adiman83 Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 IIRC, "Prince" is a gender-neutral word in Valyrian. Yes, it is gender neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 So what do we think of the leaked series overview? I'd say it makes this question pretty clear. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzanna Stormborn Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 :) OH yeah Plus I like the part where the 'dragon gives her the power to bend the dothraki to her will' Seems like that part stayed in for the publishing :) Dany's on her way to Vaes Dothrak right now to do just this. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsyao Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Yes, it is gender neutral. Is "Stallion" gender neutral too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Is "Stallion" gender neutral too? No, the Dothraki are just a sexist society that wouldn't ever think their most fierce member would be a woman. For a humorous example, in the Saudia Arabia episode of American Dad, the Saudi characters can't fathom what Steve means when he says God is a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adiman83 Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 So what do we think of the leaked series overview? I'd say it makes this question pretty clear. :) What leaked overview? And how does it answer the question? Edit: never mind, I found it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 What leaked overview? And how does it answer the question? GRRM wrote a letter to an agent in 1993 that gave a general overview of the series (not sure if this was a leak or official, but Westeros.org posted a link so I'm assuming it's alright to talk about it.) It includes: Daenerys fleeing from Drogo after he murders Viserys, finding and hatching the dragon eggs in the wild, and "the power to bend the Dothraki to her will." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 This was probably mentioned before but it is one of my favorite hypotheses. The idea is that everybody believed that Rhaego was supposed to be The Stallion Who Mounts the World and that included the Dothraki and the Lhazareen. But what if Dany was the one in the prophecy all along, and not her son? There are several clues in the text regarding this. The first one was a line that was mentioned during her time in Vaes Dothrak: "The old woman trembled and looked at Dany almost as if she were afraid. 'The prince is riding, and he shall be the stallion who mounts the world'." Why would one of the dosh khaleen be afraid of Dany? As far as I'm concerned, the only reason was the prophecy itself. Probably the "lord" the old woman saw was her from the beginning but, because the Dothraki have a highly patriarchal culture, she couldn't possibly imagine that the tribes would be united and ruled by a woman so she naturally assumed the prophecy was about Rhaego. Or she lied knowing that the khals will never accept a woman as their "messiah". The last part in there refers to the prince in present tense (the prince IS riding) so that also might suggest that whoever the stallion is, he/she is already there. Why would they talk about an unborn baby by using present tense? A second interesting clue was one of the "Daughter of death" prophecies: "Beneath the Mother of Mountains, a line of naked crones crept from a great lake and knelt shivering before her, their grey heads bowed." The way this is formulated doesn't suggest Dany joining the dosh khaleen (like she was supposed to), it shows submission and fear (shivering). In another context, the crones would have no reason to kneel before her with their heads bowed. The last thing that almost settled it for me was some things GRRM said in an interview. He said that in the next books Dany is coming home and, also, the Dothraki will come back "in a big way". Now, without Dany as their collective leader, they serve no purpose in the story and there would be no reason for them to make a big comeback. Any ideas? --------------------------------------------------------------- Edit: In the same GoT chapter, the Dothraki crones say "Fierce as a storm this prince will be." I see that as a direct reference to her (nick)name: Stormborn. Nictarion told me this would happen. I was somewhat doubtful, but the way that you have laid it out here, I find it quite convincing. I'm a believer! Well done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsyao Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Daenerys fleeing from Drogo after he murders Viserys, finding and hatching the dragon eggs in the wild, and "the power to bend the Dothraki to her will." The last part is happening in the "Dance of Dragon" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The last part is happening in the "Dance of Dragon" Eh, not really. She's just next to them as of now, and only fifty. Not all of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobOsevens Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Eh, not really. She's just next to them as of now, and only fifty. Not all of them. She is clearly in a position to use Drogon to influence the dothraki now and since she has the most fearsome mount she will be seen as some sort of leader in dothraki culture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 She is clearly in a position to use Drogon to influence the dothraki now and since she has the most fearsome mount she will be seen as some sort of leader in dothraki culture I don't doubt that. I just think it won't be as easy as many think. I doubt it will happen until she gets to Vaes Dothrak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsyao Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Am I the only one who feel the original version of song of ice and fire was much simpler than the current version, and kid of cliche? I am glad GRRM did not follow that path. Another thing is that GRRM designed the Others were much bigger threat to the Westero than the civil war, and the climax of the book would be Danny's dragon vs the Other's ice. But now Others were basically phased out for like 4 columns already, I wonder how would GRRM to re-introduce them back into the novels as arch ememy of the Good among so many plot and loos ends in 2 volumn? Now I believe, the story of the song of ice and fire is so different with GRRM's original design, now he simply do not know which direction he should go, and that is the reason why it takes him so long to write the volumn 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsyao Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I don't doubt that. I just think it won't be as easy as many think. I doubt it will happen until she gets to Vaes Dothrak Why not ? So far almost every victory Danny won was as easy as eating cake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Am I the only one who feel the original version of song of ice and fire was much simpler than the current version, and kid of cliche? I am glad GRRM did not follow that path. Another thing is that GRRM designed the Others were much bigger threat to the Westero than the civil war, and the climax of the book would be Danny's dragon vs the Other's ice. But now Others were basically phased out for like 4 columns already, I wonder how would GRRM to re-introduce them back into the novels as arch ememy of the Good among so many plot and loos ends in 2 volumn? Now I believe, the story of the song of ice and fire is so different with GRRM's original design, now he simply do not know which direction he should go, and that is the reason why it takes him so long to write the volumn 6. Definitely simpler because this was three years before it was actually published. Cliche? A little bit, but honestly, there is nothing wrong with that. (WoT is popular and that's basically every fantasy cliche that can be stuffed in a series. Probably why it was so long.) But he is still going in the same general direction as these books. There will be a Dance of the Dragons. There will be an invasion by the Others. Nothing in that latter suggests Dany vs Others was the big climax. More like everyone vs the Others. "By night, all cloaks are black." Why not ? So far almost every victory Danny won was as easy as eating cake. Her dealings with the Dothraki in the first book were anything but that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singer's stew Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 She lacks certain body part to do it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 That's been addressed. Prophecy is not literal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adiman83 Posted February 5, 2015 Author Share Posted February 5, 2015 I don't doubt that. I just think it won't be as easy as many think. I doubt it will happen until she gets to Vaes Dothrak It depends on whether she keeps Jhaqo alive or not. If he lives, it won't be THAT easy for her to take control. If she decides to pull a Harrenhal* just to show the Dothraki what happens to those who don't kneel, it will be a completely different outcome *in case it wasn't clear, by "pulling a Harrenhal" I meant she burns him to set an example. She lacks certain body part to do it... If you mean "balls", she has them ... if we remember what she did to Astapor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 It depends on whether she keeps Jhaqo alive or not. If he lives, it won't be THAT easy for her to take control. If she decides to pull a Harrenhal* just to show the Dothraki what happens to those who don't kneel, it will be a completely different outcome *in case it wasn't clear, by "pulling a Harrenhal" I meant she burns him to set an example. If you mean "balls", she has them ... if we remember what she did to Astapor.I'd expect something like burning his legs off, and leaving him to the wolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickStormborn Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 IIRC, "Prince" is a gender-neutral word in Valyrian. I think it's actually "dragon" that is gender-neutral in Valyrian, because dragons don't have a fixed gender. Or that seems to be Aemon's logic, at least. In which case "the prince who was promised" was presumably translated from "the dragon who was promised". Quite so. You don't have to like Dany to recognise that she's going to play a very important part in the story. In fact, judging by the quote given by Patrick Stormborn, above, The Stallion Who Mounts the World may not be a very nice person at all. Or at any rate, a person who is loathed by millions (even if she's adored by other millions). Well that pretty much fits Dany anyway: "why would you seek Daenerys, whom half the world wants dead?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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