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I love the turnaround. When he first mentions fire he's losing his bond with the crowd. But when he tells an anecdote about a mother and father dying leaving their child an orphan, the entire crowd is bawling and ready to destroy fire. I don't think even Kellhus could pull this off this quickly.

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Are you telling me that the speech was serious?

My hopes that Goodkind is just being misunderstood by the uneducated masses have been crushed. For a moment I thought that we were blind to the subtle irony of his writing.

It gets worse, believe it or not.

Just a few pages later, Kahlan tells Richard all about how as a precursor to Darken Rahl's invasion of the midlands, he set up agents in positions of authority and did two things: 1) Made the people afraid of an invasion so that they would turn all sorts of power over to these agents, and 2) Outlaw fire.

Amazingly, no one makes the connection.

I'm serious. For a moment, it almost seems like maybe Richard might connect the dots, but he doesn't. And so he spends the entire rest of the book thinking that his brother Michael (who after the speech behaves like a totall asshole to Richard, which is apparently normal) is a great guy. And then *surprise* Michael turns out to be an agent of Darken Rahl. (HOW COULD WE HAVE MISSED IT!!! TG IS A MASTER OF INTRIGUE!!)

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Well, one thing is for sure, this speech about the global danger of fire based on one single specific event is on the same level than the argumentation equating drug users with a party to murder, based on a another singular event.

Aside from that, does anyone but me find it terribly lame to have the mother die because she went back into the fire after she successfully escaped in the first place? I mean, it's like saying "I need her to die, but first I need the boy safe, so I'll make her jump in the flames when they are ok"

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I mean, this means that the point of the -albeit poor- speech is moot, as the fault for their mother's death lies not with the fire or the anger or anything, it lies with the woman herself... Had she decided to jump off a bridge, would they try to outlaw running water?

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He wiped the tears with a handkerchief he had handy.

Another fine example of Goodkind's masterful skill with the english language.

Aside from that, does anyone but me find it terribly lame to have the mother die because she went back into the fire after she successfully escaped in the first place? I mean, it's like saying "I need her to die, but first I need the boy safe, so I'll make her jump in the flames when they are ok"

Maybe his mother was angry and that's the angry that killed her. Not the fact that she ran back into a burning building while her husband was being beat by a stranger. Which makes me wonder what was more important to her? Whatever thing she was going to get or the well-being of her husband?

Reading that speech reminded me of this scene

Sir Bedever: There are ways of telling whether she is a witch.

Peasant 1: Are there? Oh well, tell us.

Sir Bedevere: Tell me. What do you do with witches?

Peasant 1: Burn them.

Sir Bedevere: And what do you burn, apart from witches?

Peasant 1: More witches.

Peasant 2: Wood.

Sir Bedevere: Good. Now, why do witches burn?

Peasant 3: ...because they're made of... wood?

Sir Bedevere: Good. So how do you tell whether she is made of wood?

Peasant 1: Build a bridge out of her.

Sir Bedevere: But can you not also build bridges out of stone?

Peasant 1: Oh yeah.

Sir Bedevere: Does wood sink in water?

Peasant 1: No, no, it floats!... It floats! Throw her into the pond!

Sir Bedevere: No, no. What else floats in water?

Peasant 1: Bread.

Peasant 2: Apples.

Peasant 3: Very small rocks.

Peasant 1: Cider.

Peasant 2: Gravy.

Peasant 3: Cherries.

Peasant 1: Mud.

Peasant 2: Churches.

Peasant 3: Lead! Lead!

King Arthur: A Duck.

Sir Bedevere: ...Exactly. So, logically...

Peasant 1: If she weighed the same as a duck... she's made of wood.

Sir Bedevere: And therefore...

Peasant 2: ...A witch!

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"Oh..... the sweet mystery of life at last I've found you...."

Ah, you're just like all the rest. 7 or 8 quick ones and it's off with the boys.

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Isn't this an utter rejection of Goodkind's objectivist, libertarian ideology? I thought he was against people working together.

To be fair, his brother who's making the speech actually turns out to be evil and working with the big bad guy, who was burnt by fire himself or something. There's even a subtle bit of foreshadowing, in that he tries to feel up Kahlan. I'm not sure quite how ridiculous TG expected the speech to be though.

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Yeah, real subtle, that foreshadowing.

I can't find my brother's copy of WFR right now, but I encourage Mad Moose to u-se Kahlan's meeting with Michael at the party for the next QOTD. It's completely ridiculous, and with some of the worst dialogue I've ever subjected my poor eyes too.

Reading these excerpts from Goodkind, I find it very hard to believe that there are any authors out there even approaching Terry's very own dimension of sucking-so-hard-there's-a-vacuum.

The only thing I find clever about TG, is the first rule. It is all too true, and the success of his books are all the evidence you need. He's saying "people are stupid, therefore they'll read my asshat book even though I spend it making more or less indirectly fun of them". Talk about tailoring your product for the masses.

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Good morning boys and girls, its now time for the Terry Goodkind Quote of the Day.

At this point in the story our hero has seized control of the Midlands and out of nowhere a girl from his youth named Nadine Brighton, shows up. She shows up because a witch woman told her that she and Richard are to be married. She and Kahlan get along famously and Nadine told her a story about how she tried to catch Richard before. But she's a lying skank. Clever, clever Kahlan tricks the truth out of her.

"Well, your cut looks no wors this morning. That's encouraging." She carefully wiped at the old poultice. "I saw Richard on the way out. He looked upset. You two haven't had a fight, I hope?"

Kahlan's forbearance evaporated. "No. He was upset because of something else."

Nadine paused at her work. She turned to her bag and brought back a horn. The fragrance of pine pitch filled the air when she opened it. Kahlan winced as Nadine dabbed on the poultice. Wen she was satisfied, she began winding the bandage back around Kahlan's arm.

"There's no need to be embarrassed," Nadine said in a casual tone. "Lovers sometimes have spats. They don't always end a relationship. I'm sure Richard will come to his senses. Eventually."

"Actually," Kahlan said, "I told him that I understood about you and him. About what happened. That was why he was so upset."

Nadine's wrapping slowed. "What do you mean?"

"I told him what you said about letting him catch you kissing his brother. The little 'shove' you gave him. Remember?"

Nadine brought the tails of the bandage around, her fingers suddenly working swiftly at tying them. "Oh, that."

"Yes, that. Seems you lied to me. Richard told me what really happened."

Nadine's freckles vanishe in a crimson glow. Kahloan stood and gestured toward a tufted velvet chair.

"Care to set things right? To tell me your side of it?"

Nadine stood woodenly for a moment, then sank into the chair. She folded her hands in her lap and stared down at them. "I told you, I had to give him a shove."

"You call that a shove?"

Nadine turned even redder. "Well." She flicked a hand. "I knew how boys lost their heads over...over their lust. I figured that was my best chance of getting him to...to lay claim to me."

Kahlan was confused, but she didn't let it show. "Seems it would have been a little late for that."

"Well, not necessarily. I was bound to end up with one of them when I let Richard catch me like that, naked, atop Michael, having a good time of it. Michael was game for me, that was for sure."

Kahlan's brow rose. "How did you figure that--"

"I had it worked out. Richard would come in behind me. He'd see me on Michael's lance, crying out with the pleasure of it, and he'd be taken with lust by the sight, and by my willingness. Then he'd lose his head, his inhibition, and at last he'd have to have me, too."

Kahlan stared dumbly. "How was that going to get you Richard?"

Nadine cleared her throat. "Well, it was like this; I figured that Richard would enjoy having me. I'd make sure of that. Then, I'd tell him no the next time he wanted me, and he'd want me so much, after he'd had a sampling, that he'd claim me. If Michael wanted to claim me, too, then it's my choice, and I'd choose Richard.

"If Richard didn't claim me, and I got pregnant, then I'd say it was his and he'd marry me because it could be his. If I didn't get pregnant, and he wouldn't claim me, well, then, there was still Michael. I figured second best was better than none."

<<blah blah>>

At last, Nadine collected her voice and continued. "Well, that was my plan, anyway. It seemed to make sense. I figured I'd get Richard out of it, at best, and Michael at worst.

"It didn't work the way I thought. Richard walked in and froze. I smiled over my shoulder. I invited him to come join the fun, or else to come to me later and I'd see to him, too."

Kahlan held her breath.

"That was the first time I saw that look in Richard's eyes. He didn't say a word. He just turned and walked out."

~Terry Goodkind, Temple of the Winds

I think Kahlan is the only woman in this series who isn't an outrageous whore.

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I think you are forgetting the bit later on in that book where Kahlan agrees to a wife swap situation which will allow them to open the Temple of Winds. Obviously outrageous sexual shenanigans are the only way to gain access to a holy temple after all.

But then our hero does the old switchero so he ends up with Kahlan, only she does not realise and thinking it is the other guy really goes for it like the outrageous whore she truly is - yes folks she has sex with what she thinks is a total stranger and does not realise it is her own husband simply because it is too dark to see! :lmao:

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Quite right Mountaingoat. The spirits decree that the price to get into the Temple of the Winds is that Richard and Kahlan have to get married to other people, and fuck them in order to open the doors. Makes perfect sense to me. I wonder if that always works, could have gotten Gandalf and company into Moria quicker, if only they were willing to fuck each other.

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"That was the first time I saw that look in Richard's eyes. He didn't say a word. He just turned and walked out."

~Terry Goodkind, Temple of the Winds

that look = the thing? i think nadine is lucky to have kept her tongue.

Nadine's freckles vanished in a crimson glow

really? did they?

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