R+L=J v.82

[FrozenFire3]

Can you provide the page numbers please, because I've searched for some of those quotes and can't find them.

Me neither tbh. Thanks for pointing that out.

[Consigliere]

This has probably been covered a dozen times but I seen these quotes used as parallels between Rhaegar and Jon in a Youtube comment (they can be clever, every now and then :D)-

"Rhaegar had a sadness about him. I'd never met someone quite so puzzling, until I met your brother." - Baristan to Dany, ADWD.

"There is a sadness about you Jon Snow, and you puzzle me."- Melisandre to Jon, ADWD.

Then these two-

"My father always said that Rhaegar's melancholy would bring his downfall." - Cersei, AFFC

"Fix your melancholy boy. We don't need it here. It will bring your downfall one day if you don't." - Mormont to Jon, AGOT

Exactly the same!!!!!

What is the source of these quotes? I have searched through all the books and none of these quotes appear.

[WhiteOwl18]

What is the source of these quotes? I have searched through all the books and none of these quotes appear.

I have the ebooks and I searched all of them for these quotes. They don't exist. I think someone on youtube made up these quotes.

[Chebyshov]

^Yeah, the best I could find was this, from ASOS:

“Perhaps so, Your Grace.” Whitebeard paused a moment. “But I am not certain it was in Rhaegar to be happy.”
“You make him sound so sour,” Dany protested.
“Not sour, no, but . . . there was a melancholy to Prince Rhaegar, a sense . . . ” The old man hesitated again.

"Say it,” she urged. “A sense . . . ?”
“ . . . of doom. He was born in grief, my queen, and that shadow hung over him all his days.”

Couldn't find anything with the Old Bear calling him "melancholy," but there's this: "The Old Bear sighed. "You are not the only one touched by this war," which is kind of him calling Jon out for that. In the same scene that Jon answers something sullenly. But, no exact phrasing parallels, at least not from those quotes.

Not that it matters; we still know that Jon is a bit moody and sullen in general.

[Suzanna Stormborn]

Do we?

Hm. Could you point me to where we know that? And enticed doesn't mean joined up. It just means he was thinking about it. Perhaps helping Lyanna escape was the final thing he did before he went to the wall. He decided to help her knowing he was leaving anyway

The app states that Benjen took the plea to heart, not that he wanted to join immediately. How is that blundering in interpretation?

He was still the Stark in Winterfell during the war.

Thanks Rhaenys_Targaryen. I wasn't saying anything was definite about Benjen, only that he specifically showed an interest in the NW before R+L. WHich suggests that he already had it in mind, and the sole reason for him joining the NW was not because he was so upset about LYanna. Maybe that added to his reasoning later on. But his interest was already piqued.

[~DarkHorse~]

Urgh, why would someone make them up!? :bang: They got me all excited for nothing.

I know there is this quote from Baristan- "There was a melancholy to Rhaegar, a sense... of doom." (ASOS, chapter 42).

Perhaps they rephrased it? The person didn't seem like a troll and they referenced the book and person who said the quote. However, I can't find the quotes either. :frown5:

Anyway, I've pointed it out to the person, they might have a reference or source. Although, I'm starting to doubt it.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Thanks Rhaenys_Targaryen. I wasn't saying anything was definite about Benjen, only that he specifically showed an interest in the NW before R+L. WHich suggests that he already had it in mind, and the sole reason for him joining the NW was not because he was so upset about LYanna. Maybe that added to his reasoning later on. But his interest was already piqued.

Yeah, ever since I learned that info on Benjen, it has been my belief as well that Benjen had expressed interest in the NW since 281AC at least, but that the war, and perhaps even specific events in the war or leading to the war, are what caused him to join at such a young age. Had the war not happened, Benjen would most likely have joined anyway, since he was already interested. Only he would have joined at a later age in that case.

[MtnLion]

IICR, in the app (or GRRM?) is said that Robert didn't take well Rhaegar crowning Lyanna. I don't see why would he mind if she's not betrothed to him.

(Rhaegar, you troll...)

Ned held Mya Stone as a baby (at the Eyrie). Then Ned and Robert went from the Eyrie to Harrenhal. After Harrenhal Ned retunrs to Winterfell to have the betrothal discussion with Lyanna. It makes sense that this discussion is before Ned presents Robert's proposal to Rickard.

Robert may be upset because he has presented his proposal to Ned, already, and sees that the prince may be a challenger for Lyanna's hand.

[BearQueen87]

Ned held Mya Stone as a baby (at the Eyrie). Then Ned and Robert went from the Eyrie to Harrenhal. After Harrenhal Ned retunrs to Winterfell to have the betrothal discussion with Lyanna. It makes sense that this discussion is before Ned presents Robert's proposal to Rickard.

Robert may be upset because he has presented his proposal to Ned, already, and sees that the prince may be a challenger for Lyanna's hand.

But wasn't Rhaegar already married to Elia of Dorne? He can't really be a threat to Lyanna's hand if he's already married. I know the Targs have a tendancy to marry multiple women, but when was the last time the heirs/crowned prince/kings actually did that?