Unpopular opinions III

[mediocre cheese]

He's part one of this business with Tommen: A performance. So long as Cersei believes he would actually rape Tommen, the Kettleblacks wouldn't rape Alayaya.

The more credible his threat appears, the safer she is in their custody.

Well no, as was shown otherwise. Alayaya was taken because of his value to him, in the same way he took Tommen because of his value to cersei. If he hadn't been going around poisoning her, spying on her and stealing her children, she would not have responded in kind. Even at the point if he had informed her that alayaya had no value to him and that he had no harmful designs on Tommen on her he might have spared her a whipping.

Obviously given how cersei fears him, a threat to rape her child cowed her, but alayaya is far less safe in lannister custody once its clear she is someone tyrion cares about and that he is the type of man who goes around threatening to rape lannister children. All of Tyrion's power springs from Tywin, and Tyrion knows Tywin is the type of man who cares a great deal about his house and its members and very little about the health and safety of sex workers. Considering what Tyrion said its very fortunate Alayaya didn't die on the rack.

If he hadn't snatched Tommen in the first place, hadn't then threatened to rape him, and to top it all off, explicitly ties this treatment of him to Alayaya's treatment, she would have been fine. But no he had to play his stupid power game with Cersei.

In that conversation with Bronn, he's close to vomiting over this matter of Alayaya and Tommen. He just survived a battle, and an assassination attempt he thinks Cersei was behind. He's learned Yaya has been whipped. The preceding paragraphs make it plain how distrught he is over that, so for a moment in a flash of anger, he reminds himself of the threat he made regarding Tommen. And in a matter of seconds, he is relieved that the threat will come to nothing. He would have neither raped, nor beaten, nor touched a hair on Tommen's head. And yes, for the simple moral reason that it would have been wrong. This is the guy who, when he sees Joffrey - Joffrey! - strangling to death, feels a sudden burst of pity for the little wretch. And we're supposed to believe Tyrion would personally rape Tommen?

We are supposed to believe he would have had him whipped. Why are we supposed to believe it? Because he said it, whether he said it after a battle or after a meal isn't relevant. You can say its a moment, and he's relieved, but if it was all an act, that would be his first thought. If you make a threat you never have any intention to go through on, your first thought would be relief. Instead his first thought is that his loss of custody is a blow.

Again its all speculative, but we know for certain he seriously considered whipping an 8 year old boy because of something the boy's mother did. There is no evidence he wouldn't of gone through with it if he could, in fact his thoughts "If I don't Cersei wins" indicate otherwise.

[brashcandy]

Ok this is not an unpopular opinion, but just to bring some warm fuzzy feeling back to thread:

who else was really touched that Davos made such an effort to learn how to read? I felt that it really enhanced the already enormous admiration for his character

As for other unpopular opinions

- I don't think the text really needs Arya to return from Braavos. She could stay in that cult forever and just do her own thing.

- I'm interested in the whole Oldtown storyline, but not if I have to suffer through it from Sam's perspective

- I hope that Margaery is guilty of something

- I'm beginning to think that Sansa may not be able to outsmart LF after all, and this depresses me.

[Knight of Ashes]

We are supposed to believe he would have had him whipped. Why are we supposed to believe it? Because he said it, whether he said it after a battle or after a meal isn't relevant. You can say its a moment, and he's relieved, but if it was all an act, that would be his first thought. If you make a threat you never have any intention to go through on, your first thought would be relief. Instead his first thought is that his loss of custody is a blow.

Again its all speculative, but we know for certain he seriously considered whipping an 8 year old boy because of something the boy's mother did. There is no evidence he wouldn't of gone through with it if he could, in fact his thoughts "If I don't Cersei wins" indicate otherwise.

Because he said it? As Tywin has noted: Tyrion talks too much. He also said he killed Joff but we know he didn't. But like you said, it's all speculative but I'll go with the camp that says it's part of the act. One of the things he learned from Tywin is the value of a good threat; he also neglected the consequences of making such threats. That one should be prepared to follow it up. For someone who thinks himself so cunning, he neglected to think that Cersei -Cersei!- would fight back in a manner similar.

Funny that he did warn himself not to underestimate Cersei but ended up doing so anyway. So he found himself in a situation where he considered it- but no, I don't think he would have gone through with it.

[ZacharyB]

Unpopular opinion: I think Davos is a freaking boring character and his chapters made me want to go to sleep. Exceptions were his perspective on the Blackwater, and his final ADWD chapter.

[mediocre cheese]

Because he said it? As Tywin has noted: Tyrion talks too much. He also said he killed Joff but we know he didn't.

I may have been unclear, Tyrion says out loud (to other characters) that he killed joffrey, but the reader knows he didn't because in his internal monologue he says he's innocent. He didn't say out loud to Bronn, "If I don't Cersei wins", he says it as part of internal monologue. That leads me to believe he would carried through on it, if he had the ability to.

[Knight of Ashes]

I may have been unclear, Tyrion says out loud (to other characters) that he killed joffrey, but the reader knows he didn't because in his internal monologue he says he's innocent. He didn't say out loud to Bronn, "If I don't Cersei wins", he says it as part of internal monologue. That leads me to believe he would carried through on it, if he had the ability to.

Okay, noted.

[Lemon Cake]

My unpopular opinion: There's a tiny part of me that hopes Jon really is just Ned's bastard son from an extramarital affair, simply because at this point, that would be the only truly shocking revelation about his parentage.

(Yes, I know there's a lot to support the R+L=J theory, and that the chances of Jon really being Ned's bastard are approximately .0000000000132%, etc etc. I'm just saying it would amuse me if this happened, simply because of how shocked the fandom would be.)

[Bad Dog]

My unpopular opinion: There's a tiny part of me that hopes Jon really is just Ned's bastard son from an extramarital affair, simply because at this point, that would be the only truly shocking revelation about his parentage.

(Yes, I know there's a lot to support the R+L=J theory, and that the chances of Jon really being Ned's bastard are approximately .0000000000132%, etc etc. I'm just saying it would amuse me if this happened, simply because of how shocked the fandom would be.)

Lemoncake, I do so agree with you... just for the sheer fun of seeing those who act like "R+L=J" (stupid acronym btw) is solid fact make the online equivalent of dumb faces. :D

Yes, it is a plausible theory, I'm leaning towards believing so myself. But as yet, it's a theory, so STFU know-it-alls.

[Hound's She-wolf]

I hope Cersei gets acquitted, starts a giant shit storm by attacking the Tyrells and the Faith and causes mass chaos.

I hope Robert Strong is as bad ass as Qyburn claims, (but I still want him to end by being chucked out the moon door after being set afire).

I hope to never hear about Sam and his fat pink mast, ever, ever again.

I don't care who Jon's parents are.

I don't care if Dany ever leaves Meereen. In fact, if Vic steals her dragons and brings them to Westeros, I'd be fine with that.

[Knight of Ashes]

My unpopular opinion: There's a tiny part of me that hopes Jon really is just Ned's bastard son from an extramarital affair, simply because at this point, that would be the only truly shocking revelation about his parentage.

(Yes, I know there's a lot to support the R+L=J theory, and that the chances of Jon really being Ned's bastard are approximately .0000000000132%, etc etc. I'm just saying it would amuse me if this happened, simply because of how shocked the fandom would be.)

Same here.

[Hound's She-wolf]

Lemoncake, I do so agree with you... just for the sheer fun of seeing those who act like "R+L=J" (stupid acronym btw) is solid fact make the online equivalent of dumb faces. :D

Yes, it is a plausible theory, I'm leaning towards believing so myself. But as yet, it's a theory, so STFU know-it-alls.

Upon futher reflection, maybe I do care who Jon's parents are. I think it would be funny if Ned really is Jon's father because so many readers think Ned is a paragon of virtue and honor and then it turns out Ned is just like every other man in the series who couldn't keep it in his pants.

[Selky]

- Daario gets unfairly bashed because people assume he's using Daenerys. Maybe I'm seeing things that aren't really there but it seemed obvious to me that he really loved her.

- Bran having a happy ending after all that's happened would feel really cheap. He's a cripple, stuck inside a cave on the otherside of the wall and already ate the weirwood paste.

- The Red Wedding was ultimately a good thing.

[ARYa_Nym]

Upon futher reflection, maybe I do care who Jon's parents are. I think it would be funny if Ned really is Jon's father because so many readers think Ned is a paragon of virtue and honor and then it turns out Ned is just like every other man in the series who couldn't keep it in his pants.

There is still the possibility that he fathered Ashara Dayne's daughter. The running theory is that it was Brandon but we don't know.

As to your speculations about Catelyn and Ashara Dayne... sigh... needless to say, All Will Be Revealed in Good Time. I will give you this much, however; Ashara Dayne was not nailed to the floor in Starfall, as some of the fans who write me seem to assume. They have horses in Dorne too, you know. And boats (though not many of their own).

http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/Chronology/

[Raksha the Demon]

Ok this is not an unpopular opinion, but just to bring some warm fuzzy feeling back to thread:

who else was really touched that Davos made such an effort to learn how to read? I felt that it really enhanced the already enormous admiration for his character

As for other unpopular opinions

- I don't think the text really needs Arya to return from Braavos. She could stay in that cult forever and just do her own thing.

- I'm interested in the whole Oldtown storyline, but not if I have to suffer through it from Sam's perspective

- I hope that Margaery is guilty of something

- I'm beginning to think that Sansa may not be able to outsmart LF after all, and this depresses me.

I wouldn't be depressed about the possibility that Sansa may not be able to outsmart Littlefinger. Her own father, who was an adult, experienced in warfare and to some extent (not enough) in politics, was not able to outsmart Littlefinger. Sansa is an almost 14-year-old girl who has to hide her true self and identity, since she is suspected of regicide. At the age of 14, Petyr Baelish was mooning over Catelyn and fantasizing about how many children they would have when they were married and what the kids' names would be - he wasn't outsmarting anyone.

I do think that Sansa is smarter and stronger than Littlefinger guesses; and she is his only weakness. Give her a year or two at least, and she might be able to find a way to undo him.

[Silmarien]

I like Dany even after ADWD. (I know others like her as well or are neutral but she gets a lot of hate on the board)

I don't think Cersei changed that much from GoT through ADWD. Just that her paranoia and insanity were triggered by Joff's death and her remembering the prophesy.

I don't hate Tyrion. Though I disagree with his killing Tywin and Shae on a moral level, I think they were crimes of passion. And IMO he isn't that annoying in ADWD.

I like the travelogues, especially Arya's, Brienne's, and yes, even Tyrion's.

I detest the Ironborn (except Asha....MAYBE Theon but we'll see how redeemed he is). Their culture is just obnoxious to me. Victarion is a dunce, and his crispy hand creeps me out. Euron is creepy like WHOA. Balon was just a nasty bitter old man. The whole "paying the Iron price" and salt wives also rankles me.

I think Aegon is fake (I think opinions are pretty much split, but thought I'd mention this). GRRM has dropped lots of foreshadowing regarding the Blackfyres, V+I being untrustworthy, and I just don't buy the baby switch. I think Mance's son and Gilly's son being swapped was a red herring.

I like Sansa (lots of people seem indifferent or don't like her). She's a typical, dreamy 13 year old girl, and is learning FAST. I think she'll prove less tractable than LF predicts.

I kinda want Dany and Ser Jorah to end up together.

That is all, I think.

[brashcandy]

- Daario gets unfairly bashed because people assume he's using Daenerys. Maybe I'm seeing things that aren't really there but it seemed obvious to me that he really loved her.

- Bran having a happy ending after all that's happened would feel really cheap. He's a cripple, stuck inside a cave on the otherside of the wall and already ate the weirwood paste.

Agreed on the Daario thing. I felt that he really loved the girl. I think people dislike him and automatically assume that he was using her, but I always felt his feelings were genuine.

[brashcandy]

I wouldn't be depressed about the possibility that Sansa may not be able to outsmart Littlefinger. Her own father, who was an adult, experienced in warfare and to some extent (not enough) in politics, was not able to outsmart Littlefinger. Sansa is an almost 14-year-old girl who has to hide her true self and identity, since she is suspected of regicide. At the age of 14, Petyr Baelish was mooning over Catelyn and fantasizing about how many children they would have when they were married and what the kids' names would be - he wasn't outsmarting anyone.

I do think that Sansa is smarter and stronger than Littlefinger guesses; and she is his only weakness. Give her a year or two at least, and she might be able to find a way to undo him.

I certainly hope so. It's not that I expect Sansa to turn into some political mastermind, but I do want her to find a way out of her situation really badly, and I'm beginning to dread that GRRM will continue to portray LF as this know it all genius who always has a Plan B and a crystal ball handy. :) Anyways, with two books left, do we even have the luxury of waiting for Sansa to develop the skills necessary to topple him?

I'm peeved at this too. GRRM needed to age these children up... Arya as this great assassin is wearing thin.

[brashcandy]

I like Dany even after ADWD. (I know others like her as well or are neutral but she gets a lot of hate on the board)

I don't think Cersei changed that much from GoT through ADWD. Just that her paranoia and insanity were triggered by Joff's death and her remembering the prophesy.

I don't hate Tyrion. Though I disagree with his killing Tywin and Shae on a moral level, I think they were crimes of passion. And IMO he isn't that annoying in ADWD.

I like the travelogues, especially Arya's, Brienne's, and yes, even Tyrion's.

I detest the Ironborn (except Asha....MAYBE Theon but we'll see how redeemed he is). Their culture is just obnoxious to me. Victarion is a dunce, and his crispy hand creeps me out. Euron is creepy like WHOA. Balon was just a nasty bitter old man. The whole "paying the Iron price" and salt wives also rankles me.

I think Aegon is fake (I think opinions are pretty much split, but thought I'd mention this). GRRM has dropped lots of foreshadowing regarding the Blackfyres, V+I being untrustworthy, and I just don't buy the baby switch. I think Mance's son and Gilly's son being swapped was a red herring.

I like Sansa (lots of people seem indifferent or don't like her). She's a typical, dreamy 13 year old girl, and is learning FAST. I think she'll prove less tractable than LF predicts.

I kinda want Dany and Ser Jorah to end up together.

That is all, I think.

I pretty much agree on everything here Silmarien. I don't know if I'm being experienced by TV Jorah, but certainly book Jorah seems like he could show a girl a fun time... I think :)

[Raksha the Demon]

I certainly hope so. It's not that I expect Sansa to turn into some political mastermind, but I do want her to find a way out of her situation really badly, and I'm beginning to dread that GRRM will continue to portray LF as this know it all genius who always has a Plan B and a crystal ball handy. :) Anyways, with two books left, do we even have the luxury of waiting for Sansa to develop the skills necessary to topple him?

I'm peeved at this too. GRRM needed to age these children up... Arya as this great assassin is wearing thin.

Sansa could become a political mastermind in the future; she's certainly getting a first-hand education in political realities; but she's still quite young. It might not be a bad idea for GRRM to age the kids up by at least three years; Arya has been incredibly lucky so far; but there's only so far that luck can take her, she needs more experience, not to mention height. Trouble is, since GRRM can't even get Tyrion from King's Landing to Mereen/Daenerys in two books, over a thousand pages and what, seven years, how long would it take him to cover all the events that a jump of three years would take? And are we supposed to believe that Littlefinger would keep his creepin' creepy fingers off Sansa for three years?

[Lemon Cake]

Agreed on the Daario thing. I felt that he really loved the girl. I think people dislike him and automatically assume that he was using her, but I always felt his feelings were genuine.

I also agree about Daario, except I'd call what he felt for her lust, not love. But I'm just being nitpicky; whatever you call it, I do think it was genuine.