No Arianne Martell?

[JagLover]

Good for you. Different people like different aspects of the storyline.

I loved all 3 editions (Dorne, Aegon and IB) and Aegon was a breath of fresh air in the books. On the other hand, I am completely indifferent to Dany.

The Dornish chapters don't take up much space and are integral to the main plot so i'm fine with them. Everything else is either a late diversion in the story, which would be fine if this were going to be a 10 book series, or something that wouldnt have had a POV present in the first three books.

Also most are fed up with Dany in ADWD, which is because her entire storyline is a holding pattern to keep her from moving on.

[FreeParking]

Good for you. Different people like different aspects of the storyline.

I loved all 3 editions (Dorne, Aegon and IB) and Aegon was a breath of fresh air in the books. On the other hand, I am completely indifferent to Dany.

That is why I used the word "I"

[Ser Eric]

Tyrion meeting young griff and figuring out his identity

Landing in westeros

meeting with Dornish

Conflict

Future 2nd dance of dragons?

How does this not take hours of the show to do properly?

What do you mean by 'hours'?

His identity reveal and landing can be done this season and it wouldn't even take all that much time. What would they even spend that time on? Dornish whores? I very doubt time is the reason why Aegon will be cut. It will most likely be down to budget issues relating to the GC invasion. Same with Victarion, I guess.

[Ser Eric]

The Dornish chapters don't take up much space and are integral to the main plot so i'm fine with them. Everything else is either a late diversion in the story, which would be fine if this were going to be a 10 book series, or something that wouldnt have had a POV present in the first three books.

Also most are fed up with Dany in ADWD, which is because her entire storyline is a holding pattern to keep her from moving on.

I am not sure how you can say that. Euron is clearly important to the Citadel plot, and GRRM devoted a prologue for that plotline.

I don't think any of it is diversion. It was all obviously intended but when you compress 5 years worth of story into a book then there will be some structural issues. Dany is the obvious example and a character Martin should have devoted less chapters to because it got quite tedious. Take off 100-200 pages from the Dany/Tyrion storyline from Dance and it's as good as any other book in the series.

[thetitansbastard]

probably no Victarion or Euron either, its a shame. Trystane is probably secretly Aegon.

[JagLover]

What do you mean by 'hours'?

His identity reveal and landing can be done this season and it wouldn't even take all that much time. What would they even spend that time on? Dornish whores? I very doubt time is the reason why Aegon will be cut. It will most likely be down to budget issues relating to the GC invasion. Same with Victarion, I guess.

You are ignoring the fact that a plotline like Faegon is a season, or two season arc, if done properly. There are not only scenes with FAegon himself but scenes with other characters who are trying to deal with him.

If when Dany does actually land in westeros and her first conflict is with him, then that takes a considerably amount of time, and narrative arcs would determine that this would be the focus for a season, or half of it.

That is why the show does not have time for it, not for the time spent needing to film scenes with him, which could be truncated and only be a 10-20 minutes for his material up until the end of ADWD I agree, but because this would be the dominant theme for a season or two.

[Ser Eric]

You are ignoring the fact that a plotline like Faegon is a season, or two season arc, if done properly. There are not only scenes with FAegon himself but scenes with other characters who are trying to deal with him.

If when Dany does actually land in westeros and her first conflict is with him, then that takes a considerably amount of time, and narrative arcs would determine that this would be the focus for a season, or half of it.

That is why the show does not have time for it, not for the time spent needing to film scenes with him, which could be truncated and only be a 10-20 minutes for his material up until the end of ADWD I agree, but because this would be the dominant theme for a season or two.

What other characters? The only other characters bothered about Aegon would be in KL and Dorne and that can be done in a couple of council meetings. Those in the North have no reason at all to be talking about Aegon. I think you are exaggerating quite a bit. And why would all that even be a bad thing? Aegon provides a nice contrast to Dany. While Dany is hesitant, indecisive and slow, Aegon is demanding, decisive and to the point in his chapters. His scenes with the Golden Company and then taking of Storms end would be prime TV material. And what would they even do with the time they save from not casting Aegon? More whores? More of the already tedious Dany storyline? Or more scenes that fake no sense at all or more beetle talk?

They can streamline certain parts of the Dance (Tyrion and Dany mainly) but Aegon's storyline is very well paced and quite perfect for TV.

[MacReady]

Looks like they're going to have some major changes this season. No announcements about Arianne, Quentyn or any of the Greyjoys. Part of me hopes that they bring them along at a later point but I figure if they aren't going to introduce any of them now then how it is going to affect the story.

Like if Euron doesn't kill Balon then why is Yara/Asha going to flee the Iron Islands and get captured by Stannis. If Victarian isn't on the show then who is going to get Dany out of Meereen (that's assuming that its Victarian who brings Dany to Westeros).

Also haven't heard anything about Connington and Aegon, though they might be keeping that secret but if they don't cast them then what does that mean for Tyrion when he finally gets off that ship.

If there is no Aegon and no Quentyn to try and woo Dany then what is exactly Doran's secret plan to try and take down the Lannister's?

[Steelborn]

So, it seems Arianne is going straight to her demise in the Stormlands. I can only wonder how... although we can never guess a thing in these books.

And I wonder if the audience will care enough for the crowning plot or dornish overall, with only the sand snakes & Trystane, I certainly won't.

[Ser Pounce FTW]

So, it seems Arianne is going straight to her demise in the Stormlands. I can only wonder how... although we can never guess a thing in these books.

And I wonder if the audience will care enough for the crowning plot or dornish overall, with only the sand snakes & Trystane, I certainly won't.

It might be quite a while before Arianne meets her demise, if that is indeed her fate. Not being in the show doesn't mean that she's going to definitely die. And the audience, i.e. unsullied, won't know any other crowning plot but what is shown, however, readers may or may not like it, depending on how it's filmed.

[JagLover]

Looks like they're going to have some major changes this season. No announcements about Arianne, Quentyn or any of the Greyjoys. Part of me hopes that they bring them along at a later point but I figure if they aren't going to introduce any of them now then how it is going to affect the story.

Like if Euron doesn't kill Balon then why is Yara/Asha going to flee the Iron Islands and get captured by Stannis. If Victarian isn't on the show then who is going to get Dany out of Meereen (that's assuming that its Victarian who brings Dany to Westeros).

Also haven't heard anything about Connington and Aegon, though they might be keeping that secret but if they don't cast them then what does that mean for Tyrion when he finally gets off that ship.

If there is no Aegon and no Quentyn to try and woo Dany then what is exactly Doran's secret plan to try and take down the Lannister's?

Euron can still kill Balon we just don't need to see him.

Dany has the same number of ships that Victorian was bring in the show already.

Tyrion can move swiftly on to being captured by Jorah.

[zhivik]

Didn't GRRM say he was writing battles that he thought HBO couldn't handle with the budget? This confirms at least two battles (he said "battles") involving dragons, IMO.

I'd say the first battle is pretty obvious, after all it is directly referred to in the already released (or publicly read) chapters from The Winds of Winter. The second one could easily be Volantis, there is a strong implication about something brewing in that city in A Dance with Dragons. All of this excludes (f)Aegon and hence the need for Arianne Martell - though I'd still miss having a sultry exotic lass seducing noble knights in the show :)

[lyannaisalive]

I'd say the first battle is pretty obvious, after all it is directly referred to in the already released (or publicly read) chapters from The Winds of Winter. The second one could easily be Volantis, there is a strong implication about something brewing in that city in A Dance with Dragons. All of this excludes (f)Aegon and hence the need for Arianne Martell - though I'd still miss having a sultry exotic lass seducing noble knights in the show :)

Except the show never shows any battle. They show right before or right after except for the Battle of Blackwater.

[RooseIsLoose]

The general disregard for Aegon on this forums is pretty irritating. He has landed in Westeros with 10,000 men and a seemingly legitimate claim to the throne. He is a big deal. Arianne up to this point is fairly replaceable, her actions could be merged with another character. Aegon's defining characteristic is that he is supposedly Targaryen and will likely clash with Dany. He is irreplaceable!

And Stannis got something like 15 mins screentime in S4, pretty sure they could fit Aegon in. Especially considering half his scenes are likely to be with Tyrion.

[Ingelheim]

Tyrion meeting young griff and figuring out his identity

Landing in westeros

meeting with Dornish

Conflict

Future 2nd dance of dragons?

How does this not take hours of the show to do properly?

1) Episode 1 and 2: Varys and/or Illyrio introduce Aegon. Oberyn introduced Aegon already, and he just needed one episode for that.

2) Episode 3, and 4: Tyrion is with Aegon. At the end of episode 4 Jorah gets him

3) Episode 5 and 6: He's with Jorah.

4) Episode 8 and 9: Meeren storyline

And I'm only giving Dinklage 8 episodes, when he usually has 9 per season. I'd probably say he'd get 3 episodes with Aegon, Griff, etc.

It's not that hard to introduce Aegon; not when Oberyn needed just one to introduce Elia and him.

[Janicia]

The general disregard for Aegon on this forums is pretty irritating. He has landed in Westeros with 10,000 men and a seemingly legitimate claim to the throne. He is a big deal. Arianne up to this point is fairly replaceable, her actions could be merged with another character. Aegon's defining characteristic is that he is supposedly Targaryen and will likely clash with Dany. He is irreplaceable!

And Stannis got something like 15 mins screentime in S4, pretty sure they could fit Aegon in. Especially considering half his scenes are likely to be with Tyrion.

It isn't just screentime. It is also a matter of how many named characters the show can juggle, and whether spending time with a new character is more satisfying than spending time with an exiting character. Aegon's personality in the books so far has been pretty bland and naive, though he did have the little temper tantrum with Tyrion. Aegon just doesn't seem to be a particularly interesting person, especially when the show has already had Robb and Tommen as fairly upstanding boy kings. If the show does portray Aegon, I think they'd make him darker and less naive.

People who like Arienne are interested in her sultry politician ways. In the books, she is a more interesting person than Aegon. In the show, Margery is sultry politician (and Sansa is on that path), so Arienne is less of a standout.

[boojam]

Except the show never shows any battle. They show right before or right after except for the Battle of Blackwater.

The battle for the Wall?

[RooseIsLoose]

It isn't just screentime. It is also a matter of how many named characters the show can juggle, and whether spending time with a new character is more satisfying than spending time with an exiting character. Aegon's personality in the books so far has been pretty bland and naive, though he did have the little temper tantrum with Tyrion. Aegon just doesn't seem to be a particularly interesting person, especially when the show has already had Robb and Tommen as fairly upstanding boy kings. If the show does portray Aegon, I think they'd make him darker and less naive.

People who like Arienne are interested in her sultry politician ways. In the books, she is a more interesting person than Aegon. In the show, Margery is sultry politician (and Sansa is on that path), so Arienne is less of a standout.

That's only because he's only in about 2 chapters in ADWD. And if it weren't for the fact we've spent more time with Daenerys I'd also say she's pretty bland and naive.

[lyannaisalive]

The battle for the Wall?

Yes that too. They never showed any of Robbs battles or Tywins battles except BW. So just because they don't have budget doesn't necessarily mean the battles have to do with dragons, I agree it probably does, but it doesn't have to.

[boojam]

Yes that too. They never showed any of Robbs battles or Tywins battles except BW. So just because they don't have budget doesn't necessarily mean the battles have to do with dragons, I agree it probably does, but it doesn't have to.

Even George does not have the Battles to take Yunkai and Meereen 'on page' they are told as flash-backs.

In that sense they are more abbreviated in the books, than on the show.

No way the show could afford the taking of Yunkai, I did miss the fact that the strategy , in the books, was pretty much Dany's.

Then the taking of Meereen , had a suggestion from Daario but Dany had to make the decision.

The method at Meereen , on the show, was apparently Dany's idea, but is 'off-screen' , less crude than in the novel.

Actually her tactics at Astapor, Yunkai and Meereen made her seem Alexander the Great-like, George's Dany in Dance seemed to lose it, which could happen.

I could buy some of that , but not all of it.