Mass shooting in San Bernandino

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

That is such a nonsense argument. A gun should either be in your safe, or under your direct control. At all times.

Hence, the gun that you are currently using for self defense should be on you or within arms reach, and all the others should be in your safe.

Hence almost zero chance for accidents or negligent use.

So there aren't nearly 2000 accidental shootings a year?

[JonSnow4President]

 

And I was only thinking of a clarifying law, limiting the types of guns allowed, specifying for hunting, no semi or full automatic, and limiting all to single shots.

 

So, only break open, one shot then reload firearms?  Semi-automatic is nothing.  I can work my pump action shotgun materially as fast as my dad can accurately shoot his semi-auto shotgun.  I'm not as well practiced with my bolt-action rifle, but you can still shoot them fairly fast with practice.

I wouldn't be opposed to a realistically limited mag size for rifles and pistols above a certain caliber (please don't make me have a 5 round max on a .22 for example), or more stringent background checks, shutting down gun show loopholes, etc.  Hell, I can even get behind some mandatory training, or even (low cost) licensing similar to a driver's license.  

But pretending semi-auto is a big bad boogieman is weird.

[ThePrunesThatWasPromised]

You can have my pool when you pull it from my cold, shrunken balls.

[zelticgar]

Yeah that stunned me when I read that. Although they may have thought they could get away with it: they wore masks and allegedly wore body armor. That doesn't exactly fit the bill of wanting to go out in a blaze of glory. She probably wasn't counting on the guy acting incredibly nervous at the party and basically giving himself away to the survivors,

But had they gotten away with it?

"Hello daughter, how did the doctors appointment go?"

"It went GREAT, mom!"

 

No kidding. I'm also curious to find out where they were after the assault. It seemed like a 2 hour window where they were out of the area but they ended up getting spotted only a mile or two away. I'm assuming they pulled into somewhere to hide out. Wonder what the conversation was like during the time they got away and the time they were caught?

His family seems surprised. The brother in law came out and said he could not understand what happened. It will be interesting to find out if they give more details about the new wife. I'm really curious to see if she might have been the one driving him to do this, I cant think of another case involving a female spree shooter. I know there have been female suicide bombers but this is kinda new.

 

 

[Free Northman Reborn]

As for the guns being legally purchased, apparently they were indeed, but not by either of the spree shooters. So it could well be a case of an accomplice having provided them with the guns. In that case it is starting to sound more and more like some kind of terror cell to me.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

You can have my pool when you pull it from my cold, shrunken balls.

AWESOME.

[OnionAhaiReborn]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/12/pressure-builds-gun-research-congress

On Wednesday,

nine medical associations publicly urged Congress to overturn the so-called Dickey Amendment

, which in 1996

effectively halted research by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the National Institutes of Health (NIH) into the causes of gun violence.

...

Tacked onto a 1996 appropriations bill, the Dickey Amendment was pushed through Congress by Republican legislators under substantial pressure from the NRA, as the amendment’s author, former Rep. Jay Dickey (R-Ark.), admitted in a 2012 op-ed in the Washington Post that he co-authored. Dickey wrote that the lack of research by the NIH and the CDC had resulted in a troubling information gap: "US scientists cannot answer the most basic question: What works to prevent firearm injuries? We don’t know whether having more citizens carry guns would decrease or increase firearm deaths; or whether firearm registration and licensing would make inner-city residents safer or expose them to greater harm."

The doctors are not alone in calling for the amendment to be overturned: Late last month, dozens of House Democrats made a similar plea to renew federal research on gun violence. "We dedicate $240 million a year on traffic safety research, more than $233 million a year on food safety, and $331 million a year on the effects of tobacco, but almost nothing on firearms that kill 33,000 Americans annually," they wrote in a letter to senior representatives in charge of appropriations. A few weeks before that, Rep. Mike Honda (D-Calif.) submitted a bill called the Gun Violence Research Act with the express purpose of "helping identify and treat those prone to committing mass shootings."

Dickey himself has repeatedly urged Congress to overturn the provision that bears his name. In a letter published Wednesday by Rep. Mike Thompson (D-Calif.), chairman of the House Gun Violence Prevention Task Force, Dickey wrote, "Doing nothing is no longer an acceptable solution."

That this amendment even exists is a reminder of how deep the cynicism of the pro-gun crowd runs in their attempt to deny that guns are a problem. Absolutely vile. Exceedingly doubtful, of course, that it will be ever be overturned by a Republican Congress. They'll stick with meaningless "thoughts and prayers" and do nothing to support even research on the problem.

[Fez]

Its now starting to be reported that the male shooter at least was probably radicalized.

Syed Rizwan Farook -- one-half of the couple behind the San Bernardino shooting massacre -- was apparently radicalized and in touch with people being investigated by the FBI for international terrorism, law enforcement officials said Thursday.

Farook's apparent radicalization contributed to his role in the mass shooting, with his wife Tashfeen Malik, of 14 people on Wednesday during a holiday party for the San Bernardino County health department, where Farook worked, sources said.

 

[JonSnow4President]

As for the guns being legally purchased, apparently they were indeed, but not by either of the spree shooters. So it could well be a case of an accomplice having provided them with the guns. In that case it is starting to sound more and more like some kind of terror cell to me.

Sounds like jumping to conclusions.  I know only 1 of my 4 firearms was purchased in my name.  Two were in my father's, and one was in my uncle's.  

I wouldn't rule it out either, but I'm not jumping there.  Let the facts come.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Fez,

And his legal purchase of the weapons used should be ammunition against anti-gun-control activists.  It should further pose hard questions for Republican candidates.

[Fez]

Fez,

And his legal purchase of the weapons used should be ammunition against anti-gun-control activists.  It should further pose hard questions for Republican candidates.

So long as they don't go the route that most Trump supporters want...

Additionally we asked voters about an assault weapons ban and only 20% of Trump voters support it to 66% who are opposed. We then asked about a ban specifically on assault weapons for Muslims, and 56% of Trump voters support that to only 22% who are opposed.  

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

So they think people should reveal their religion before buying a gun? That is some crazy shit

[Wise Fool]

 

So long as they don't go the route that most Trump supporters want...

Why do those results not surprise me at all? Bigotry trumps liberty when it comes to cherished principles of the right, it would seem; at least for Trumpists.

[Kalbear]

Wow, that would be incredibly unconstitutional. Insanely so.

[zelticgar]

1600 rounds of amo and 12 pipe bombs. They lived with Grandma and a baby. I'm sure the grandmother knew nothing about what was going on though.

Edited - 4500 rounds of amo at the home, 1600 rounds on them during the assault. I'm not a gun person but i'm guessing there is no way you could shoot off 1600 rounds???

 

[Free Northman Reborn]

Fez,

And his legal purchase of the weapons used should be ammunition against anti-gun-control activists.  It should further pose hard questions for Republican candidates.

Scot, what are you on about?

I have long said that the easiest way for terrorists to kill large numbers of Americans would be for them to simply go and buy some guns and shoot up some public place. If deranged school kids can kill scores of people in such a shooting, just imagine what hardened terrorist fanatics could do.

So this is hardly a revelation. Everyone knows that guns are easy to come by in America. And if terrorists want to use that to their advantage, they will. That ain't gonna change the views of pro-gun activists one bit, though. Why should it, if all the other incidences of mass shootings don't?

In fact, the idea that terrorists might be targeting America would just strengthen the belief that more people should be carrying guns to defend themselves and others against the terrorists. Just like Trump said already, regarding the Paris shootings.

[Fez]

Why do those results not surprise me at all? Bigotry trumps liberty when it comes to cherished principles of the right, it would seem; at least for Trumpists.

Yes, the Trumpistas are their own special snowflakes:

 

 The key to Trump's sustained success is that his supporters basically buy into everything he says. There's an almost cult like aspect to it, with Trump fans following the leader.

Examples:

-58% of Trump voters think thousands of Arabs in New Jersey celebrated the attacks of 9/11 to only 12% who don't think that happened. This is despite only 30% of Republican voters overall believing that to 39% who don't.

-53% of Trump supporters are in favor of a national database of Muslims, to only 22% opposed to that concept. This is despite only 29% of Republicans overall supporting the idea to 44% who are against it. In fact supporters of all 13 of the other candidates are against this concept.

-49% of Trump supporters want to shut down the mosques in the United States, to only 18% against that idea. Overall only 25% of Republicans support doing that to 44% who oppose it. Again on this issue supporters of every single candidate other than Trump are against it.

 

The numbers for other Republicans are certainly not great, but Trump's supporters are at a whole other level.

[OnionAhaiReborn]

Just another reminder that there is a strong fascist current in the Republican Party, and at this moment it looks poised to capture its Presidential nomination.

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

1600 rounds of amo and 12 pipe bombs. They lived with Grandma and a baby. I'm sure the grandmother knew nothing about what was going on though.

Edited - 4500 rounds of amo at the home, 1600 rounds on them during the assault. I'm not a gun person but i'm guessing there is no way you could shoot off 1600 rounds???

 

depends on the weapons and rate of fire, but anywhere from 100 to 600 rounds per minute on auto, but more likely they had that many in case of a prolonged seize/shootout with police

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Kalbear,

Trump don't need no stinking Constitution!!!