An Early Take on Season 3

[Lord Varys]

Why should

Shae not be able to betray Tyrion in the show? As soon as he is arrested everything falls apart. Even if TV Shae honestly loves Tyrion - which I doubt - she is no position to stay true to him. After all, she is nothing but a whore. And the way things are set up in the show Cersei will accuse her to be an accomplice of both Sansa and Tyrion. It's only natural that Shae is going to try to save her neck by helping to convict Tyrion in the trial. This thing is a tragedy. And it makes no sense to change it. As for Shae and Tywin, well, that one sheds much more light on Tywin than on Shae. But I think it's understandable that Tyrion would kill both of them. They both betrayed him, after all.

We should also keep in mind that TV Shae has already indicated that she has little interest in staying at KL with Tyrion. Remember the whole Pentos idea last season? Shae has already betrayed Tyrion to Varys and was feeding Tyrion Varys' suggestions. It seems as if Shae really has a thing for Tyrion in the show. But if they are smart it will turn out that this is not the case...

[jons nissa]

I've looked for the post that got me to join this forum, but couldn't find it so here it goes:

How are they going to treat Shae since her charcater seems more devoted to Tyrion than the book Shae? How can she

Book Spoiler

betray Tyrion and sleep with Tywin, which leads to Tyrion killing Shae and then killing Tywin.

My guess:

Book Spoiler

Shae remains devoted to Tyrion. Tywin kills Shae, reveals his and Jaime's betrayal of Tyrion with Tysha, causing him to shoot his father and then lie to Jamie about killing Joffrey

This would get Tryion in the same place, emotionally, as in the book while allowing Shae to remain true to Tryion. The

betraylal would lead him to seek Tysha accross the narrow sea

i think it will be less complicated. season 2 has shae and tyrion expressing their love and devotion to each other: I am yours and you are mine.

however, once tyrion

is ordered to marry sansa, shae will become increasingly jealous and feel betrayed. then cersei will find her and "convince" her to testify against him by promising her a good marriage and jewels just as the book says. after the trail when shae asks for her payment, she will be told that she gets nothing until she tells her where sansa is: You were her maid. Do you expect me to believe that you knew nothing of her plans? shae leaves in tears and turns to what has always saved her - her next trick: tywin.

which brings us back to where she is eventually found.

[Words of Winter]

i think it will be less complicated. season 2 has shae and tyrion expressing their love and devotion to each other: I am yours and you are mine.

however, once tyrion

is ordered to marry sansa, shae will become increasingly jealous and feel betrayed. then cersei will find her and "convince" her to testify against him by promising her a good marriage and jewels just as the book says. after the trail when shae asks for her payment, she will be told that she gets nothing until she tells her where sansa is: You were her maid. Do you expect me to believe that you knew nothing of her plans? shae leaves in tears and turns to what has always saved her - her next trick: tywin.

which brings us back to where she is eventually found.

I like the way you think. It's been a while since I read the books and I actually forgot

Tyrion marries Sansa because it was quite clear in the books he had no desire to consumate the marriage and was still devoted and a lover of Shae. In the book, I didn't get a sense Shae minded being only the lover/mistress, but I think I need to re-read it

[Fred Stark]

<p>Sorry if this has been brought up..If you notice the trailer..it seems Talisa(Jeyne) will be accompanying Robb and Catelyn to Edmure's wedding..so will Talisa becomes victim in the wedding or the black sheep in the betrayal of Robb Stark

Plus,I saw this video in Youtube regarding the subtle hints in Season 2 about Talisa by the writers..if its true,the writers are absolutely brilliant..but its too good to be true....PS..note that The Rain of Castemere song is playing during the lovemaking scene between Robb and Talissa..'a cat with a different coat'?http://youtu.be/jsTVnZm9hFg

[Words of Winter]

<p>Sorry if this has been brought up..If you notice the trailer..it seems Talisa(Jeyne) will be accompanying Robb and Catelyn to Edmure's wedding..so will Talisa becomes victim in the wedding or the black sheep in the betrayal of Robb Stark

Plus,I saw this video in Youtube regarding the subtle hints in Season 2 about Talisa by the writers..if its true,the writers are absolutely brilliant..but its too good to be true....PS..note that The Rain of Castemere song is playing during the lovemaking scene between Robb and Talissa..'a cat with a different coat'?http://youtu.be/jsTVnZm9hFg

Interesting video. I just thought Talisa was a composite character replacing Jayne from the books. Either the writers are up to something, dropping the appropriate hints or Talisa is a lovestruck "Florence Bonesaw." (props to whoever coined that name) Either way,

Talisa/Jayne+Robb is the proximate cause for the RW. I find the most intriguing part to the video - Roose. Why wound he send his son to take/pillage winterfell if he did not know Robb's end was nye? Perhaps he did because he knew Talisa was going to 'love' Robb.

[Jolene Brown]

George's books are NOT Harry Potter, under UK laws (USA law) you can't have actors under a certain age in a show with adult content, no excuse, it's the law.

Huh? What about Kerry Ingram, who is playing Shireen? She is 10 or 11, I would guess. What about the kid who plays Rickon? You obviously can have actors under a certain age in this show. That makes no sense. If they had wanted to cast a child actor as Missandei, they could have. They chose not to.

[Lord Varys]

The people who think that Missandei has to be aged up consider she'll step in for

Dany's lesbo scene

from ASoS. But of course this was never part of Missandei's original character. In fact, there is nothing sexual whatsoever about Missandei in the books. She virtually embodies all those innocent children Dany tries to protect. So, no, there was no need to age Missandei up.

In fact, since this show is actually creating great young actresses and actors by not aging every character up one would have hoped they kept some of that courage.

On that video:

Some nice theories. Cool, that there are actually people who try to explain 'Reginald Lannister'. Anyway, if Talisa turns out to be a Lannister spy it will actually be interesting to see the outcome of this. Does she get caught in her own honey trap? Does she fall truly in love with Robb? Or will it remain an act until the very end?

Tywin did not bring the Westerlings in on the Red Wedding. This may foreshadow Talisa's eventual fate. If Talisa accompanies Robb to the Twins she is a dead girl walking. Walder is going to want her head as much as he wants Robb's.

[Ser Creighton]

Whoah whoah whoah ... Jon and Robb are supposed to be about 18 in the show. The ACTORS are around 25, but in the first season Catelyn refers to Ned "riding off to war" 17 years ago ... so that would make Robb/Jon about 18 - actors are always playing characters younger than they really are, so that's not a big deal and not new. 18 is still young enough to have "growing pains." They HAD to age up characters or else it would have been impossible for certain storylines (like Dany's) and looked ridiculous. In our minds, we can accept younger characters b/c of the way people lived in the Middle Ages, but on screen, it would look absurd to have a 35 year old playing Ned and 13/14 year olds playing "full grown" women/men. I think the biggest issue, though, was the sex/nudity in Dany's storyline - they had to have the character be at least 18 (not just the actor, b/c in some countries it's illegal to depict sexuality with even a pretend minor when the actor is an adult).

That makes Jon and Robb 16, 9 months to carry to full term. Neither of them looks 16 or 18, Kit looks younger than he is but the guy who plays Robb looks in his 20's which he is. And none of that changes the fact that the characters are written as 14 at the begining to 16-17 currently. They are young teens in the books and often make the mistakes of young teens, they make the same mistakes on the show running around looking like 25 year olds. Pouty Jon, I mean come on, he had a couple of scenes where he is acting like a child, which is right for the books, but Jon on the the show is not anything close to a teen. It's an example of what aging a character up does to the character. Do the reverse have Ned running around acting like a 14 year old, you don't think that would be strange?

Like Tywin calling Robb a boy. I mean I understand the line in the books but when I look at Robb no matter what age he is suppose to be, I do not think boy or anything close to it. When 14 year old Jon stands up to Thorne in the books it's a dynamic character building moment for Jon. When 24 year old Kit does it I am wondering why he even takes Thorne seriously or why people keep treating Jon like a kid.

[Words of Winter]

Huh? What about Kerry Ingram, who is playing Shireen? She is 10 or 11, I would guess. What about the kid who plays Rickon? You obviously can have actors under a certain age in this show. That makes no sense. If they had wanted to cast a child actor as Missandei, they could have. They chose not to.

IIRC, Rickon and Shireen never had sexual scenes in the books nor in the series. An underage actor cannot be in a sexual scene in the UK for obvious reasons, but again, IIRC, even an actor of the age of consent cannot portray a underage child in a sexual scene in the UK. I am hardly an expert but this is what I remember from an interview with GRRM about the aging of the actors in the series vs the books. In the book, Irri is still alive, in the series Irri is dead. I think they aged Missandei, so they she can

become the lesbian paramour to Daenerys while in Merreen instead of Irri. I mean, come on, HBO won't pass on an opportuinty for girl on girl action.

As long as the child aren't in the scenes, and aren't sexualized, they can portray other characters in the series.

[Words of Winter]

That makes Jon and Robb 16, 9 months to carry to full term. Neither of them looks 16 or 18, Kit looks younger than he is but the guy who plays Robb looks in his 20's which he is. And none of that changes the fact that the characters are written as 14 at the begining to 16-17 currently. They are young teens in the books and often make the mistakes of young teens, they make the same mistakes on the show running around looking like 25 year olds. Pouty Jon, I mean come on, he had a couple of scenes where he is acting like a child, which is right for the books, but Jon on the the show is not anything close to a teen. It's an example of what aging a character up does to the character. Do the reverse have Ned running around acting like a 14 year old, you don't think that would be strange?

Maybe they aged with stress. They grew up really fast.

:box:

:)

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

The people who think that Missandei has to be aged up consider she'll step in for

Dany's lesbo scene

from ASoS. But of course this was never part of Missandei's original character. In fact, there is nothing sexual whatsoever about Missandei in the books. She virtually embodies all those innocent children Dany tries to protect. So, no, there was no need to age Missandei up.

In fact, since this show is actually creating great young actresses and actors by not aging every character up one would have hoped they kept some of that courage.

On that video:

Some nice theories. Cool, that there are actually people who try to explain 'Reginald Lannister'. Anyway, if Talisa turns out to be a Lannister spy it will actually be interesting to see the outcome of this. Does she get caught in her own honey trap? Does she fall truly in love with Robb? Or will it remain an act until the very end?

Tywin did not bring the Westerlings in on the Red Wedding. This may foreshadow Talisa's eventual fate. If Talisa accompanies Robb to the Twins she is a dead girl walking. Walder is going to want her head as much as he wants Robb's.

That's what annoys me. Dany's scene is more important than such an interesting character.

[Ser Creighton]

The initial aging up was done for legal reasons, as David or Dan said recently they would be in jail right now if they had of used child actors.

For me it does not change the dynamic one bit, and I don't follow or agree with your arguments, in terms of this show.

Look doing this series one show a year, lord, Arya is going to 18 to 20 years old when we get to the end (if that happens!).

All the 'child' characters in GRRM's books (as actors) will age naturally , nothing can be done about it.

In terms of the dramatic narrative, at least in George's books does not change a thing.

I understand the aging up process, but you have to change the character in order to do it, and the script. It can be well done if you do right, but there are times where Jon/Kit is acting like a 14 year old and my brain just looks at Kit and goes what is wrong with this guy man up.

As for Missy and Daario, look I am sorry but Missy did not need to be aged up as she has zero sex scenes. My own opinion is that they Gave Dany a generic typical Hollywood BFF and a generic love interest instead of the characters in the books. It's easy and and it's cheap and it's BS. Robb and Jon were basically adult versions of themselves, with a few script set backs, but this is totally different, these are totally different characters, Missy and Daario from the books are gone and replaced and their was no need for it. The blue or sometimes purple beard bothered them? Look you can tone that back easy enough, changing his personality and nationality is just wrong. This dude is as far from Daario as you can get. Like I said a generic love intrest.

As for Dany and Missy, all I see when I look at the pair together is clueless. Literally the movie Clueless it's that typical of a Hollywood BFF pairing. i could even deal with 14-15 year old Missy, but 24-25, it's just way to much. And like I said about this as well, lazy, typical and generic. I don't think it ruins the show, but I don't like the direction they are taking with some of their choices.

[Loras]

That's what annoys me. Dany's scene is more important than such an interesting character.

I am hoping that you are arguing that Missandei is more important as a character than Dany's sex scene.

I actually think ageing up Missandei is a good idea, Dany needs someone close to her own age to chat to.

[Lord Varys]

Well, they could have kept both Irri and Doreah in the show. Or at least Irri. There was no need to kill them.

[Éadaoin]

I understand the aging up process, but you have to change the character in order to do it, and the script. It can be well done if you do right, but there are times where Jon/Kit is acting like a 14 year old and my brain just looks at Kit and goes what is wrong with this guy man up.

As for Missy and Daario, look I am sorry but Missy did not need to be aged up as she has zero sex scenes. My own opinion is that they Gave Dany a generic typical Hollywood BFF and a generic love interest instead of the characters in the books. It's easy and and it's cheap and it's BS. Robb and Jon were basically adult versions of themselves, with a few script set backs, but this is totally different, these are totally different characters, Missy and Daario from the books are gone and replaced and their was no need for it. The blue or sometimes purple beard bothered them? Look you can tone that back easy enough, changing his personality and nationality is just wrong. This dude is as far from Daario as you can get. Like I said a generic love intrest.

As for Dany and Missy, all I see when I look at the pair together is clueless. Literally the movie Clueless it's that typical of a Hollywood BFF pairing. i could even deal with 14-15 year old Missy, but 24-25, it's just way to much. And like I said about this as well, lazy, typical and generic. I don't think it ruins the show, but I don't like the direction they are taking with some of their choices.

I'm guessing that they aged her up so that she could have a sex scene with Dany. Since Irri was killed off.

[boojam]

I understand the aging up process, but you have to change the character in order to do it, and the script. It can be well done if you do right, but there are times where Jon/Kit is acting like a 14 year old and my brain just looks at Kit and goes what is wrong with this guy man up.

As far as I can tell by season 2 D and D have made that adjustment it does not bother me since I understand that it is an adaptation, and will have to remain so.

Actually I don't see why how it's going to have that much impact on Arya's character especially when she gets to Braavos.

In fact it seems a more natural development, if I remember right, one George wanted to make.

[NorthSouthEastWesteros]

I am hoping that you are arguing that Missandei is more important as a character than Dany's sex scene.

I actually think ageing up Missandei is a good idea, Dany needs someone close to her own age to chat to.

Yes, I am.

[boojam]

Huh? What about Kerry Ingram, who is playing Shireen? She is 10 or 11, I would guess. What about the kid who plays Rickon? You obviously can have actors under a certain age in this show. That makes no sense. If they had wanted to cast a child actor as Missandei, they could have. They chose not to.

I think you can but you will notice Art Parkinson is no where near any of the adult scenes, still that would not exclude from child labor laws in the UK. By the by Kerry Ingram will be 13 when season 4 production starts.

D and D remarked in the cometary for season 1 that Isaac Hempstead Wright was not even observing Jamie and Cersei , most of that scene when he would have been there in the book he's not in the show.

[protar]

EDIT: Never Mind

[StarkBlack21]

The House of The Undying was ridiculous in the book. I'm glad they changed it. Some people have to realize certain elements from the book do NOT translate for good TV. I won't be shocked if they change LADY STONEHEART some. Don't be surprised if they may have Catelyn survive or not make her TRULY UNDEAD.