Pem123 Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 WOW! It took 7 posts for this to go from "Did Theon Deserve to Become Reek" to "Dany Should be Burned Alive!". Is that a new record? Danny is a delusional character, believe it was her birthright to rule seven kingdom. i never liked the Targa, they are by far the most arrogant family of all time. and i believe the first man, andals and Rhoynar should be ruled by the first man, andals and Rhoynar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Onion Sleight Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 If he deserved it? No.If some people do? Yes.I think absolutely nobody deserves it! Im going to go out on a crazy bleeding heart, liberal, intersectional feminist, Social Justice Warrior limb and say: No one deserves to be tortured.:agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted November 25, 2014 Author Share Posted November 25, 2014 Danny is a delusional character, believe it was her birthright to rule seven kingdom. i never liked the Targa, they are by far the most arrogant family of all time. and i believe the first man, andals and Rhoynar should be ruled by the first man, andals and Rhoynar. For sure. Too much incest in that family, not enough redeemable Targs to outweigh the harm the deficient Targs did or would do ( Aerys II, Viserys) I.e a Rhaegar was not worth having as king, if his son may or may not be like Viserys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pem123 Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 For sure. Too much incest in that family, not enough redeemable Targs to outweigh the harm the deficient Targs did or would do ( Aerys II, Viserys) I.e a Rhaegar was not worth having as king, if his son may or may not be like Viserys. True, but im afraid GRRM make the Dragon too OP, it will be weird to see Dany losses with Dragons, although i hope she did losses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A spoon of knife and fork Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 What I think is a little more subtly disturbing is all of the people who went from hating Theon to thinking he's great after he is tortured by Ramsey. There is nothing redemptive about torture itself and I hope GRRM wouldn't want us to think Theon is "redeemed" through torture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 True, but im afraid GRRM make the Dragon too OP, it will be weird to see Dany losses with Dragons, although i hope she did losses. I hope a Kraken kills one of her dragons. The look on her face would be priceless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Bean Corbray Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Because we are a bloodthirsty culture that cannot conceive of a "justice" outside of the paradigm of punishment & revenge. In these books, GRRM is calling us out on this, and I adore him for it. He indulges this fetish of ours, and then shows us what monsters we are for actually wanting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted November 25, 2014 Author Share Posted November 25, 2014 What I think is a little more subtly disturbing is all of the people who went from hating Theon to thinking he's great after he is tortured by Ramsey. There is nothing redemptive about torture itself and I hope GRRM wouldn't want us to think Theon is "redeemed" through torture. I think he is redeemed by being sad about all the bad things he has done. Even more so I think he is redeemed by saving Jeyne Poole from Ramsay's clutches. That took real courage, and Jeyne is probably 20 times better off with Stannis' troops than she is as Ramsay's wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolorous22 Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Oh Theon...He deserved to suffer, aye! Ramsey though, that is something completely different. I cannot agree that nobody deserves it as I think Ramsey himself could do with a taste of his own medicine...Theon is a fascinating character. He possesses a very unique level of stupid. He's not completely dumb, just dumb enough to keep the story moving in an interesting way. Similar to Cersei perhaps? If he did what he was told just once I expect he'd have a pretty nice life right now. He had the heart of a Stark, but the brain of an Iron Born. Proud and stupid all at once. Too easily manipulated he just wanted the quickest way of living a life of power and luxury(and daddy's approval). For me it's proof that the Starks treated him more as a foster kid than a hostage. I just do not buy the 'hostage' rational. That's a black and white way of putting it. The contrast between Bolton and Stark hostage policy is blatant. What's interesting though is that neither Bolton nor Stark hospitality can ultimately win Theon's loyalty. In fact, he didn't need much persuading to betray the Starks who were kinder and gentler with him. Ramsey he still fears which makes you wonder which family is more effective at ruling it's people... then again, I bet he'd be p*ss*n his breeches if the Ned was still alive to avenge his people. Overall, I don't think most people in aSoIaF deserve the crap they get but the stupid one's make it too easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted November 25, 2014 Author Share Posted November 25, 2014 Oh Theon...He deserved to suffer, aye! Ramsey though, that is something completely different. I cannot agree that nobody deserves it as I think Ramsey himself could do with a taste of his own medicine...Theon is a fascinating character. He possesses a very unique level of stupid. He's not completely dumb, just dumb enough to keep the story moving in an interesting way. Similar to Cersei perhaps? If he did what he was told just once I expect he'd have a pretty nice life right now. He had the heart of a Stark, but the brain of an Iron Born. Proud and stupid all at once. Too easily manipulated he just wanted the quickest way of living a life of power and luxury(and daddy's approval). For me it's proof that the Starks treated him more as a foster kid than a hostage. I just do not buy the 'hostage' rational. That's a black and white way of putting it. The contrast between Bolton and Stark hostage policy is blatant. What's interesting though is that neither Bolton nor Stark hospitality can ultimately win Theon's loyalty. In fact, he didn't need much persuading to betray the Starks who were kinder and gentler with him. Ramsey he still fears which makes you wonder which family is more effective at ruling it's people... then again, I bet he'd be p*ss*n his breeches if the Ned was still alive to avenge his people. Overall, I don't think most people in aSoIaF deserve the crap they get but the stupid one's make it too easy. I wonder why he didn't take to Bolton hospitality. It was after all, Ramsay who helped make him more sympathetic/redeemable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Bean Corbray Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 And lest anyone think I'm high horsing it over here... Yes I was happy when that little fuck Joffrey choked to death at his wedding. My hands are just as dirty and I'm a monster too. [Although... arguably a case of self-defense if Margaery is the final poisoner] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaworth'sShipmate Posted November 25, 2014 Author Share Posted November 25, 2014 And lest anyone think I'm high horsing it over here... Yes I was happy when that little fuck Joffrey choked to death at his wedding. My hands are just as dirty and I'm a monster too. [Although... arguably a case of self-defense if Margaery is the final poisoner] It was the grandmother. It sort of was self-defense, because based on what Sansa told her, she believed Joffrey would just beat up/ abuse her granddaughter, as he did to Sansa, after they were married. Maybe he wouldn't have quite as much though I think Joffrey is a twisted sadist, but I think he hated Sansa, by association with her "traitor father" who threatened his throne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mother of The Others Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 Because of the books. I'd cite the events in the books as my main citation. The series of events which took place inside the novels, to clarify. Taken together as a-hole, Theon's choices tend to foster a belief (in the mind) that Theon is worthy. Deserving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maid So Fair Posted November 25, 2014 Share Posted November 25, 2014 He deserved punishment but no one deserves Ramsay. Except maybe Walder Frey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acnologia Targaryen Posted November 28, 2014 Share Posted November 28, 2014 man ain't nobody but a rapist deserves to get their balls chopped off. I felt for him when that happened, but such is his story its most people that really love the starks say that though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INCBlackbird Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 because lots of people seem to have empathy problems and combine that with not thinking further then "the starks are the good guys everyone against them is EVIL" you get people saying Theon deserves to be tortured (how ironic since most of these people also say he deserves it all because of all the "horrible" things he did in winterfell, while ignoring that Robb Stark (to just name one) was responsible for more of those kinds of attrocities) that being said : NO ONE DESERVES TO BE TORTURED IN ANY WAY, nevermind the kind of torture Theon went through. and if they think someone deserves it it certainly shouldn't be Theon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna<3Rhaegar Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Didn't read all the posts but would like to say: I hated Theon when he betrayed the Starks. I was so angry with him. I kept thinking 'I can't wait until Robb gets a hold of you, you little *bleep*'I would have felt content & perfectly ok with it if Robb had removed his head (assuming Robb still believed he killed Bran & Rickon) What Theon got was a different thing. No one deserves that. Well maybe Ramsay but besides him. I only just feel bad for Theon now & honestly hope if Theon ever makes it to the wall that Jon doesn't kill him. Or gives him a good, quick, clean death if that's what Theon wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lannister Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Didn't read all the posts but would like to say: I hated Theon when he betrayed the Starks. I was so angry with him. I kept thinking 'I can't wait until Robb gets a hold of you, you little *bleep*'I would have felt content & perfectly ok with it if Robb had removed his head (assuming Robb still believed he killed Bran & Rickon) What Theon got was a different thing. No one deserves that. Well maybe Ramsay but besides him. I only just feel bad for Theon now & honestly hope if Theon ever makes it to the wall that Jon doesn't kill him. Or gives him a good, quick, clean death if that's what Theon wants. You know, that could be a way for Theon to get out of Stannis burning him. If he offered to take the black, Stannis having seen how deprived the Night's Watch has become, might allow that. That would be a slightly awkward reunion with Jon though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyanna<3Rhaegar Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 You know, that could be a way for Theon to get out of Stannis burning him. If he offered to take the black, Stannis having seen how deprived the Night's Watch has become, might allow that. That would be a slightly awkward reunion with Jon though.Yes I've thought about that. Would love to see it happen. I wonder if Theon would finally tell Jon he did not kill Bran & Rickon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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