Dawn - Trophy captured from the Others?

[three-eyed monkey]

Edric has blond hair. As for the eyes, violet eyes exist in our world. GRRM has said it's not a Targaryen trait. That said, I've wondered if it's not a proto-Valyrian trait -- i.e., descent from Azor Ahai, if his origins were connected to Valyria.

Do you think the Dayne's might be one of the dragon's three heads? I've been pondering the idea that the three heads might be valyrian blood lines in westeros.

[Valmorfëa]

Do you think the Dayne's might be one of the dragon's three heads? I've been pondering the idea that the three heads might be valyrian blood lines in westeros.

As far as we know, there are quite a few noble families that have some relation to Targaryens. Even the Baratheons... so that isn't solid enough to go by. But I do think it would be pretty awesome to have a Dayne with Dawn/Lightbringer in hand, riding a pale dragon into battle :D

[OneTrueSteve]

Good catch, Ran, I didn't notice Ned Dayne's blonde hair. Still not enough for me to think that the Daynes have typical Targ features, though. I could see the purple eyes as being a proto-valyrian trait, but a Dayne being one of the heads of the dragon based on a common eye color and an assumed common ancestor (several thousand years removed) seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

However, I do believe that GRRM has said that dragons did exist in Westeros's ancient past and there is a family somewhere with a four legged dragon sigil, so it is possible that the Daynes or another ancient bloodline could have a latent affinity to dragons.

[Cheese Pudding]

So, could Nissa-Nissa had been a Dayne?

She would be kind of a falling star.

[three-eyed monkey]

So, could Nissa-Nissa had been a Dayne?

She would be kind of a falling star.

That's a very good correlation, I missed that.

[JonTargaryenW/Viserion4WIN]

I think it's interesting, though it could be purely coincidence, that Dayne is very similar to Dawn. Add a "Dornish drawl" to the word dawn over the course of a few thousand years and the spelling could naturally adapt to mimic the modern common tongue.

Really love this thread. The weapons, and superweapons, of ASOIAF have always been an odd and romanticized aspect of the story in my mind.

I suspect AAR will take possession of Lightbringer and only then will the sword reveal itself as such. AAR may not have to reforge Lb but he/she may still have to temper it in the heart NNR. Still not convinced, as some others are, that Dawn=Lightbringer, but there has been too much, (or more accurately too little) explanation of the Dayne family sword and I think that it will play some role in the revealing of events surrounding ToJ

Interestingly the ToJ is actually toj. In Ned's dream he recalls that Rhaegar had named the round stone tower the tower of joy but he comments that to him the location only brings back painful memories. I wonder what the actual name was originally because it seems like Ned is under the impression that Rhaegar coined ToJ hisself. (this probably belongs in a different thread but it seemed loosely based to the OP being that it is the last place we know for sure where Dawn was)

[WillWork4NinjaPowers]

Edric isn't the only Dayne that has light hair. Darkstar has silver hair, with a black streak.

How old is Darkstar?

Where is Edric?

Who are their parents?

[Ran]

Gerold Dayne is in his 20s or 30s (GRRM was asked his age and said he had no idea, which shows his age doesn't matter a bit). I'd personally suppose late 20s to mid 30s.

Edric Dayne is 13, and his father was Lord Dayne, the brother of Ser Arthur and Lady Ashara.

[kissdbyfire]

Edric isn't the only Dayne that has light hair. Darkstar has silver hair, with a black streak.

How old is Darkstar?

Where is Edric?

Who are their parents?

And Edric was last seen with the BwB - he was Beric's squire. I imagine he's still with them, but I'm not sure. His nickname is Ned, too.

[WillWork4NinjaPowers]

Gerold Dayne is in his 20s or 30s (GRRM was asked his age and said he had no idea, which shows his age doesn't matter a bit). I'd personally suppose late 20s to mid 30s.

Edric Dayne is 13, and his father was Lord Dayne, the brother of Ser Arthur and Lady Ashara.

OK. I pictured him in his 30's as well, for some reason.

Why isn't a name given for Edric's father? Who is his mother? Does it matter? Knew that about the age, I like to confuse myself.

[ser naes yennet]

As far as we know, there are quite a few noble families that have some relation to Targaryens. Even the Baratheons... so that isn't solid enough to go by. But I do think it would be pretty awesome to have a Dayne with Dawn/Lightbringer in hand, riding a pale dragon into battle :D

then by this statement, could Stannis be 1 of the 3 heads of the dragon?? i believe his father's mother was Targ, or her mother.

[WillWork4NinjaPowers]

So if Jon Snow is the new Sword of the Morning, then it doesn't mean that the SotM needs to be an excellent swordsman?

[Mad Maj]

This thread is excellent! Just a couple of random thoughts - the Valyrian steel sword of the Starks that was called Ice, was a replacement for an older sword, that is unaccounted for. I don't remember if it was supposed to be made of dragonsteel or what, but if Dawn is a weapon of the others, then the original Ice might be something like that also. And there is Old Nan's story about the Night King (who she thought was named Brandon Stark) and the Other woman that he loved - maybe she was Nissa Nissa? Anyway, maybe that older Ice is buried deep in the crypts of Winterfell - way deeper than Lyanna, of course.

Also, I keep wondering what exactly the Others want? I sometimes think they are coming South to get that Dawn sword, so safely ensconced all the way down South on the coast of Dorne. Like maybe it is very important to them? I guess Ice would be also, if it's also made out of whatever their magical substance is. (This substance that came from the blue star that is the eye of the Ice Dragon constellation that points the way north?)

I also love the idea of ice dragons - they would breath snow! Maybe something about Dawn and/or Ice makes it possible to kill or control an ice dragon? Otherwise how could just one (or two) heros and one (or two) swords defeat ALL the others? I mean maybe it can kill their leader, but the hero would still have to get through the rest of them to even find the leader . . . Maybe the Great Other is an ice dragon? Now that dragons are hatching, maybe the Others hatched one also, and they want to retrieve the sword so no one can use it against them? So many possibilities . . .

[Emilydayne]

Dawn is Lightbringer. War trophy? Could be. But I think it's the real deal!

[Payne In the Neck]

Hi folks!

First post on the forum, but I've been reading (lurking in a very uncreepy way! :unsure: ) for a while.

This is a great theory (like so many I've read on this forum) and well thought-out. One thing I would point out regarding Dawn being forged from a weapon of the Others, (this may have been already brought up, so apologies) is that the White Walker's sword is also described as a "crystal sword". (ASoS p. 252 U.S. paperback edition)

"It slid away from Paul's axe, armor rippling and its crystal sword twisted and spun and slipped between the iron rings of Paul's mail, through leather and wool and bone and flesh."

This description doesn't seem to fit with Dawn, imo. It sounds like it's made from different elements, more mineral/biological, than metal.

Any thoughts?

[Naathi Prince]

FWIW, Dawn is Lightbringer. Bank on it. ;)

That's what I've always figured.

[Lord Bresteil of the North]

I ... kind of like it.

OK, this is me being crackpot and rambling, but ...

... what if some guy in the Battle for the Dawn, probably a Night's Watch brother, maybe even one from Dorne who was a Dayne, had a star sigil — just a star, not a falling star — and died fighting an Other, but maybe was able to steal the thing's sword before he did so, or maybe even killed an Other with its own sword. This guy would literally be a "falling star," and could even be the "bleeding star" alluded to in the prophecy, in its/his original personification — like, this guy's death may have helped the original Azor Ahai do his Azor Ahai thang, and THAT is why "when the star bleeds" (or however it's worded) is part of the "checklist."

As a token of appreciation for the guy's sacrifice, the Night's Watch sends the sword back to House Dayne, who spin their own family legend about the sword being forged "from a fallen star," and change a basic star sigil to the "falling star" sigil. The family member's role in the Battle for the Dawn, maybe even a pivotal role, could also be what inspired the family's motto, alleged to be something like "we bring the dawn" or something similar.

So this:

1. Explains how the Dayne family might have gotten their sigil and maybe even their words.

2. Explains how they got Dawn.

3. Explains how the "bleeding star" got into the Azor Ahai prophecy.

4. Gives the Daynes and Dawn a big role to play in the Others fight without Dawn necessarily being Lightbringer.

This might also explain why The Lord doesn't yield it as it was probably a lesser lord who won it. The Dayne's might have then decided to honor that and give it to the families best swordsman.

[Alia of the knife]

Was looking for something else, and found this and bumped it.

 

Interesting.

[Mithras]

Dawn is the original Ice.

[Dorian Martell]

Or it is the weapon wielded by the last hero who also wore the bronze runic armor of the royces