Debra Morgan Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I think you know about GRRM's original plan in 1993 and about Jon/Arya. There is nothing about Jon/Dany. Is it the end for Jon/Dany shipping what do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berkilak Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Events that far out have obviously changed drastically. Arya is a completely different character on a completely different path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueOrFalse Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Well, the 1993 letter describes almost a completely different story, so who knows what else might have changed since then. I'm not a Jon/Dany shipper but if I was I wouldn't write them off because of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lannister Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 What's this 1993 plan/letter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord of the Dreadfort Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 i think Jon will end up alone and Dany will probably die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faint Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Hard to say because the elimination of the five year gap has basically rendered his ideas for the love triangle involving Jon, Arya and Tyrion impossible. That aspect of the story will simply have to change. Also, Arya, out of all the main characters, is the one whose story has most drastically diverted from its original intention. Jon still became Lord Commander of the Night's Watch; Tyrion still turned on his family with the aim of bringing them down; Bran still journeyed into the far north; Daenerys is still gathering her Dothraki horde; and Sansa still "betrayed" her family and lived to regret it. Arya is distinct in that her actual story simply does not mirror the one set out for her in Martin's outline. So there are a lot of possibilities still at play here. Martin could have dropped the love triangle, substituted Daenerys or Sansa in place of Arya, or simply came up with something entirely new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gogossos Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 On the contrary. The draft letter makes it clear that he intended for the Tyrion, Dany and the Starks to team up against the zombies. In the midst of that are two aspects: the Arya triangle and Jon's heritage. But the relevant parts that show the resolution are redacted. Jon claiming both the throne (from Dany's grasp) and Arya (from Tyrion's affections) sounds like the beginnings of another generational bitter feud. Jon/Dany offers a cleaner resolution. Of course, now that Tyrion will spend time with Dany in TWOW, you never know if this conflict between Jon and Tyrion will still arise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For all I have seen JonDany was never a thing but some of Dany's fans try to say that will happen. Mostly because they don't want her to be what she was blaming Robert for; an usurper who usurps her nephew's throne methinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Dany and Sansa's characters have softened immensely compared to that outline and Arya character is dramatically different.To me it seems as though Arya plot transformed into Sansa's plot if anything.But if it had the main 5 surviving until the last book and the final battle at the wall it's safe to assume Dany and Jon at least meet. So who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faint Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The biggest issue with the way that Martin has written the story as opposed to the way he outlined it, is that his outline seemingly conceives of a narrative wherein a lot of time passes over the course of a single book. Problem is, when he actually sat down and started writing, time passed slowly, so none of the characters aged enough in order to make some of Martin's original ideas possible (i.e., Sansa pregnant, Arya involved in a love triangle, etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferocious Veldt Roarer Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I think you know about GRRM's original plan in 1993 and about Jon/Arya. There is nothing about Jon/Dany. Is it the end for Jon/Dany shipping what do you think? Let's put it this way: according to the original schedule, Tyrion should be madly in love with Arya by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gogossos Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For all I have seen JonDany was never a thing but some of Dany's fans try to say that will happen. Mostly because they don't want her to be what she was blaming Robert for; an usurper who usurps her nephew's throne methinks. Forget about the fans for a second and look at the set up: Dany is on the other side with dragons, Jon is north facing the enemy that threatens all. Dany is withheld back by the author for a reason, she doesn't wade in to the game of thrones when fans are impatiently clamouring for it. What could be the reason? If Jon/Dany is not a romantic thing, it certainly will become a political thing. If Jon wants the throne, then just like fAegon, he will have to "recruit" Dany to his side. What are the chances of Dany stepping aside? What are Jon's chances without her dragons, without her unquestioned lineage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Let's put it this way: according to the original schedule, Tyrion should be madly in love with Arya by now. According to the original schedule, the books should have ended 2 books ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Forget about the fans for a second and look at the set up: Dany is on the other side with dragons, Jon is north facing the enemy that threatens all. Dany is withheld back by the author for a reason, she doesn't wade in to the game of thrones when fans are impatiently clamouring for it. What could be the reason? If Jon/Dany is not a romantic thing, it certainly will become a political thing. If Jon wants the throne, then just like fAegon, he will have to "recruit" Dany to his side. What are the chances of Dany stepping aside? What are Jon's chances without her dragons, without her unquestioned lineage? No no and no. I completely disagree with almost everything you said. a. No one ever said that Jon will want the Throne. b. No one said that the dragons will have any effect on the real war, in the game maybe but I doubt that they will be a consinderable part of the song. c. Dany will never step aside for anyone. d. Once Dany start insulting Ned she will become Jon's enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 Instead of the original Arya, George created Shireen of same age who did came to the Wall with her family. I am proud to be the only one who ships Jon and Shireen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 This letter is tricky. It's clearly a much different story, but generally it's still following the same pattern. Unless those blacked out lines detail their romance during the carnage of the wars, I don't see it happening. But I wouldn't discount it because of course, its his story and if that's where it leads him it shall be. No no and no. I completely disagree with almost everything you said.a. No one ever said that Jon will want the Throne.b. No one said that the dragons will have any effect on the real war, in the game maybe but I doubt that they will be a consinderable part of the song.c. Dany will never step aside for anyone.d. Once Dany start insulting Ned she will become Jon's enemy. I think it's pretty funny that if Dany is replaced with Stannis in this quote, it totally still works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueOrFalse Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 What's this 1993 plan/letter? Page 1: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9AcViAIIAAcpcy.jpg Page 2: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9AcWENIAAAkSza.jpg Page 3: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9AcTYHIUAAocJV.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faint Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 This letter is tricky. It's clearly a much different story, but generally it's still following the same pattern. Except in the case of Arya, funny enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khal drogon Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 It looks the plans are changed for good..As a Dany fan, I wish Jon/Dany never happens.Such a marriage between them will be pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I think it's pretty funny that if Dany is replaced with Stannis in this quote, it totally still works. The only similarity is that Stannis will not give up but he most certainly wouldn't insult Ned either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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