MercenaryChef Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 peper spray is terrible in a closed environment like that and too hard to take down multiple targets with. the worse part of pepper spray is it can linger in the air or blow back on you. the gun was meant to be used first as a deterrent, 2nd as a warning i.e. leg shot, and third deadly force if needed.i did not want to kill, but it didn't hurt to have the option if the situation called for it.police and military who handle a firearm every day on the job are not trained to shoot in the leg, but you were going to be able to pull that off? ok, cowboy.what in the fuck are you doing even handling a gun in a possible violent situation if your first thought is not 'kill?' and as stated there were likely three criminals. were you going shoot all three of them in the legs? or was just the one leg shot going to diffuse the situation? scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 CH,Let me join the chorus. If you need a firearm you need to be willing to kill with it. The bullet you fire as a "warning shot" is going to land somewhere. The last thing you want to do is kill or maim an innocent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colder Hands Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 CH,Let me join the chorus. If you need a firearm you need to be willing to kill with it. The bullet you fire as a "warning shot" is going to land somewhere. The last thing you want to do is kill or maim an innocent.once again, the only innocent who would have been at risk would have been my friend and if she was in harms way i would not have fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nichole Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I'm glad you are alright and that your friend is alright. I hope she is able to recover from this and won't live her life in fear. Call me naive I guess, but what was the likelihood of the robbers actually returning? It seems to me that they got what they wanted and left, even if they thought she didn't have a phone, returning to the crime scene would have been the last thing they would have wanted. While you did what you felt was best, running over there with a gun just seems unnecessary to me. Then again, the only reason I have ever wanted to carry a gun is to protect myself from bears when I'm in the mountains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterbound Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 arrr.. there are about a 1000 things i want to post here.. but I've got teach a fucking Crossfit class. I'll be back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerraPrime Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I think you two are forgetting something. CH was confident that he could assess the situation and make the right call. Isn't that all the reassurance we need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kungtotte Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Except the little old lady who came around the corner just as you fired.Don't you know the four rules of firearms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kungtotte Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 dp, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Stone Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Here’s the problem. The criminals are smart enough to realize that the girl would call the cops after getting robbed. No way they are coming back to rob her house. That is a ridiculous notion. Hence I can see you bringing your gun when you went over, on the remote chance that you are dealing with the worlds stupidest criminals. However walking around with it drawn is completely ridiculous, unless you heard something suspicious. The chance that you shoot a kid or get shot by some other vigilante, maybe responding to a robbery a block away, is much greater than the chance you happen to save anyone.Unless you are looking to impress her, in which case kick down her door with the gun drawn. Chicks dig that shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MercenaryChef Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I think you two are forgetting something. CH was confident that he could assess the situation and make the right call. Isn't that all the reassurance we need?no. a cocksure wannabe hero with a gun who is certain he knows what to do is not good enough for me. it worries me a great deal. and as nicole noted, the chance of them returning to the scene of the crime was unlikely. our op was just caught up in the thoughts of saving the damsel in distress and playing g.i. joe and lept into action. your actions do not make anyone feel safer. please tell me my own neighborhood does not have someone so gallant and careless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 CH,once again, the only innocent who would have been at risk would have been my friend and if she was in harms way i would not have fired.Bullets travel a very long way. Therefore, you cannot be certain the warning shot will not injure someone you didn't expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tormund Ukrainesbane Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 peper spray is terrible in a closed environment like that and too hard to take down multiple targets with. the worse part of pepper spray is it can linger in the air or blow back on you. the gun was meant to be used first as a deterrent, 2nd as a warning i.e. leg shot, and third deadly force if needed.i did not want to kill, but it didn't hurt to have the option if the situation called for it.Ok, I'm in favor of using firearms for personal defense, but oh my god. Sell your gun and buy a tazer or something. You should not be handling firearms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenophon Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Bullets travel a very long way. Therefore, you cannot be certain the warning shot will not injure someone you didn't expect.Why couldn't he just fire into the ground? Honest question, a few trips to the range have convinced me I'm a horrible shot, so I've never owned a gun, let alone considered how I would fire off a warning shot before, but this seems possible to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudguard Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 I just watched the movie Kick Ass last night, and in many ways, it fits in nicely with this thread. I know you were in a rush to get over to your friend's place, but maybe next time you could keep a superhero outfit next to your gun. You could even place your permit in your superhero outfit, so you wouldn't have to get a new holster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Xeno,Why couldn't he just fire into the ground? Honest question, a few trips to the range have convinced me I'm a horrible shot, so I've never owned a gun, let alone considered how I would fire off a warning shot before, but this seems possible to me.Well, if the ground is hard or concrete there is the possibility of a ricochet. This is more of a Tormund question. I've always heard "warning shots" are poor ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colder Hands Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Here’s the problem. The criminals are smart enough to realize that the girl would call the cops after getting robbed. No way they are coming back to rob her house. That is a ridiculous notion. Hence I can see you bringing your gun when you went over, on the remote chance that you are dealing with the worlds stupidest criminals. However walking around with it drawn is completely ridiculous, unless you heard something suspicious. The chance that you shoot a kid or get shot by some other vigilante, maybe responding to a robbery a block away, is much greater than the chance you happen to save anyone.Unless you are looking to impress her, in which case kick down her door with the gun drawn. Chicks dig that shit.again, to repost...they could have come in realizing they had her cell phone and keys to the house, taking a chance she did not have a land line or 2nd cell. worlds stupidest criminals? you think there are a lot of smart ones running around? ever watch some of the world's stupidest criminals clips out there?the van stayed out front of the house after she got in. at the time she called her BF who relayed to me, the van was out front. granted i arrived 7 minutes after that and saw no van, but it was still risky. i would not have fired in open air, but inside the house i would have since i knew the surroundings and the collateral damage would be nil if my friend was not in the room.it was pretty confusing out there with all those kids running around after 1am out there. i kept pointing at the kids in the head and thinking "phew glad i didn'taccidentally fire" lay of the land was such that there were no innocents in the surrounding area, and i can't stress this enough, i would not have fired in open air or toward a potential ricochet point. but having it drawn if someone tried to flee the house i would point and yell for them to stop. but whatever, you clearly know better.and why you keep taking it to the chicks dig that stuff...did you lose your wife or girlfriend to a cop or redneck with a hand gun and have repressed rage you need to take out in misguided places? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colder Hands Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Ok, I'm in favor of using firearms for personal defense, but oh my god. Sell your gun and buy a tazer or something. You should not be handling firearms.lol, ok, thx for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenophon Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well, if the ground is hard or concrete there is the possibility of a ricochet. This is more of a Tormund question. I've always heard "warning shots" are poor ideas.That makes sense to me. I didn't even like using our old hunting rifle to make the ventilation holes for a burning barrel since I was worried about ricochet. I guess I just assumed people with licensed handguns know more about this stuff than me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tormund Ukrainesbane Posted July 11, 2011 Share Posted July 11, 2011 Why couldn't he just fire into the ground? Honest question, a few trips to the range have convinced me I'm a horrible shot, so I've never owned a gun, let alone considered how I would fire off a warning shot before, but this seems possible to me.Ricochets happen. The ground isn't necessarily soft dirt. Where I like to shoot lately is a bunch of gravel pits, you can constantly hear and see ricochets going off the ground and into the berm.Once the bullet exits the gun you have zero control over where it goes, and it's only going to stop when it runs directly into something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colder Hands Posted July 11, 2011 Author Share Posted July 11, 2011 Xeno,Well, if the ground is hard or concrete there is the possibility of a ricochet. This is more of a Tormund question. I've always heard "warning shots" are poor ideas.walls were concrete brick, 30% chance of ricochet and the floors natural wood, about a 5% chance of ricochet. Window alignment in the home, zero exposure to open side, two windows to the front, opening into an empty field behind with brick eventually in the way. one opening window in the side of the back, exposure to the back yard and a wood fence.had a round missed the leg of a target it would have had to bypass furniture and tables to make it to the windows, at which time there was very low risk of the round leaving the house. again, if friend was in the room i would not have fired. for myself, i don't mind those odds of it catching me with a ricochet. and i certainly didn't fear a round leaving the house to the front and causing any damage to anything living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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