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Jamie Lannister

Tommen and Tywin (book spoilers)

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I think that conversation was one of their best book deviations so far. It was a great establishing character moment for Joff's successor (who's obviously going to differ a bit from that kid we saw on Cersei's lap back in S2) and both of them nailed it. It really captured the sort of person the new king is and Tywin's history lesson was entertaining. It admittedly felt bizarrely upbeat, but still... great scene. This Tommen has potential.


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Great scene. Tywin came across as almost human there in dealing with Tommen. But he's playing Tommen just the way he wants to.


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Loved it. Tywin effectively placed Tommen under his guardianship and Cersei wasn't even able to get a word in. He's going to make sure that there isn't a Joffrey 2.0 (or an Aerys II 3.0). As for what came after...well, anyway.


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It really was a good scene. It showed what Tywin really thought of Joff and symbolized how he would be taking Tommen away from Cersei's clutches.


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I loved this conversation. Utterly masterful. Tywin was simultaneously giving decent advice and smoothly bringing Tommen under his total control, moulding him into the pliable, tractable, deferential puppet king he needs him to be.



I'm liking New Tommen so far, although admittedly there wasn't a lot to go off in one scene.



That bit about Tywin starting to give Tommen the Talk piqued my interest a bit. I'm very curious to see how they're going to deal with an aged-up Tommen marrying Margaery.


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Tywin did note that Tommen wasn't of age and didn't have the "birds and the bees" conversation.

How odd. Arya and Bran are younger (than new Tommen) and I think they kinda know.

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Could Tywin had been in on the Joffery murder? No evidence but he is capable of it. He wants his puppets and Joffery was out of control.


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The conversation was excellent, but the way the casting of Tommen has been handled is awful. I bet some non-readers are thinking "when did Cersei find time between S03 E10 and S04 E02 to give birth to a 16 year old boy?".


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Sentiments echoed..



And the more I think of it, if Tommen wasn't re-cast now you're just looking at dealing with 3 seasons of, however minor he'll be in the show, another kid aging very awkwardly.. at least the new actor, who looks to be 15 or so won't change much going forward.

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Could Tywin had been in on the Joffery murder?

No. That theory has never made any sense.

But now that Joffrey's dead, he's coldblooded enough to see that it's ultimately a winning situation for him.

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The conversation was excellent, but the way the casting of Tommen has been handled is awful. I bet some non-readers are thinking "when did Cersei find time between S03 E10 and S04 E02 to give birth to a 16 year old boy?".

Soap Opera Rapid Aging Syndrome strikes again!

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Could Tywin had been in on the Joffery murder? No evidence but he is capable of it. He wants his puppets and Joffery was out of control.

i always had a hunch in the books that it was an "off the pages" deal with Lady Oleana. Both Tyrell and Lannister knew that Joff was a liabilty but Tommen was young enough to be groomed into a stable, efficient Monarch for Margeary.

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The conversation was excellent, but the way the casting of Tommen has been handled is awful. I bet some non-readers are thinking "when did Cersei find time between S03 E10 and S04 E02 to give birth to a 16 year old boy?".

Not sure that's so much a re-casting issue as it is a failure to follow exposition that, while subtle enough not to be corny (most of the time), could honestly be followed by a monkey if you were able to give it reference points.. i.e I'd guess that half of the show-watchers don't remember or never caught onto the fact that Cersei/Jaime had 2 other children to begin with.

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i always had a hunch in the books that it was an "off the pages" deal with Lady Oleana. Both Tyrell and Lannister knew that Joff was a liabilty but Tommen was young enough to be groomed into a stable, efficient Monarch for Margeary.

I kind of think Tywin knew the Tyrells were responsible, but he couldn't afford to antagonize them so he went with Tyrion as a scapegoat, and he actually benefited a lot from the whole thing

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No. That theory has never made any sense.

But now that Joffrey's dead, he's coldblooded enough to see that it's ultimately a winning situation for him.

Please explain why. I would like your side of things

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Loved it. I don't think he was just being manipulative when he said Tommen had the right temperament for it. He knows he won't live forever, but he also knows Tommen's a kid and needs to learn how to rule. He never bothered to say anything that wasn't backhanded to Joffrey. I really, really liked that Tommen wasn't just spouting stuff but trying to thoughtfully answer, and "thought" his way to the more apt conclusion. Tommen's a puppet now. Under Cersei he'd be little more. Pity we know enough to have a headstart on the season's turn. Imma hoping Tommen gets more screentime, as much as I love the pint-sized arbitrator of beetly disputes.


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