[ADWD SPOILERS] The Ghost in Winterfell / "There must ALWAYS be a Stark in Winterfell

[MtnLion]

Hodor took one, too.

[MtnLion]

Crappy proxy, here.

[MtnLion]

It seems very odd to me that Big Walder would cut his brother's throat, but many miles away other brother's are cutting their Lord Commander's throat and stabbing him. Is it possible that someone is skinchanging into these people to carry out the attacks? Food for thought ... Bran is the only one that comes to mind readily as being powerful enought o do it.

[oath breaker]

Wouldn't Theon have recognized the Blackfish?

No, he's been in the vale and hasn't even seen Cat for years and years. Thats not to say i think it's blackfish, im thinking maybe the Liddle or Howland Reed.

[Galen M]

It seems very odd to me that Big Walder would cut his brother's throat

Cousin, not brother

No, he's been in the vale and hasn't even seen Cat for years and years. Thats not to say i think it's blackfish, im thinking maybe the Liddle or Howland Reed.

Huh? They fought together under Robb in the War of the Five Kings not two years back. In the first Theon chapter, he thinks how he "rode with the Blackfish."

[The Dead Walk]

Apologies but managed to miss my response

Hodor took the 4th sword from the tomb of one of the old kings

(credit to many other people on other threads)

Ah - thanks. It's a bit curious that Lady Dustin doesn't mention Ned's sword is also missing, but she presumably didn't know that Mikken had forged one for Ned's tomb.

[Axon]

I agree with a lot that has already been said. It wouldn't shock me if Roose was the brains behind the hit and Big Walder did the deed. Roose having whispered, of course, how aware BW's cousin was about the line of succession.

[Duskfire]

I agree with a lot that has already been said. It wouldn't shock me if Roose was the brains behind the hit and Big Walder did the deed. Roose having whispered, of course, how aware BW's cousin was about the line of succession.

Nah makes no sense for it to be Roose. The tension was already thick without him planning murders and whatnot. All it is doing would be creating indecisiveness among his allies, something he doesnt need.

[1234567]

Could it be Benjen Stark? Maybe a crackpot idea, but in a GoT he talked about a seasoned Ranger deserting because of the Others. Maybe he deserted and hid in the ruins of his former home.

[Galen M]

Could it be Benjen Stark? Maybe a crackpot idea, but in a GoT he talked about a seasoned Ranger deserting because of the Others. Maybe he deserted and hid in the ruins of his former home.

That seasoned ranger was Gared (from the prologue), whom Ned beheaded in the first chapter.

[Lummel]

Could it be Benjen Stark? Maybe a crackpot idea, but in a GoT he talked about a seasoned Ranger deserting because of the Others. Maybe he deserted and hid in the ruins of his former home.

So we're meant to imagine that Benjen Stark we know from AGOT is an oathbreaker and a coward who proudly stalks about Winterfell?

What would he be doing there - aside from dishonouring all of Stark ancestors in the crypts who supported the Watch - would he be waiting for someone to behead him for his treachery?

It's not totally crackpot - he's been missing for a long time so he'd have time to climb over or go through the wall say at the Nightfort - but it is unpleasent and doesn't fit with what we've seen of him.

[dizzy]

I like the Howland Reed theory and think it would be super cool (I mean he's got to investigate what happened to his kids right?), but I don't think it's very likely to be him.

[Hanley]

What about in aGoT, where Ned and Robert are in the Winterfell crypts and Ned is thinking of the stone statues, carved in the likeness of each Stark, with a direwolf at their feet and an iron sword on their lap that was used to prevent their angry spirit riseing. When fleeing Winterfell, Hodor and Osha took Brandon and I think Rickard's, so is it possible they are the ghosts in Winterfell? Just my theroy anyway...

[HouseLark]

I like the Howland Reed theory and think it would be super cool (I mean he's got to investigate what happened to his kids right?), but I don't think it's very likely to be him.

I like the idea of it being Howland Reed but are there some problems with it being him? Surely Manderley and Roose Bolton would know him since he was well-known to Ned and I'm assuming others, Ned's liege lords especially.

[Gloria]

Crackpot theory time, and I haven't even read this entire thread :)

When Bran and company are in the crypts before they leave Winterfell, they take some of the swords of the dead kings. According to local lore, those swords were placed there to keep the dead kings' spirits from roaming Winterfell. What if the removal of those swords woke up real ghosts?

Now, some of the older swords had already rusted away to dust. Presumably that means some of the older guys had already been wandering about. Maybe these newer dead are pissed off with recent events. And maybe the brutality behind the murder of the Walder kid was a payback for him being a Frey?

[malek]

Could it be that BWB followed Freys and Boltons to Winterfell, especially hearing how Arya is getting married for Bolton's ba5tard there ?!

It makes so much sense to me that when Abel first appeared I was sure it was Tom Of Seven Strings :dunce:

[dizzy]

I like the idea of it being Howland Reed but are there some problems with it being him? Surely Manderley and Roose Bolton would know him since he was well-known to Ned and I'm assuming others, Ned's liege lords especially.

Well they're refering to the hooded man that Theon encounters. I'm thinking it's probably just Mance. He would recognize Theon since he's been to Winterfell many time before apparently.

[1234567]

So we're meant to imagine that Benjen Stark we know from AGOT is an oathbreaker and a coward who proudly stalks about Winterfell?

What would he be doing there - aside from dishonouring all of Stark ancestors in the crypts who supported the Watch - would he be waiting for someone to behead him for his treachery?

It's not totally crackpot - he's been missing for a long time so he'd have time to climb over or go through the wall say at the Nightfort - but it is unpleasent and doesn't fit with what we've seen of him.

True it would not fit with the image of the Starks. There were however a few statements made by Benjen in AGOT that I thought might back up the theory a bit:

Quote: "If you knew what the oath would cost you, you might be less eager to pay the price, son."

And

"Come back to me after you've fathered a few bastards of your own, and we'll see how you feel."

The first statement sounds like regret and the second doesn't fit the Stark nobility code. Also Jon tries to leave after his father's death. I think it is plausible that Benjen managed to get past the wall, perhaps after hearing about Theon's attack and then got to Winterfell only to find it burnt and no one left. He may have decided that he had no where else to go and became the Ghost in Winterfell. I think it would be interesting to see that not all Starks live up to the Eddard model.

I had also forgotten that Theon had met the Blackfish in the Whispering Woods, so it is more likely to be him.

[Silmarien]

The hooded man could not be Mance, because "Abel" was playing music in the hall at the same time Theon left to walk outside, where he encounters the hooded man.

[CrypticWeirwood]

I think it is plausible that Benjen managed to get past the wall, perhaps after hearing about Theon's attack and then got to Winterfell only to find it burnt and no one left. He may have decided that he had no where else to go and became the Ghost in Winterfell. I think it would be interesting to see that not all Starks live up to the Eddard model.

I agree it is possible, although plotwise perhaps not probable.

I just don’t see the First Ranger deserting the Wall, though.