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By Odin's Beard

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  1. By Odin's Beard

    Weirdwood tree seeds?

    I favor the weirwood fungus hypothesis--I don't think weirwoods are trees at all but rather the "trees" are just the fruiting body that sprout up from the vast mycorrhizal network underground, which is the main organism. Weirwood don't require light, can grow underground, and probably prefer darkness, and they feed on blood rather than photosynthesis. And they seem to sprout up where blood has been spilled. They grow in rings like mushroom fairy rings. Mycelia are also called hyphae, which means "web" and one of the parts of the hypha is called a "septa" Amanita muscaria is a red and white mushroom that is psychedelic, and has a symbiotic relationship with trees. It can give the feeling that you are flying. The Greywater Fungus Weirwoods also have some similarities to starfish, anemones, and the hydra Starfish turn to stone when they die. Seastar means starfish (asteroidea), and Bloodraven loved Seastar, and wed the weirwood. And in Tuf's Guardians, the hive-minded mudpots weaponize starfish to fight the invading humans. In ASOIAF the CoTF were said to have turned the trees to warriors to fight the invading humans. Patchface says that under the sea the women wear anemones in their hair. In the Men of Greywater Station, and A Song For Lya, when the fungus infects your brain you grow tendrils of fungus out of your head, in ASOIAF when you are in the weirwood network--when you are "under the sea"/(under the greensee) it looks like you have an anemone on your head, the weirwood has infected your mind. Also, I think the sigil of Dorne looks like an anemone. In the DC comics in the 60s there was a creature called Starro, that was a telepathic starfish alien, his powers included absorbing the minds of people, telepathic control via spores (like the greywater fungus), regenerative ability (if you cut him in half, you would have two of him), but he was vulnerable to extreme cold--and in Sandkings, extreme cold put the maws (psionic hive-minded weirwood-like creatures) into hibernation. Hydra have been described as being "biologically immortal" because of their regenerative ability, they do not seem to age. They are a predatory animal that looks like a little white tree with tentacles. The adult hydra is called a medusa. They have hands and a mouth and they catch passing prey, paralyze it with venomous barbs and eat it. If you cut part of it off it just grows into a clone of its parent. " 'If you cut a worm in two, you make two worms,' the acolyte informed them." The Medusa from Sturgeon's The Cosmic Rape, was a telepathic hive-minded polyp that spanned several galaxies and tried to take over Earth with mind-control. Its spores looked like raisins, and if you ate the spore it would take over your mind. In Arthur C Clarke's The City and the Stars, there is a hive-minded immortal polypous shapeshifting medusa-colony alien that lives in a lake, awaiting the return of the "Great Ones" not far from a city called Lys. In The Call of Cthulhu, they worship a ancient ageless white polypous thing with luminous eyes that lives at a secret lake, and bat-winged creatures come out to worship it at midnight "It was nightmare itself, and to see it was to die. But it made men dream, and so they knew enough to keep away." And in the Moon-Lens, the Black Goat of the Woods is essentially a weirwood, it is a polypous alien that lives in a cave and eats humans, it is referred to as a gorgon. It has coexisted with humans for thousands of years and the worship it as a god, and it is the basis for many human religions. In greek myth the Lernaean Hydra guarded the entrance to the underworld, and had many heads that would grow back if you cut them off. Hercules kills it by burning the stumps after cutting the heads off. Just for good measure, check out the Fangs of the Trees, from Silverberg's Earth's Other Shadow, (and Something Wild is Loose, from that same volume about a little polypous alien stowaway called Vsiir that telepathically sends nightmares) As well as Vance's Sons of the Tree. Both have intelligent predatory trees. And maybe Tolkien's Old Man of the Willow "He is portrayed in the story as a tree, albeit a sentient and evil one with various powers including hypnosis and the ability to move his roots and trunk" He tries to eat the hobbits. "Bombadil relates that of the corrupted trees of the Old Forest, 'none were more dangerous than the Great Willow; his heart was rotten, but his strength was green; and he was cunning, and a master of winds, and his song and thought ran through the woods on both sides of the river. His grey thirsty spirit drew power out of the earth and spread like fine root-threads in the ground, and invisible twig-fingers in the air, till it had under its dominion nearly all the trees of the Forest from the Hedge to the Downs.' " And also, Algernon Blackwood's The Willows, about psychically vampiric predatory alien willow trees that live outside of our conception of time.
  2. By Odin's Beard

    Syrio Forel

    Many people are familiar with the theory that Pate/Jaqen/Alchemist is trying to get a hold of the forbidden/burned books locked in the vault at the Citadel, one of them called Blood and Fire. And some theorists also propose that Jaqen was Syrio also. I have a tidbit to add to this. Syrio, from Latin Sīrius, from Ancient Greek Σείριος (Seírios), usually taken from σείριος (seírios, "the scorcher", “scorching; glowing” the star Sirius is described as "flaming, burning"). Forel from Middle English forel (“case, sheath”), A kind of parchment for book covers; a forrill. parchment, "scorching/flaming/burning book" In ancient astronomy the star Sirius is sometimes described as being red, sometimes white, and once sea-blue. Sirius is a face-changer. Syrio is a face-changer. Also, is this the same book Sam has at Castle Black? If so, Sam has the only complete copy. Jaqen is trying to get the dangerous, burning/burned books about dragons (Blood and Fire), and Syrio Forel's name means "burning book." So I think Jaqen was Syrio also.
  3. By Odin's Beard

    Weirdwood tree seeds?

    I think its the other way around, that ASOIAF is supposed to be the origin story to the entire Lovecraft mythos, and that the Lovecraftian lore is a very distorted recollection of real events from Earth's antediluvian history.
  4. By Odin's Beard

    Weirdwood tree seeds?

    In Lovecraft's Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath, there is an enchanted forest with a "haunted tree unlike the others, which had grown from a seed dropt down by someone on the moon" the zoogs live inside the trees and in burrows, and they are secretive, small and brown and have weird eyes, and they make a psychedelic drink from the fermented sap of the haunted "moon-tree".
  5. By Odin's Beard

    Why “Wylla?” Meet Lyanna’s Dornish Doppelganger

    Not directly related to the OP, but some food for thought on the subject of Ned, Ashara, Jon, and Wylla. The Case of the Fisherman's Daughter: Davos and Godric Borrell: One source (The Order of the Green Hand) claims that the author's annotations for this passage from the ibook edition say: "This particular account reveals Borrell's ignorance. Jon Snow was born some time around or shortly after the sack of King's Landing. Catelyn believes he was conceived only after Ned had married her--while Lord Borrell's account would place his birth far earlier." I don't have the ibook, and I could not cross check to verify this passage. Does anybody here have that? More of Davos and Borrell's conversation: From this conversation we learn that the fish people are treacherous, Borrell has a terrible reputation, and they have a grudge against the Starks, and they use false lights to lure unwary captains to their doom, Borrell is in charge of the Night Lamp and brought up using it to sink ships. Fish guy Borrell is totally wrong about the Manderly's loyalty to the Starks. Later Davos thinks "Sisterton had undermined those hopes. If Lord Borrell told it true," what if he did not tell the Tale of the Fisherman's Daughter true, and this was a false light? The word "borrel" can mean "ignorant, or unlearned" (Later, Wyman sends Davos to Skagos to find Rickon, the last male Stark heir, the World Book mentions that Skagos also uses "false lights" to lure ships to their doom--Rickon really is a shaggydog story?) I think we need to be very suspicious of the information and the timeline provided by Borrell. Davos moves on to WhiteHarbor: Davos is a smuggler who sneaks into WhiteHarbor on the Merry Midwife, coincidentally the boat is named after a happy person who delivers a baby. Merry/Laughing woman (recall "Ashara's laughing eyes") holding an infant. The boat is very old, won't draw attention, many layers of paint--language suggesting going incognito. This is possibly the same boat Ned used. The captain of the Merry Midwife is Casso Mogat, mogate means "Varnish, glazing which covers anything." and Mogat backwards is "tagom", an indigo dye. casso means "fruitless, deprived, erased, fired" or "abdomen" or "I begin to fall" A name that means to cover something up, the color purple, who was fired from a position, deprived of something, related to abdomens, is fruitless, and begins to fall? Ashara was allegedly got her heart broken by Ned breaking up with her, lost a baby, and jumped off a tower. The longest words you can form with "casso mogat" is "scotoma" which is a synonym for "blindspot." and "scatoma" which is impacted feces mistaken for a tumor. Blindspots and feces mistaken for something important? That's weird. Davos remembers the last time he came to WhiteHarbor with his old captain the Blind Bastard. He sees Storm Dancer, the same ship Cat took to King's Landing. "They came here for refuge, to a city untouched by the fighting," "a young girl was selling cups of fresh milk from her nanny goat." Bastards, WhiteHarbor is a safe refuge, young girls and nanny goats (milk maid wet nurse) . . . Lady Ashara "threw herself into the sea"--symbolic mermaid? She had fair skin, and a baby cradled in her arms. The Wolf's Den is comfy, and may have been a lordling's bedchamber: A Wolf's Den is where you would expect to find a wolf pup. It was built by Jon Stark: Many a younger son, many a brother, stayed there. Jon is the younger brother. Jon is the only remaining male Stark with grey eyes, and this Greystark family line appears here for the first time,--it was invented for this passage. Jon's "eyes were a grey so dark they seemed almost black," Edric Dayne "had big blue eyes, so dark that they looked almost purple." Eddard's eyes: "dark grey" Ashara's: "haunting violet eyes" The grey stark eyes appear to be recessive, as Robb, Sansa, Bran, and Rickon have blue eyes, and only Arya and Jon have grey. Edric Snowbeard is mentioned, reminding us that Edric is a Stark name. Davos talking with sailors: The Sloe-Eyed Maid, traveled around the world, brought back precious cargo but sunk during a storm due to the Sisterton false lights when it was almost home. Borrell mentions taking precious cargo off of a sloe-eyed maid, saffron, the most valuable spice in all the world, is the product of the Crocus--a purple and white flower. The color sloe is dark, purple-blue (plum), and it refers to a plant with white flowers and fruit like small plums. Ashara had white skin and purple/violet eyes, she is the sloe-eyed maid/crocus, the precious cargo taken off her was her baby (but at WhiteHarbor, not Sisterton). The sailors bring up the possibility of false history and children being alive who were thought dead: Ashara had a child believed dead. And they bring up Dany (a Targ) and her purple eyes, trying to get on the sloe-eyed maid, but being denied. The sloe-eyed maid is not a Targ, but a Dayne. WhiteHarbor's church is called the Sept of the Snows. The Manderly's are fiercely loyal to the Starks. "debt that can never be repaid" Wyman has a granddaughter named Wylla, (also Wyllis, and Wynafred). I think Wylla the wet nurse was from WhiteHarbor, someone Wyman could trust. Wyman knows Ned's secrets. Wylla is 15. Her hair is dyed, as if to indicate a disguise. She is brave and fiercely defends the Starks They say to Wylla, "You know nothing." After book 2 that phrase is used 33 times for Jon Snow and once here for Wylla. 24 times straight for Jon, then once for Wylla, then 9 more times for Jon. Jon's catch phrase is being applied to Wylla. Seems like George interrupted his pattern to draw attention to Wylla. Also, the phrase "You know nothing." is immediately followed by "I know about the promise." Is this a reference to "Promise me Ned"? The word "willa" is a synonym for "desire, wish, pleasure, delight"--Jon's mother was lust. Wyman and Wylla talk about a bastard named Snow, being legitimized and becoming Lord of Winterfell: There was also a Wylla Fenn of the Neck, who had a bastard boy with Brandon Stark named Lon Snow (Lonnel, Lonny). "fen" means "marsh or swamp" There was also a "warrior maid Wylla of Wyl in the Battle by the Bloody Pool" of House Wyl in Dorne. The sigil of House Wyl is a snake coiled around a foot, recall that the figurehead of the Merry Maid was a woman holding an infant by the foot. This is Achilles symbolism, as a baby he was dipped into the river Styx by his mother, and the water granted him protection, but she held him by the foot to dunk him and his heel was left vulnerable. And Achilles died from a poisoned arrow hitting his heel. Jon has an Achilles Heel. While in conversation with Wyman, Davos thinks "Did Manderly have a Stark heir hidden away in his castle?"--(he was talking about modern events not Robert's Rebellion, though.) Ashara is the "fisherman's daughter" seen at the Sisters, but Borrel's timeline is wrong. She has an extended stay at WhiteHarbor and gives birth at the Wolf's Den. That is where baby wolves should be born. She fakes her death and joins the church in White Harbor (the Sept of the Snows), she is Septa Lemore, "Lemure" means "ghost" in Latin, Ashara faked her death. (Also a reference to the lost love Lenore from the Raven?) The word lemur comes from lemures, Little Valyrian lemurs have purple eyes. Ashara had "haunting violet eyes" and she is a ghost. fyi, ashara means the number "10" in Arabic. There is a guy named Locke at Manderly's court, "a stocky man in white and purple, whose cloak was fastened with a pair of crossed bronze keys." Purple and white are Ashara's colors, and crossed keys are on the papal emblems of the Catholic church. stretch marks, " She was past forty, more handsome than pretty, but still easy on the eye" "Lemore, though … Who is she, really? Why is she here? Not for gold, I'd judge. What is this prince to her? Was she ever a true septa?" "Septa's robes scream of Westeros and might draw unwelcome eyes onto us." She turned back to Prince Aegon. "You are not the only one who must needs hide." Lemore is hiding because she's supposed to be dead. Possible course of events: Ned and Ashara fall in love at Harrenhal, have courtship, no sex. War starts, Ned is at Vale, Ashara is at Dragonstone with Elia, Ned takes her to WhiteHarbor to keep her safe. Goes to raise the bannerman. Brandon dies, Ned does the strategic political maneuver and marries Cat to bring the Riverlands into the alliance and gets her pregnant, Ned is going to do the right thing and break it off with Ashara next time he sees her. Next time he sees her he breaks his vows and they conceive Jon--don't know when he makes it to WhiteHarbor to do this. 1) Ashara gives birth at Wolf's Den, never returns to Starfall, Ned picks up baby on way home, breaks it off with Ashara, she fakes her death and joins the church 2) Ashara gives birth at Wolf's Den, returns to Starfall at war's end, with baby, Ned swaps baby for sword, she fakes her death joins the church. Ned does the "honorable" thing and leaves Ashara to return to his new wife. That is the shame, he loved Ashara and she was soo nice, and he barely knew Cat, but to keep the alliance and hold the kingdom together he returned to Cat. Ashara understood that Ned had to do this. Ned did what Robb could not, and kept the alliance. "I dishonored myself and I dishonored Catelyn, in the sight of gods and men." "Gods have mercy, you scarcely knew Catelyn." "I had taken her to wife. She was carrying my child." He dishonored Cat after the wedding. Ned did break his vows and he is deeply ashamed of it, but he chose duty over love, and went back to Cat. And has been trying to make up for it ever since.
  6. By Odin's Beard

    Planetos, "Mega-Seasons" and Planet X. It'sh Schience!

    I don't know if this post was satire or not, but I have been schilling for planet x since day 1. The World Book says: "Though the Citadel has long sought to learn the manner by which it may predict the length and change of seasons, all efforts have been confounded. Septon Barth appeared to argue, in a fragmentary treatise, that the inconstancy of the seasons was a matter of magical art rather than trustworthy knowledge. " "Maester Nicol's The Measure of the Days—otherwise a laudable work containing much of use—seems influenced by this argument. Based upon his work on the movement of stars in the firmament, Nicol argues unconvincingly that the seasons might once have been of a regular length, determined solely by the way in which the globe faces the sun in its heavenly course. The notion behind it seems true enough—that the lengthening and shortening of days, if more regular, would have led to more regular seasons—but he could find no evidence that such was ever the case, beyond the most ancient of tales." Maester Nicol, is a reference to Nicolaus Copernicus, who (re)discovered the heliocentric model of the solar system, I think that this rules out a second actual sun, the black dwarf star, George is telling us the single-sun heliocentric model is correct. In the ancient tales/star charts, the movement of the stars was regular, they are now irregular. The lengthening and shortening of the days has become irregular. Something ("magic") is altering the length of the days in an irregular and as yet unpredictable way. The seasons are not being altered by mystical ice/fire forces advancing and retreating, because that would not alter the lengths of the days or the positions of the stars. Earth has seasons because the axis of the planet is tilted 23.5 degrees off of the plane of the solar system, we will call this a regular orbit, in this case the Northern Hemisphere is angled more towards the sun in summer and away from the sun in winter. The seasons of Westeros could possibly be explained by a Wobbly Orbit, Samwell Tarly's fake climate change paper suggests this, but this does not work because the North Star remains in the same position throughout the books (see below). (If the North Star stayed the same, but the planet rolled, this is called true polar wander and scientists think this may have caused the Ice Age.) And they don't propose any mechanism for what is causing the wobble, or why it can remain in summer position for 10 years and then rapidly shift to winter position and maintain that position for several years. The most recent summer lasted about 10 years, that would mean that the Earth tilted back and forth while going around to sun, so as to keep Westeros facing the sun with approximately the same angle for 10 years. I do not think any natural phenomenon could cause this. It seems like he told us what it was, a black dwarf, then said "it's magic"--which could be understood as "not a natural phenomenon"--because, like you say, sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. So I don't think Planet X is a black dwarf or a gas giant, it is an artificial "planet". What could have changed in the past 10,000-15,000 years to alter the tilt of the Earth? What event happened around that time--the arrival of the Lion of Night and the founding of the Great Empire. The Qaartheen "second moon" myth was a celestial body that causes an eclipse, is destroyed, and living creatures come down from it. Dragons came from the second moon, dragons came from the Shadow, the Shadow is the second moon. Both objects were big enough to cause eclipses. Luwin's Shadow maps were tracking the movements of one of them. The Shadow "planet" could be what is affecting the tilt of the Earth. The Shadow Planet is in geostationary orbit over Asshai. It is latched onto that location and moves with it, so that to observers on the ground, it does not appear to move. As the Earth travels around the sun, the Shadow Planet vacillates and tugs the Earth with it, changing the Earth's orientation to the sun, while keeping the axis of rotation pointing North to the Ice Dragon. Westeros in Summer Westeros in Winter The Shadow over Asshai, and the "darkness in the North" are a literal shadow being cast by a totally black object hovering right over the far north-east portion of Asshai. "Asshai by the Shadow." "The nights are very black in Asshai, all agree, and even the brightest days of summer are somehow grey and gloomy." The nights are very black because there is a object blocking out the night sky. Asshai itself seems to be in the penumbra, and Stygia is in the umbra--"the heart of darkness" "The Shadow Lands" (and the Ghost Grass is a metaphor for the Others, who live in darkness under the Shadow) Carcosa is on the shore of the Hidden Sea, both of which I think are under the Shadow. From The King in Yellow, "Strange is the night where black stars rise, And strange moons circle through the skies, But stranger still is Lost Carcosa." Strange moons, and black stars above Carcosa. There is also a story called the Black Hole of Carcosa, in which a black hole is near a planet which makes people have magical abilities? No good summaries online. In Lovecraft's Dream Quest of Kadath, Kadath is in a region of permanent darkness, and the Old Ones live on top of a gigantic mountain in an onyx castle, (and there are floating heads that are mistaken for mountains) I think the Dothraki Mother of Mountains is actually this Shadow Planet as seen from a great distance (it is the Mountain, and it was heavily damaged (decapitated) at the end of the last Long Night when the Red Comet knocked it out of eclipse formation). It is not recognized as a moon because of its irregular shape. "Vaes Dothrak, which stands beneath the shadow of the lonely peak they call the Mother of Mountains, beside a bottomless lake they name the Womb of the World. " "with the Mother of Mountains looming overhead." "No steel was permitted within the sacred confines of Vaes Dothrak, beneath the shadow of the Mother of Mountains" "toward the Mother of Mountains far to the northeast." They call Vaes Dothrak a "hollow shell of a city," (but I think the Shadow Planet is the hollow shell) "stallion who mounts the world." is a reference to the Shadow planet, which appears to humping the Earth. This language parallels the Quartheen moon mating with the sun, and the Lion of Night mating with the sun. When two celestial bodies are in eclipse formation, it is a mating. Mountain that Rides is a metaphor for the Shadow Planet, unhorsed by guile, his horse was decapitated, he was later decapitated, he was a Stone Giant. (The jhogwin were massive stone giants that lived in the Bones Mountains.) "A shadow fell across his face. He turned to find Clegane looming overhead like a cliff. His soot-dark armor seemed to blot out the sun." Sandor's black horse is called Stranger, (and Sandoq the Shadow), both large men all in black. In the section on Ib they mention the God-Kings Ruined Palace, and I think this is also a reference to the Shadow Planet. "the Port is dominated by the ruins of the God-King's castle, a colossal structure of rough-hewn stone that was home to a hundred Ibbenese kings. The last such king was thrown down in the aftermath of the Doom of Valyria, however. Today, Ib and the lesser isles are governed by the Shadow Council" If the Lion of Night was the God-on-Earth's ship, "ruins of the God-King's castle" would be a close parallel to that. And possibly the Azure Emperor from YiTi. " though millions may worship the azure emperor in Yin and prostrate themselves before him whenever he appears . . . There the seventeenth azure emperor Bu Gai sits in splendor in a palace larger than all King's Landing" The gravitational pull of the Shadow Planet is what sunk the Thousand Islands, it pulled a massive tide over them. I think they are supposed to be the St Petersburg area of Russia, and the land bridge between Essos and Scandinavia was submerged. When the Shadow Planet moves again it will created tsunamis and reveal hidden islands. This may have been the Hammer of the Waters that sunk Dorne and swamped the Neck also. The Shadow Planet can be moved and controlled, and this is how it caused the Long Night by being parked in orbit to block out the sun. Dragonbinder is the remote control, only those with Great Empire King's Blood can control the ship. Quaithe of the Shadow is trying to get Dany to pass beneath the Shadow, that is, take control of the ship. (in heraldry Quatherine means a "ship in full sail", and a quays are where ships are parked) The Gods of the Seven are the planets, (think Greek and Roman paganism) one of them is a mysterious black thing without a regular orbit, that is a wanderer (planet) from far places, that is their god of death. Recall that one of the oldest Septs is the Starry Sept, built of black marble. And The Church of Starry Wisdom is worshiping something in the night sky, and they are an apocalyptic death cult, founded by a guy who caused the Long Night (eclipse). I think was the Long Night was caused by the giant black Lion of Night spaceship that can be parked in orbit to block out the sun, the weirwoods are most powerful in complete darkness, and that is why the Bloodstone Emperor blocked out the sun when he hijacked the weirwood network--to maximize his power. I think that Planetos is Earth, and at the end of the series the Shadow planets will depart and the seasons will return to normal. ------------- Polestar references I think the Blue North Star is Vega, which was Earth's polestar 14,000 years ago, due to the axial precession, and the Ice Dragon is the constellation Draco. In Sworn Sword: summer 211ac? "and the blue eye of the Ice Dragon was lost to him, the blue eye that pointed north." In Clash Bran V: late summer 299ac "Look for the Ice Dragon, and chase the blue star in the rider's eye."ac In Storm Bran II: autumn 299ac "look up in the sky for the Ice Dragon. The blue star in the dragon's eye pointed the way north, as Osha told him once. " In Storm Jon V: autumn 299ac "Jon searched the sky until he found the Ice Dragon, then turned the mare north for the Wall" In Storm Sam III: autumn 299ac "and on clear nights they could follow the Ice Dragon's tail" (south) In Storm Davos VI: autumn 299ac"The clouds hid most of the Ice Dragon, all but the bright blue eye that marked due north." If the Ice Dragon is Draco, then the Blue Star must still refer to Vega, because the two bright stars in Draco's head are orange (Eltanin) and yellow (Rastaban), not blue. Sidebar: There is no way the dragon's tail points south, it would rotate around the Blue Star during the night. What was going on here Sam? Was that why he couldn't find the wall--he was walking in circles? However, the fact that they all believe there is a consistent Polestar indicates that it must not change too much, let us say that the polestar remains Vega, and there could be a slight axial wobble, but not enough to alter the seasons. However, there is one passage where the sun is described doing something odd, when it is overhead at the Wall: It is Autumn, in the far north, but the sun was overhead and it reflected off the wall? That doesn't make sense. They would have to be near the equator for that to happen. Sun position shadow calculator Let's say the wall is at Edinburgh, Scotland, and is 700 feet tall, in September at mid-day, it would still cast a shadow almost 1000 feet long, never getting close to being overhead. So the Wall must be much further south than Scotland the day Jon climbs the wall, it is nearly at the equator. If the planet is being tugged around by the Shadow, this is possible.
  7. By Odin's Beard

    The Others "inside" man

    We are all here for discussion and debate and to learn more about the books, to that end the free flow of ideas and reasonable disagreement should be encouraged, not suppressed. Let a person's ideas and theories stand on their own merits (or lack thereof), don't try to poison the well by posting ad hominems like "you are unpopular and you are a crybaby and you are full of shit and nobody likes your ideas" Bonus connection between Braavos and the Others. The courtesans of Braavos: The Black Pearl, Bellegere Otherys. belliger means "war bringing" and Otherys is Others. Black pearl references the object that causes the eclipse of the sun during the Long Night. "was black as a pot of ink" "She's descended from the dragons" and " was a captain and a pirate queen" The name and job of Black Pearl is hereditary. Mother was Bellonara, Bellonarius was the Roman goddess of war, sister to Mars. (Black Pearl, black as a pot of ink, associated with the Others, and war, and ships, and dragons (dragons descended from the second moon), and war and the planet Mars, I think it is the Lion of Night/Shadow/Stranger) The Merling Queen--the Merling King is one of the gods of death in the HoBW, so she is the queen of the god of death. "was never seen without her Mermaids, four young maidens in the blush of their first flowering who held her train and did her hair" Maybe parallels the Thing that Came in the Night (the Great Other), with 4 servants shambling behind. If one of them dies she replaces them. The Moonshadow--also references the eclipse of the Long Night. Wears only white and silver, like an Other. The Nightingale-- Westeros has names for the times of night: "The hour of the owl, the hour of the wolf, the hour of the nightingale," nightingale means "night song or night songstress," Pate hears the nightingale several times before he dies. Bryce Caron of Nightsong, his sigil is the Nightingale, He became the head of the House after his father, mother, brother, and all his sisters succumbed to a chill. And he is appointed to Renly's rainbow guard, and I think Kingsguards are a metaphor for the Others (see LmL) The Daughter of the Dusk--children of night ?? The Poetess "always had a book to hand" ?? The Veiled Lady "was beautiful, though only those she took as lovers ever saw her face." Women of the night, associated with death, war, the Others, night songs, and eclipses. Help me out with these last three, I can't think of anything.
  8. By Odin's Beard

    The Others "inside" man

    Glass houses, I know truth isn't a popularity contest and measuring self-worth by social media likes is not healthy, but since decided to cross-thread harass me, and you brought it up, you have 6 "likes and thanks" on your 2 most recent pages of comments, and I have 17, so if I am not taken seriously, you are taken a 1/3rd as seriously as I am. (I know people are just going to upvote you for me saying this). Let's keep things civil from now on. I was just horsing around with that last comment about the doppleganger. Someone else mentioned Bolt-On so I was trying to up the ante. But in a story with at least two separate in utero blood magic soul thefts, a Littlefinger body theft is not out of the realm of possibility, especially since George said "Puppet Masters" was one of his favorite books, and there is a character named "pod" in this story, and the Faceless Men are capable of this sort of thing. I do think that all of Braavos is a death cult that has ties to the Others though: Celebration of the Unmasking of Uthero: "The anniversary of the Uncloaking is celebrated every year in Braavos with ten days of feasting and masked revelry—a festival like none other in all the known world, culminating at midnight on the tenth day, when the Titan roars and tens of thousands of revelers and celebrants remove their masks as one." "Uthero" is very similar to "Other", at midnight they remove their masks--during the Long Night they reveal their true face, and the Titan roars, the Titan is a metaphor for the weirwood. In the House of the Worm, everyone lives underground because the sun has gone cold, and they hold a masquerade every 4 years, during the party they reveal the black and dying sun and they all remove their masks,--it is like a celebration of death and decay and nihilism. The main character is essentially Jaime, and he tries to stop the slide into death and darkness. Bloodraven, the Kindly Man, and Pyat all have the "white worm" symbolism, which is the god of death in that story. In book 1, the Others, the Old Gods (and uncarved heart trees), and the Faceless Men are all described as Faceless. Braavos and the Faceless Men are all about masks, and we are told not to trust people who wear masks: "He wore an owl mask when he spoke to you. By now he could be a jackal, a tiger, a sloth. Ser Barristan had hated the masks from the start and never more than now. Honest men should never need to hide their faces. " "Khaleesi, better a man should swallow scorpions than trust in the spawn of shadows, who dare not show their face beneath the sun. It is known." "There's been too much going around," Meera insisted, "and too many secrets. I don't like it. I don't like him. And I don't trust him. Those hands of his are bad enough. He hides his face, and will not speak a name. Who is he? What is he?" "Most sinister of all the sorcerers of Asshai are the shadowbinders, whose lacquered masks hide their faces from the eyes of gods and men."
  9. By Odin's Beard

    Poll: Is Jon Snow the son of a Dayne?

    So which is it?
  10. By Odin's Beard

    The Others "inside" man

    I agree with you, Petyr has done a very good job destabilizing Westeros, still wondering what his endgame might be, merely personal gain? Or is he working for a Braavos/Faceless/Others alliance? (did Petyr actually die from his wounds and get replaced by a doppleganger?) And I think Petyr Baelish's Mockingbird sigil is a reference to the real-world Operation Mockingbird, which was a propaganda/psyop campaign in which the CIA had a network of journalists that worked for them (either actual CIA assets or they were bribed) and the journalists would publish whatever info the Deep State wanted the public to hear--the idea being that the public trusted journalists and would be less skeptical of information coming from them and thus they could more effectively sway public opinion (usually towards war). George got his masters in journalism and taught journalism at Clarke College, so he was almost certainly aware of this. A mockingbird can mimic the voices of other birds. Petyr spreads disinfo to cause warfare and strife. He did it with Lysa, Tyrion's blade, Stannis getting cucked by Patchface . . . what else? Is he just a metaphor for the deep state eroding a nation? petra means "stone" his family's sigil was a stone giant. In Old French bailis means "debt collector" among other things. Baelish might have the white worm symbolism of Bloodraven, the Kindly Man, and Pyat, as Baylisascaris is a category of white parasitic worms, see also Lamiya-Bailis from Dying of the Light) In Latin, Baiulus means "carrier" as in "carrier pigeon" that carries messages, or "one who carries an activity out, manager"
  11. By Odin's Beard

    Playtime with Foreshadowing: Bran's Vision in AGOT

    Other things that have the "black blood" King Robert's infected wound: "The wine-soaked bandages that Grand Maester Pycelle had applied were already black with blood, and the smell off the wound was hideous. Ned's stomach turned." Drogo's infected wound: "Khal Drogo thrashed, fighting some unseen enemy. Black blood ran slow and thick from his open wound. "Your khal is good as dead, Princess." Ralf Kenning's infected/poisoned wound: "When he laid the edge of the blade against the swollen throat of the creature on the straw, the skin split open in a gout of black blood and yellow pus." Victarion's infected hand: "blood welled up as well as pus, blood so dark that it looked black in the lantern light. " Wights and dead things: "Once the heart has ceased to beat, a man's blood runs down into his extremities, where it thickens and congeals." His voice rattled in his throat, as thin and gaunt as he was. "His hands and feet swell up and turn as black as pudding. The rest of him becomes as white as milk." "He could see the torn veins in the dead man's wrist, iron worms in the pale flesh. His blood was a black dust." The Night's Watch, and Craster: "Once, aye. Black of garb and black of blood." "Once a man had said the words his blood was black. Black as a bastard's heart." "Craster's a terrible savage. He marries his daughters and obeys no laws but those he makes himself. And Dywen told Grenn he's got black blood in his veins." "Craster's more your kind than ours. His father was a crow who stole a woman out of Whitetree village, but after he had her he flew back t' his Wall. She went t' Castle Black once t' show the crow his son, but the brothers blew their horns and run her off.Craster's blood is black, and he bears a heavy curse. " "and the black blood rushing from his throat as the storm cracked overhead." Mel's Blood and Shadow Baby: " Panting, she squatted and spread her legs. Blood ran down her thighs, black as ink." "The red priestess shuddered. Blood trickled down her thigh, black and smoking. The fire was inside her, an agony, an ecstasy, filling her, searing her, transforming her." Theon's dream of direwolves: "When he glanced back over his shoulder he saw them coming, great wolves the size of horses with the heads of small children. Oh, mercy, mercy. Blood dripped from their mouths black as pitch, burning holes in the snow where it fell." Beric: "The blood came rushing out in a hot black gush. " Stoneheart: "Beneath her ravaged scalp, her face was shredded skin and black blood where she had raked herself with her nails." Dragon blood: " The dragon gave one last hiss and stretched out flat upon his belly. Black blood was flowing from the wound where the spear had pierced him, smoking where it dripped onto the scorched sands. He is fire made flesh, she thought, and so am I." "Lakes boiled or turned to acid, mountains burst, fiery fountains spewed molten rock a thousand feet into the air, red clouds rained down dragonglass and the black blood of demons" Black blood is associated with infection, corruption, death, demons, wights (both Ice and Fire), dragons, and the Night's Watch. Odd grouping, the Night's Watch is in some pretty poor company.
  12. By Odin's Beard

    Poll: Is Jon Snow the son of a Dayne?

    I agree with you here. But the same thing goes for Rhaegar: Ned: "For the first time in years, he found himself remembering Rhaegar Targaryen. He wondered if Rhaegar had frequented brothels; somehow he thought not." Rhaegar's love affair with your sister destroyed your family and tore apart the kingdom--leading to the deaths of your brother, father, and sister, and you are raising the guy's son, but haven't thought about him for years? That too would be weird. Both scenarios are odd. Also, he has what I think is a weirdly dispassionate or positive attitude towards Rhaegar.
  13. By Odin's Beard

    5 wackiest Crackpot "theories"

    And if there is anyone to blame for ancient aliens, it is Lovecraft, because Sitchin and von Daniken just blatantly riped him off. Lovecraftian lore is inseparable from ancient aliens. I would argue that to the degree that any work invokes Lovecraft, it invokes ancient aliens. eta: Fish people/Deep Ones/Toad God, came down from the moon. Cthulhu and Old Ones, came down from the stars. The Black Goat, came down from the stars. Things that live under the ice in Antarctica, came down from the stars. Strange black stones, artifacts of an entirely black traveling planet that is hiding out in our solar system. Church of Starry Wisdom, worships magic black stone that fell from the sky and can connect users mind with other planets. Grey plague wasting disease, caused by an alien in a meteorite.
  14. By Odin's Beard

    5 wackiest Crackpot "theories"

    So you don't know about our Lord and Savior Yakub? Such heresy should not be tolerated.
  15. By Odin's Beard

    Poll: Is Jon Snow the son of a Dayne?

    Your writing style seems to be using extreme hyperbole in order to shut people down who disagree with you--you are doing it here again. I do not have a dog in this fight, this morning was the first time I have even given serious consideration to this topic, and with fresh eyes, this was my interpretation of events in the books. Just pointing out passages that I didn't see people focusing on, and as naive as I am, I thought you would find my quote pulls helpful. I posed what I thought was a non-controvertial interpretation of events--that Ned danced with Ashara, but was afraid to make the first move because he thought she was hot and he was too shy to ask, and you replied with "There is no evidence of that whatsoever"--Which took me aback, because there is some amount of evidence, even if it was somewhat ambiguous, and made me think you were just trying to flame me. Then later you essentially said I am full of shit, and am cherry-picking quotes to fit my agenda.
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