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WhatIsDeadMayNeverLive

[potential book spoilers]did this episode just prove that...

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Bran is The Last Hero reborn?

Jojen said that the White Walkers cannot be stopped by the NW nor by all the armies of Westeros and Sam said:"But you will stop them?"

Jojen did not answer, but it seems he believes that if Bran cannot stop them, no one can.

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I don't think so; Bran will have a central role in the war against the others, but that scene doesn't prove anything, it's just Jojen's opinion: Melissandre said exactly the same thing about Stannis

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I think it's like the 3 Dragons. Dany,Jon& Bran. The Song of Ice and Fire. Also Melisaendra believes Stannis to be Azhor Azhai and might come to believe otherwise as is implied by her seeing only Snow when she asks to see Azhor.

Also from the HBO show we saw at end of S2 Dany not sit on a Throne that was covered in Snow.

My guess is that Dany may end up seeing the necessity of sacrificing herself & the Dragons to save the world.

But only George knows for sure.

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I read in another topic that during Bran's journey north, he meets exacty twelve people... as in the twelve friends that went north with the Last Hero. I found it particularly interesting.

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I read in another topic that during Bran's journey north, he meets exacty twelve people... as in the twelve friends that went north with the Last Hero. I found it particularly interesting.

Where did you read this? and who are the 12? surely the number of wildlings they met at the gift increased this number

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yeah...... when Sam said that I was like "aaahhh wwhhaaaa?" its never mentioned in the books that Jojen thinks Bran is going to stop the others, is it? all he said was that his destiny was beyond the Wall, didn't he? did I totally miss something there? surely D&D wouldn't slap a big fat sloppy spoiler in there like that! would they? uhh im questioning everything now...

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Bran is a key force, but not the only force. All of the essential players will have their part to play.

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That was a horrible bit of writing, even if Jojen suspects Bran to be the key to Azor Ahai.

Sam should have said "well, we killed the whytes with fire, and I have a buttload of obsidian daggers and arrowheads to kill the Others with...here, take one. Take one and shove it up your arse, captain know-it-all."

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Well the show has turned Jojen into deus-ex-machina personified, so basically everything he says is true with no vagueness.

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I don't know about that, but it sure seemed to point at Tyrion not being Tywin's true son.

Even the unsullied in my house turned and looked at me like WTH when Tywin said what he said.

One specifically asked, Tyrion isn't really Tywin's son?

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I don't know about that, but it sure seemed to point at Tyrion not being Tywin's true son.

Even the unsullied in my house turned and looked at me like WTH when Tywin said what he said.

One specifically asked, Tyrion isn't really Tywin's son?

Huh? If i remember correctly, Tyrion asks Tywin when Tywin has ever done anything that wasnt selfish and Twyin said, "The day you were born i didnt kill you." Meaning, it WOULD have been in Tywin's best interest to murder his dwarf son, but he couldnt make himself do it because Tyrion is a true Lannister, regardless of deformity.

I didnt take this as Tywin saying Tyrion isnt his true son at all. In fact, it is the opposite. Tywin is saying the only reason why he didnt kill Tyrion as a babe was BECAUSE he is his true son. Even an unsullied should have been able to follow that dialogue.

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Huh? If i remember correctly, Tyrion asks Tywin when Tywin has ever done anything that wasnt selfish and Twyin said, "The day you were born i didnt kill you." Meaning, it WOULD have been in Tywin's best interest to murder his dwarf son, but he couldnt make himself do it because Tyrion is a true Lannister, regardless of deformity.

I didnt take this as Tywin saying Tyrion isnt his true son at all. In fact, it is the opposite. Tywin is saying the only reason why he didnt kill Tyrion as a babe was BECAUSE he is his true son. Even an unsullied should have been able to follow that dialogue.

I guess that would explain why it is all of a sudden popping up everywhere now.... Everyone followed it exactly like you did.

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I guess that would explain why it is all of a sudden popping up everywhere now.... Everyone followed it exactly like you did.

Yes it is popping up everywhere... because I see you and only you talking about it... in a thread that is about Bran... :dunno:

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That was a horrible bit of writing, even if Jojen suspects Bran to be the key to Azor Ahai.

Sam should have said "well, we killed the whytes with fire, and I have a buttload of obsidian daggers and arrowheads to kill the Others with...here, take one. Take one and shove it up your arse, captain know-it-all."

lol!

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I had this idea in my head during all the Bran scenes, follow me:

Remember how George R.R. Martin is all about breaking fantasy cliches?

Remember the moment we all decided that this show is not your every day fantasy show? The moment the seemingly main character, the chosen one, the Harry Potter of sorts - Bran Stark was crippled?

So I was thinking there is no way Martin will go back to the chosen one scenario with Bran beyond the wall. Sure, he meets the three-eyed crow, and he develops his powers but what if all of this is a plot to keep the heir to the Starks alive. Or even worse what if Jojen and Meera are orchestrating a sinister plot involving Bran. What if we are led to believe that Bran will be the chosen one and the whole plot is a ploy?

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Remember the moment we all decided that this show is not your every day fantasy show? The moment the seemingly main character, the chosen one, the Harry Potter of sorts - Bran Stark was crippled?

So I was thinking there is no way Martin will go back to the chosen one scenario with Bran beyond the wall. Sure, he meets the three-eyed crow, and he develops his powers but what if all of this is a plot to keep the heir to the Starks alive. Or even worse what if Jojen and Meera are orchestrating a sinister plot involving Bran. What if we are led to believe that Bran will be the chosen one and the whole plot is a ploy?

Welcome! I love your enthusiasm and love that you've given thought to what future events may turn out to be. My thinking, though, is that you might want to be careful in making global statements such as "we all decided". There are many different people on this site, many different viewpoints, and many different styles of communication. I have found tolerance, respect, and considerateness to be the rule by far, but at times some folks do get rather "adamant", especially if you seem to be speaking for them, and in that case are likely to jump on such statements with both feet, not always with tact, and that can end up being a definite "ouch".

Anyway, I can definitely agree that Bran is certainly a very major player in ASOIAF, and I loved his scenes in this last episode.

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Huh? If i remember correctly, Tyrion asks Tywin when Tywin has ever done anything that wasnt selfish and Twyin said, "The day you were born i didnt kill you." Meaning, it WOULD have been in Tywin's best interest to murder his dwarf son, but he couldnt make himself do it because Tyrion is a true Lannister, regardless of deformity.

I didnt take this as Tywin saying Tyrion isnt his true son at all. In fact, it is the opposite. Tywin is saying the only reason why he didnt kill Tyrion as a babe was BECAUSE he is his true son. Even an unsullied should have been able to follow that dialogue.

But one could also construe Tywin as having said that while it would have benefitted his personal honor to have killed the offspring of a cuckolding, he elected not to do so in order that the image of the family might remain intact. Or something like that. Either way, I don't really think that scene points to Tyrion not being Tywin's son, as it's just as easy to construe Tywin as having had the conflict simply because Tyrion was born a dwarf.

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Bran is The Last Hero reborn?

You mean, "the" Azor Ahai?

At this point, your guess is as good as mine.

ETA:

I don't know about that, but it sure seemed to point at Tyrion not being Tywin's true son.

At this point on the books, I feel the only Lannisters that are not Tywin's are Cersei & Jaime.

They indulged in Targaryen incest since early childhood, produced what can only be described as a "Mad King" Joffrey, they are fascinated/repelled by fire depending if one is Cersei or Jaime and they look like their mother (Joanna was a Lannister) more than their biological father (the original Mad King himself).

Just my theory, of course.

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Well the show has turned Jojen into deus-ex-machina personified, so basically everything he says is true with no vagueness.

Or so the showrunners want us to believe.

I got the exact opposite impression. This being ASOIAF, I think it means Bran will die chasing dreams of grandeur and prophecy which aren't fulfilled in this series. And damn, the kid is more naive than Shae.

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