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snow is the man

So why are the dead such a threat?

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17 hours ago, pinoyathletics said:



Plus the gang learnt if you kill a white walker all the Wights raised by it die as well. Meaning that most of the Wights are raised by the Night King but a few are raised by the other White Walkers. 

I have been thinking about this a lot. Cut Medusa's head off, already. Someone has to sacrifice themselves to kill the Night King, then the spokes of the wheel break and all walker and wights die. 

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1 hour ago, Katleesi said:

Someone has to sacrifice themselves to kill the Night King, then the spokes of the wheel break and all walker and wights die. 

We don't know that. Just because killing a white walker kills all of its wights doesn't mean killing the Night King kills all of his walkers. It's clearly a very different process, and a very different creature.

Sure, Jorah guessed that would happen, but what does Jorah know that we don't? Plus, Jon gave him his best 80s-anime-style "But you don't understand! …! …!" followed by no explanation of what he doesn't understand, so we can assume there's something Jorah doesn't understand that's important.

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6 minutes ago, falcotron said:

We don't know that. Just because killing a white walker kills all of its wights doesn't mean killing the Night King kills all of his walkers. It's clearly a very different process, and a very different creature.

Sure, Jorah guessed that would happen, but what does Jorah know that we don't? Plus, Jon gave him his best 80s-anime-style "But you don't understand! …! …!" followed by no explanation of what he doesn't understand, so we can assume there's something Jorah doesn't understand that's important.

I'm pretty sure Jon meant, "you can't just go up to him and challenge him in a 1v1". It's not that simple. 

 

Also, I believe this episode made it clear that the dead would be "Deactivate" or "de-reanimated"  if the Night King died. 

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It's a big problem with changing from the season 1 wight which is more than a handful for Jon on it's own, to the video game minion who dies in one hit wight.  A lot of the perceived threat for the viewer is removed.

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I think that one of the reasons they are such a threat is because adding to their numbers is only a matter the living dying.  

Also killing the NK might be the easiest way to end everything but the problem is he is usually flanked by at least a couple of walkers and even before them you have to get through maybe 100,000 wights.  If you managed to get to through the wights you had better have a Valaryian Steel sword to fight with  because anything less will just be shattered and I dont think there are dragonglass swords.

 

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1 hour ago, xjlxking said:

Also, I believe this episode made it clear that the dead would be "Deactivate" or "de-reanimated"  if the Night King died. 

Where did the episode make that clear?

I've seen multiple people saying that on this forum, but the only justification seems to be "One guy in a desperate situation guessed that it might be true, so it must be true". Did I miss something in the episode?

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42 minutes ago, falcotron said:

Where did the episode make that clear?

I've seen multiple people saying that on this forum, but the only justification seems to be "One guy in a desperate situation guessed that it might be true, so it must be true". Did I miss something in the episode?

Not really, you're on point. One guy(beric) said, NK raised them all. I don't think they were throwing possible solutions. I think the showrunners wanted us to know know that

 

i guess, it leds to the other point you made, can he really be killed. Jon basically said, it's not that simple, or you don't understand

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1 hour ago, falcotron said:

I've seen multiple people saying that on this forum, but the only justification seems to be "One guy in a desperate situation guessed that it might be true, so it must be true". Did I miss something in the episode?

It's still complete guesswork - it's not without merit and may well turn out to be true, it's certainly a common enough trope, used with anything from robots to demons to the undead, all of whom deactivate when the Master is killed.

Still, Beric is, by his own confession, totally guessing about just about everything. In fact, maybe we should start saying "you know nothing, Beric Dondarrion!"

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1 hour ago, Tadco26 said:

It's a big problem with changing from the season 1 wight which is more than a handful for Jon on it's own, to the video game minion who dies in one hit wight.  A lot of the perceived threat for the viewer is removed.

This. It has been happening since season 4, they keep showing random battles against the wights, each time making them look more useless than before. The feeling of hype is just not there anymore. Granted, the ice dragon was a clever idea, even though they had to twist the bends of a logical plotline for that to be possible.

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12 minutes ago, Mikkel said:

It's still complete guesswork - it's not without merit and may well turn out to be true, it's certainly a common enough trope, used with anything from robots to demons to the undead, all of whom deactivate when the Master is killed.

Sure. The argument against it is that they already used that trope for the wights all being deactivated when their creating White Walker is killed, and the relationship between wights and White Walkers is clearly different from the relationship between White Walkers and the Night King, so it would be a bit odd for them to use the exact same trope again. But "a bit odd" is certainly not the same thing as "impossible".

Anyway, it wasn't just a guess, it was a guess made out of desperation. Unless somehow Dany was going to rescue everyone just barely in the nick of time, there was no way they were going to escape the army, or kill the entire army, or even kill all the White Walkers, so if there's even the slightest chance that killing NK would kill the entire army, it was worth suggesting.

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12 minutes ago, Steelborn said:

logical plotline

Surely that belongs in the realms of antiquity along with Grumkins and Snarks at this point B) Before people jump down my throat: I still enjoy the show. It's still good. It's just fallen a long, long way from the early seasons, where it was among the best shows ever.

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3 minutes ago, Mikkel said:

Surely that belongs in the realms of antiquity along with Grumkins and Snarks at this point B) Before people jump down my throat

As someone with Grumpkin ancestry, I just want to complain that people like you keep lumping us in with Snarks. The Snarks were brutes who viciously oppressed my ancestors for centuries, and to be constantly treated as if we were the same as them is insulting.

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15 minutes ago, falcotron said:

As someone with Grumpkin ancestry, I just want to complain that people like you keep lumping us in with Snarks. The Snarks were brutes who viciously oppressed my ancestors for centuries, and to be constantly treated as if we were the same as them is insulting.

I am a proud Grumpkin oppressor, and I don't care what happened in the past! Make Westeros great again, join the Night's King now!

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21 minutes ago, Mikkel said:

I am a proud Grumpkin oppressor, and I don't care what happened in the past! Make Westeros great again, join the Night's King now!

Night's King has been dead and buried for thousands of years, and even the Creator has said he's not coming back and won't be relevant to anything.

I've heard that in some land where people's homes are boxes and so are their offices, the leader of the Others is called the Night King, which sounds kind of similar. But the Others don't have a king. Everyone knows they're green left-anarchists, not monarchists.

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1 minute ago, Illiterati said:

Don't forget the Nights Who Say Ni.  They have been conspicuously absent.

The Frozen North was unfortunately unable to keep paying their upkeep of shrubberies, so they left for other lands, presumably 1970s Britain.

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18 hours ago, Armand Gargalen said:

They do not want to attack Westeros. They just want humans to stay the fuck of their side of the Wall. Jon is prejudiced and wrong about their intentions.

At least, that is the only logical way to explain why they did not invade yet when we could see in this episode they are a Gendry´s run away from the wall. 

I don't know why you assume they could invade if they wanted to. Uncle Ben said the Wall has magical anti-White Walker powers.

Obviously, the Night King will get past the Wall somehow. But he can't yet. 

Edited by darmody

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16 hours ago, Anarres said:

It's possible, but I doubt that's all there is to it. After all, they had this deal of sorts with Craster and left him and his wife/daughter harem alone. They've also seemingly be content to leave the Free Folk alone in the past, hence the latter's large numbers and even some permanent settlements. Something is driving the White Walkers to act, whether that's a choice they made and thus a conscious plan is, I think, still an open question.

The deal with Craster was to turn his boy babies into new White Walkers, which they need to kill more humans. Perhaps the better way of putting it is the Ice Demons have one overriding goal, which is to conquer the universos. They plan to do so both by killing humans and expanding the White Walker population. 

What's driving the White Walkers to act is the Night King. Why now? Because dragons. 

Edited by darmody

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4 hours ago, falcotron said:

Plus, Jon gave him his best 80s-anime-style "But you don't understand! …! …!" followed by no explanation of what he doesn't understand, so we can assume there's something Jorah doesn't understand that's important.

We can't assume that, because Jon Snow knows nothing. 

I'm guessing what Jorah can't understand is that the Night King is, like, really powerful, man.

But if Jon understands on some level that he's on a tv show, what Jorah doesn't understand is that the Night King can't be killed until next season. 

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