Season 4: How much will be Iron Islands and Dorne?

[Frumpus]

I fully expect most of the story lines in Dorne and the Iron Islands do be severely cut, rightfully so, when making the transition from books to TV.

What I think will happen, and I wouldn't shed a tear if it does:

- No Kingsmoot

- Victarion and Euron will be merged into one person (I know that Victarion has a big following, but honestly, the guy is as interesting as a potato)

- no Areo Hotah, no Arys, probably no Darkstar and the Mycella failed plot... it basically served nothing in the books,

it was a 5-6 chapter long introduction into seeing how Doran does indeed plot revenge

- I expect the Dorne story to have a differently shaped minor plot and an introduction to Arianne, Doran and Quentyn

I loved AFFC, but honestly, I can't see the audience being drawn in by these characters and events.

They'll probably have to be worked in into the main plot much sooner than in the books, because it's the only thing that makes sense.

I think you're spot on, except I think both Victarion and Euron will be cut, and Quentyn will be cut, but not Doran or Arianne. Dany will have a completely original storyline in S5 that still ends with her losing her dragons.

We'll likely never see Myrcella again, unless she dies in TWoW or ADoS in which case that will be shown in S6/S7.

For those of you who think they will follow the books no matter what, look back at S2 to see how Dany's storyline was completely original/changed with only minor references to stuff that happened in the books.

[Frumpus]

And how does Yara sailing around Westeros to the Dreadfort to save Theon constitute anything close to her ADWD plot?

Who says she'll actually get to the Dreadfort? What's important is that it skips the Kingsmoot and puts her back in that part of the world where she can end up falling into Stannis's hands after a failed attempt at rescuing Theon.

Heck for all we know, she might actually succeed, and that'll allow D&D to cut out Theon's ADwD storyline.

No kingsmoot means no Victarion, Euron, or Aeron. The tv audience doesn't know these characters or the significance of a successor to Balon, so it wouldn't matter if they killed Balon off without depicting what happens to the Ironborn afterwards.

[Lord Bored]

Exactly! I think this would be a perfect change.

It sounds interesting on the surface for sure, but I don't really see how it makes much sense. Why would Doran, being as cautious as he is, want to send off his heir?

[ZeroTheCat]

Exactly! I think this would be a perfect change.

Thinking the same. But I think Ellaria should still accompany the Viper unless they cut the Sand Snakes.

But yeah, I think its pretty much a no brainer. Arianne coming to Kings Landing to learn a bit about the capitol is the perfect change.

And about the heir thing, Doran doesn't seem to have a problem I'd think sending Arianne off into Westeros for certain objectives. If it serves a political purpose, I don't think Doran cares. And why should he worry? They have Mrycella, and under a cause that has made an alliance. Doing anything to Arianne would alienate Dorne and put Cersei's only daughter into jeopardy. Thats not a good idea with the realm in disarray.

It works in the books, but I don't think it would hurt in the show. Arianne just appearing in Season 5 I don't think would be a smart idea. The audiences familiarity with her is whats going to decide the success of a significant part of AFFC in the show.

[Game of Chodes]

I expect season 4 to cover a lot of ASOS material because there is still a ton of it that has yet to be covered in season 3 of the show. There will also most likely be a small to moderate amount of material from ADWD and AFFC depending on which characters storylines are advancing more quickly than others.Here is what I expect to see during season 4 in no particular order:

1. The introduction of Oberyn and Arianne Martell in KL

-this is important because Oberyn must be present for Tyrion's trial, and the purple wedding

-introducing Arianne Martell would allow for the later introduction of Doran Martell

2. The Purple Wedding

- this is a huge event to season 4 because there are numerous characters who's story lines cannot advance until after this occurs.

3. The Aftermath of the purple wedding

- Littlefinger and sansa go to the eyrie

-tyrion is arrested

4. The fight between Oberyn (on tyrion's behalf) and gregor

- Obviously Oberyn dies, and tyrion is once again imprisoned

5. Tyrion Kills Tywin

- of the 11 events, i believe this is the one that most likely gets pushed back to season 5 but it is very climactic and would thus make a great part of episode 9 in season 4

6. The Hound and Arya get into the fight at the inn

- Arya recovers needle, and this is pretty much just an opportunity for her to get more screen time with the hound

-it also allows Arya to proceed independently of the hound following the fight's conclusion

7. Arya sailing to Braavos

-pretty self-explanatory, just sailing, nothing actually in Braavos

8. Bran journeying North

-Not much here, just the gang traveling

9. Daenarys ruling Mereen/ Yunkai

-It seems fairly certain that mereen has been cut from the show and combined with Yunkai which is fine

-this will be mostly filler, like it is in the books

10. Jon defends Castle Black from wildlings V1

- Jon and Night's watch defeat Ygritte and co

11. Castle Black Battle v2

- All of the fighting between Mance and Night's watch

- Stannis arrives near the end of the season and routes Wildlings

Notes:

-I could definitely see the introduction of Victarion and Euron (yes both) being included in this season but there really is no reason why it can't wait until season 5. I think both of them are necessary for the sole reason that there are 2 iron islander forces. One pillaging the Reach, and one sailing east to Daenarys therefore both characters are necessary. Furthermore, there really is no reason to combine them character introductions are starting to slow down on their own without the bullshit character combining they've attempted thus far.

-There are several other events that are from ASOS that will most likely be pushed back to season 5 primarily because the characters they involve already have enough material for season 4:

1. Appearance of stoneheart

2. Littlefinger kills Lysa

3. Jon Snow is named lord Commander

-I believe that the primary filler for the season will come mostly from Daenarys in Yunkai/Mereen, and as always KL (Jamie rejecting Cersei advances etc).

-The characters I expect to get the most screen time this season will be Tyrion, Daenarys, Arya, Jamie, Cersei, and Jon Snow. I believe Theon, the other iron islanders, the Dornish, Bran, Sam, and Sansa will all take a bit of a back seat because their storylines have all progressed more quickly than the other characters and thus need to allow time for the other main characters to catch up.

-Many people have stated that they think several characters need to be removed/combined which I do not believe is the case or at least not yet. Obviously it is a stretch but if my prediction of what will happen next season are correct the only new characters being introduced would be Arianne, Oberyn, and then possibly some very small characters in Yunkai just to make Daenarys look like shes actually doing something. And then maybe Euron and Victarion but as I mentioned earlier that is unlikely.

-The key event to season 4 will be the PW because so many plot lines depend upon it. Its not the most climactic, but it needs to happen relatively early in season 4 to give the story lines dependent upon it time to progress. I expect a relatively boring first 2 episodes of season 3 aside from castle black battle v1, and I believe the PW will occur around episode 3 of season 4.

Thoughts?

[Colonel Green]

2. Littlefinger kills Lysa

Why on earth would that be left out? What else would possibly serve as the climax for Sansa and the Eyrie that year?

[Javi Marcos]

S4 should only include Kingsmoot and maybe Arianne traveling to King's Landing with Oberyn

[Kaitscralt]

People think Areo Hotah isn't expendable?

That's the funniest.

[Joyful Union]

People think Areo Hotah isn't expendable?

That's the funniest.

There's furniture with more worth and character than Areo Hotah.

[Weeping Sore]

Who says she'll actually get to the Dreadfort? What's important is that it skips the Kingsmoot and puts her back in that part of the world where she can end up falling into Stannis's hands after a failed attempt at rescuing Theon.

Heck for all we know, she might actually succeed, and that'll allow D&D to cut out Theon's ADwD storyline.

No kingsmoot means no Victarion, Euron, or Aeron. The tv audience doesn't know these characters or the significance of a successor to Balon, so it wouldn't matter if they killed Balon off without depicting what happens to the Ironborn afterwards.

I agree that there will be no Kingsmoot; you'll just have Euron seizing the Seastone Chair. I don't think that automatically means no Vic- it might actually be easier to tell the story if you have two characters (Euron & Vic) interacting rather than one (Euron) monologuing.

As for Yara, I think she will somehow manage to take the Dreadfort while Ramsay & Reek are far away hunting Rickon/Shaggy/Asha.

My crackpot theory is Bolton ambitions expand to the North + Iron Islands (Boltons look to solidify standing by handling the Ironborn problem) Yara becomes Ramsay's bride, and then Theon saves her.

[Ser Luke.]

People think Areo Hotah isn't expendable?

That's the funniest.

If anyone in the Dorne storyline will be cut, it will be him without a doubt.

[Joyful Union]

If anyone in the Dorne storyline will be cut, it will be him without a doubt.

I don't know, Arys Oakheart is almost as useless.

[Basileus777]

People think Areo Hotah isn't expendable?

That's the funniest.

He's obviously expensable, but he could also be useful as someone for Doran to talk to in scenes, so he might stick around. A guy in armor who says a few lines, it's not a troublesome or expensive role to keep.

[YouSnowNothing]

^I agree that that will probably be his role. A few lines in response to Doran, spends the rest of the time standing in the background looking tough.

There's furniture with more worth and character than Areo Hotah.

Petition for a wooden footstool to play Hotah in S5.

[Weeping Sore]

I don't know, Arys Oakheart is almost as useless.

I think you gain more by cutting Arys, since Hotah is a true fly-on-the-wall POV.

D&D might not want to lose the Arys-Arianne sex scenes, but they could compensate by changing the Water Gardens from naked children to naked 18+ year olds (mostly well-groomed women, but with a few fleeting male butt-shots thrown in I'm sure)

[Nezzer]

D&D might not want to lose the Arys-Arianne sex scenes, but they could compensate by changing the Water Gardens from naked children to naked 18+ year olds (mostly well-groomed women, but with a few fleeting male butt-shots thrown in I'm sure)

That would be awkward. Doran would look like a total pervert living in the Playboy mansion.

[King of the Road]

That would be awkward. Doran would look like a total pervert living in the Playboy mansion.

Hugh Hefner to play Doran Martell.

[Weeping Sore]

That would be awkward. Doran would look like a total pervert living in the Playboy mansion.

Yeah, he wouldn't look like a pervert gazing at naked children all day.

I did intend the Barely Legal Water Gardens to be a joke- maybe it was too plausible on HBO.

[Nezzer]

Yeah, he wouldn't look like a pervert gazing at naked children all day.

I did intend the Barely Legal Water Gardens to be a joke- maybe it was too plausible on HBO.

Children playing naked makes a lot more sense than grown ups. I think HBO will probably have half-dressed children in the Water Gardens. But I don't understand how children nudity works in film. They did show Gilly's baby naked, penis and everything. Is it legal to show babies naked, but illegal to show young chidlren naked?

[Weeping Sore]

Children playing naked makes a lot more sense than grown ups. I think HBO will probably have half-dressed children in the Water Gardens. But I don't understand how children nudity works in film. They did show Gilly's baby naked, penis and everything. Is it legal to show babies naked, but illegal to show young chidlren naked?

You're absolutely right. I suppose if enough people write lasciviously online about true infants they might take that away from us too. Am I about to get a "warning point" here? (If anyone would know, it's Nezzer)

Seriously though, the space for non-sexualized nudity used to be larger in society, but perverts just keep rushing into the gap. So the impossibility of shooting Doran's Water Gardens as written is obvious.

Ever seen the documentary Chicken Hawk, Nezzer? More disturbing than a night with Ramsay Snow.