Social Justice Warriors, unite!

[Athias]

Clearly you tried hard given it took all of 30 seconds to pull up.

http://www.pnas.org/content/109/41/16474

Thank you for providing the study.

[Cold Crashing Waves]

Yes, yes it is. So why are you being offended by people complaining about a problematic shirt again?

I'm not offended at all. Why would I be? I just think it's silly.

[Arthmail]

While concern trolls abound, I think you're missing the bigger picture. This is a problem, a deeply rooted endemic problem that extends across the spectrum of society. The shirt in and of itself is mostly stupid noise, but sometimes, for people forced to face the same bullshit over and over, its easy to lose your temper over such things.

And some of the protests, the continuous inability to understand the basic fundamentals of what is going on in this thread, remind me of that scene in the Shawshank Redemption. "Obtuse, is it deliberate?"

[MerenthaClone]

Man, it was the coolest day of his life and he chose a shirt given to him by a friend to wear on national TV. A shirt that, yes, he shouldn't have worn. There's no need to make the guy cry, though. A few pieces of "hey man, that wasn't cool, maybe think about it next time" would have been more than enough, since, like many people, I doubt he was even aware that it could be problematic. One, it looks better. Two, your point actually gets across better, since ideally the articles in question would explain it better. Three, its basically the coolest day of that guy's life. He helped land a rocket on a goddamned comet and then got to go on national TV about it.

Yes, I am aware that I am one of the people who isn't potentially affected by this guy's shirt. I just think there's no call to being an asshole to someone unless they've been an asshole first. Ignorance isn't the same, and I do think he was just ignorant/unthinking about it, in part because there's really no women in his field. I don't know. My initial impression is "too far" but at the same time, I'm not dealing with the bullshit that many, many people deal with on a regular basis, so its easy for me to say that.

[Larry of the Lawn]

It isn't, at all. This 'backlash' is idiotic. People are always scavenging for something to be offended by these days. It's pathetic.

Pretty impressive that you can tell what is or isn't offensive to others .

[Shryke]

I doubt he was even aware that it could be problematic.

That would be the whole problem.

Ignorance isn't the same, and I do think he was just ignorant/unthinking about it, in part because there's really no women in his field. I don't know. My initial impression is "too far" but at the same time, I'm not dealing with the bullshit that many, many people deal with on a regular basis, so its easy for me to say that.

Geez, I wonder why?

[Shryke]

Well, if you accept that the main problem is with the industry, then it does seem unfair to pile onto one person until he cries.

It seems foolish to me that someone would consider wearing that shirt on national t.v., if at all, but I can't understand the use in holding both society and the ignorant propagator to that level of blame.

Why is he crying? Did anyone decide "let's make him cry"?

Cause it mostly seems like he did something incredibly fucking stupid, got caught on camera doing it, everyone said "What are you, an idiot?" and then ... I guess he cried.

[Shryke]

I technically agree, although I think you are understating the bolded part. Especially compared to the two adjectives used to describe his own mistake.

It just feels very unnecessary and high-school-esque, the way that everyone needs to reiterate the same criticism. Far better MerenthaClone's suggestion, that you explain the issues calmly to a clearly ignorant guy.

This is an utterly silly sentiment. You are acting as if the world got together and agreed on a strategy or something.

People just reacted. Alot of them. Without coordination. Stop pretending otherwise.

[Athias]

I technically agree, although I think you are understating the bolded part. Especially compared to the two adjectives used to describe his own mistake.

It just feels very unnecessary and high-school-esque, the way that everyone needs to reiterate the same criticism. Far better MerenthaClone's suggestion, that you explain the issues calmly to a clearly ignorant guy.

To what exactly was he ignorant? The just plain inappropriateness of wearing such a shirt at a nationally televised event? The "sexism" that it implies? Or the baggage that some may be holding on to, in the industry, as a result of their perspectives on sexuality in work environments?

[snake]

Cyber bullies. Tsk tsk tsk

[Shryke]

To what exactly was he ignorant? The just plain inappropriateness of wearing such a shirt at a nationally televised event? The "sexism" that it implies? Or the baggage that some may be holding on to, in the industry, as a result of their perspectives on sexuality in work environments?

He was apparently ignorant of what constitutes proper attire for work. And television. And, frankly, for going outside but that's more a matter of awful taste.

The fact that his boss didn't send him home the minute he walked in the door that morning is an indictment of the practices at his workplace.

[Athias]

He was apparently ignorant of what constitutes proper attire for work. And television. And, frankly, for going outside but that's more a matter of awful taste.

The fact that his boss didn't send him home the minute he walked in the door that morning is an indictment of the practices at his workplace.

So, what would have been proper attire?

[The Iceman of the North]

So, what would have been proper attire?

Any other shirt who was not sexist, racist, or otherwise offending?

[Shryke]

So, what would have been proper attire?

A shirt that would qualify as proper dress at even the most lax of workplaces. You know, something without crass sexualization or anything else blatantly offensive on it?

Like, seriously, how old are you? Have you never worked in a professional environment? Even the most highly casual dresscode workplaces would tell you to go the fuck home if you came in wearing that.

[sologdin]

That shirt is ugly as fuck

i know, right? whatever its politics, by the gods it's gauche.

[Athias]

A shirt that would qualify as proper dress at even the most lax of workplaces. You know, something without crass sexualization or anything else blatantly offensive on it?

Why is it crass sexualization?

Like, seriously, how old are you? Have you never worked in a professional environment? Even the most highly casual dresscode workplaces would tell you to go the fuck home if you came in wearing that.

First, Shryke, a lady never reveals her age. Secondly, I have and do work in a professional environment. And there some casual dress-codes I've seen that would allow for this. I've seen much more graphic depictions than that--bordering on pornography. (None of whom were sent home.) However, none of this has anything to do with what I asked--which is pretty straightforward.

i know, right? whatever its politics, by the gods it's gauche.

...gauche? :) . I'm only teasing. It's been a while since I've seen that used as a criticism.

[mormont]

Athias, while the tactic of professing ignorance as a rhetorical technique has a long and noble history, it does have its limits. Instead of constantly asking people to explain everything to you, why not switch things up a bit: perhaps state your position and defend it?

[Shryke]

First, Shryke, a lady never reveals her age. Secondly, I have and do work in a professional environment. And there some casual dress-codes I've seen that would allow for this. I've seen much more graphic depictions than that--bordering on pornography. (None of whom were sent home.) However, none of this has anything to do with what I asked--which is pretty straightforward.

Yeah, no, I'm not buying this shit. Not given your previous posting history and certainly not given, you know, reality.

[Edda van Heefmstra Ruston]

A shirt that would qualify as proper dress at even the most lax of workplaces. You know, something without crass sexualization or anything else blatantly offensive on it?

Like, seriously, how old are you? Have you never worked in a professional environment? Even the most highly casual dresscode workplaces would tell you to go the fuck home if you came in wearing that.

Given the black collar, he appears to be wearing the mission polo shirt underneath the gunner ladies. From other photos, it seems like "wacky" shirts are his thing, so I'm sure everyone expected *something*, but I'm not sure how long before the cameras were rolling he actually put on the shirt. It's possible that nobody really had time to take a look -- and notice what it was -- and tell him that he may want to think about changing it.

Now, frankly, I've seen some interesting discussions come out of this about who defines what "professional" means, and the various cultural baggage that we tend to drag along with this. Having said that, while I'm sorry that Dr Taylor was so upset, I don't think people are wrong to object to the shirt and the type of atmosphere it may unthinkingly encourage.

I also keep seeing this bit repeated that a friend of his made it for him -- a FEMALE friend, as if that negates any possible bad reaction -- but it's available online from a shop here (currently out of stock, unsurprisingly). Either that's quite a coincidence, or someone's received some bad information along the line. (Not saying it isn't coincidental, mind you -- the fabric's undoubtedly available, and she may well have sewn his up for him, or even had the shirt company make it specially for him. But it's a space mission - why not wear one of the tacky, wacky galaxy shirts instead?)

[Shryke]

No, that's not at all what I'm saying. It doesn't require a fucking committee to realise that, since everyone else is tweeting the same thing as you, it isn't necessary or helpful to repeat the same sentiment.

Yeah, it pretty much does. Cause chances are you just tweeted it or whatever based on your own feelings. That's how that giant pile of people happen in the first place.

Like, you seem utterly mystified by the idea that something alot of people find stupid/offensive would get a response from alot of people.