant bloodrelation to the Targaryan isn't actually as distant as Renly makes it out to be. And Viserys was definitely just as insane as Aerys, if nothing else, Robert was right about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hos the Hostage Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 I like Stannis and hate Ramsay, but I so hope Ramsay does something horrible to Mel. Even Tyrion knew that the place belongs to the Old Gods. Mel's jealous and hungry god has no right to be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Kings Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Ramsay/Boltons are going to implode before Stannis gets there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterfell is Burning Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Book Stannis will win for sure. However, it's pretty clear D&D dislike him, so I won't be too surprised if they change events and have the Boltons win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambraigne Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Yes. The will of the King who was deemed not of a sufficient age to rule and thus had a Regent who ruled in his stead.I never said it did. right of conquest was an acknowledged part of Aegon's rule and in the Targaryans rule Great Councils have been called when heirs were deemed unfit. Robert WAS next in line after Viserys, his distant bloodrelation to the Targaryan isn't actually as distant as Renly makes it out to be. And Viserys was definitely just as insane as Aerys, if nothing else, Robert was right about that.Stannis had his shot at right of conquest and got routed. I know yall want to believe in the rule of law and that "justice" will prevail, but Stannis is neither just or winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepi Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Book Stannis will win for sure. However, it's pretty clear D&D dislike him, so I won't be too surprised if they change events and have the Boltons win. I don't think that's clear at all. Is it clear? How so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chambraigne Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 I don't think that's clear at all. Is it clear? How so?If you're a person who believes that everyone in the book gets what they deserve, Stannis is the clear winner, except for the whole thing where Stannis is just as guilty of atrocities as the rest of the pretenders.To be a Stannis lover seems to require that you believe in honor and justice for everyone but Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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