Possible end of series - no iron throne?

[Gaz0680]

Which four kingdoms would those be?

I think the IT will stay. But idk, anything's possible. It'd be cool for the series to end with Westeros on a path to a more modern form of government.

I disagree with the last sentence.

For one, more modern government doesn't necessarily equal better government.

There is a LOT wrong with democracy for example. For one thing, it gives the false illusion that the citizens have a say. Really, they don't.

Most democracies give the citizens a choice of picking between two corrupt political parties every few years and that's it.

They have no actual say in the decision making of the government or the laws that affect their lives.

In the end, democracy is no different to a monarchy, oligarchy or dictatorship where a very small number of people (or one person) do all the decision making for the populace.

Keep your damn democracy out of my fantasy, please and thanks.

This too.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

because democracy is boring, that's why. Ideal and fair, yes, but boring. I would rather see the iron throne turn into a deadly transformer with all the swords sticking out of it and go on a rampage of innocents and/or white walkers then for Westeros to become a watered down medieval democracy at the end.

So in other words you'd prefer war? Haha np I respect your opinion though.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

I disagree with the last sentence.

For one, more modern government doesn't necessarily equal better government.

There is a LOT wrong with democracy for example. For one thing, it gives the false illusion that the citizens have a say. Really, they don't.

Most democracies give the citizens a choice of picking between two corrupt political parties every few years and that's it.

They have no actual say in the decision making of the government or the laws that affect their lives.

In the end, democracy is no different to a monarchy, oligarchy or dictatorship where a very small number of people (or one person) do all the decision making for the populace.

This too.

If the Monarch is being elected I have no problem but if one family is ruling that is not good it is worse than our modern day government, like the people of westeros had to deal with mad kings, however if it were being elected it would be more fair to the people and a bad monarch can easily be overthrown

[Raksha the Demon]

Even if seven kingdoms under the rule of the Iron Throne become four independent regions; I think it would take at least a couple of hundred of years for democracy to catch on throughout Westeros. Also, I think a central authority on the Iron Throne might be better able to preserve life in the South during the winter, unless the central authority is a fool or a fanatic (which, given the political tension between Mace Tyrell and the High Septeon, is entirely possible).

[TheTowerOfJoy]

in all honesty, if there's no iron throne at the end I'm gonna be pissed off. Keep your damn democracy out of my fantasy, please and thanks.

I personally think it ends with the destruction of the throne (and perhaps the entirety of KL), but no actual establishment of a new form of government. My guess is that it's left up to the reader to determine where they go at the end of the war, but most of the upper level nobility will likely be gone.

[Baby Drogon]

Iron throne still stands but (sadly) Targ dynasty is reformed with Jon and Dany :dunno:

[binga]

because democracy is boring, that's why. Ideal and fair, yes, but boring. I would rather see the iron throne turn into a deadly transformer with all the swords sticking out of it and go on a rampage of innocents and/or white walkers then for Westeros to become a watered down medieval democracy at the end.

Democracy is hardly boring and most of the time not ideal and fair. It is the best form of government we have though. Democracy by itself however is not enough, you also need enlightened values to help nurture it. Westeros is not ready to make the jump to democracy seeing as how it is a medieval/dark age society. That being said I do think there will be a "winner" at the end and a monarchy.

[grand old duke of stark]

Democracy would never work in this primitive a society. Crikey, it hardly worked in Athens. Westeros is relatively backwards; it needs structure based on an interpersonal system. That isn't very fair, but it is realistic. Maybe the smallfolk would be given more of a voice or at least representation of some sort in the capital. And yes, the IT itself if a symbol of violence and oppression. It should be dispensed with. I'm confident that later rulers will appreciate a more comfortable seat.

[Muggle]

i think the Church of 7 will rule as the Catholics did in Rome over most of the world for to many years

[Trinton07]

I disagree with the last sentence.

For one, more modern government doesn't necessarily equal better government.

There is a LOT wrong with democracy for example. For one thing, it gives the false illusion that the citizens have a say. Really, they don't.

Most democracies give the citizens a choice of picking between two corrupt political parties every few years and that's it.

They have no actual say in the decision making of the government or the laws that affect their lives.

Bro chill out. It aint a damn political form. Yeah governemnt is corrupt and shit whatever. Still think it'd be cool to see Westeros on the move to modernization. Belive it or not I think that modern democartic government is actually superior to monarchy. Call me a fuckin psycho.

[Myrgirl]

If the civilization is going towards a democratic one based on the post then Jon wont be in charge since it is "democratic"

Hi! I guess he would be elected president... He has been exposed to other methods of government, aka the Mance Rayder. He's lived with the Starks, joined the Night's watch and hung out with the windings. He's been exposed to different "societies" sort of speak.

[FC_Lymond]

I think KL will go up in flames.

But the Targ ruler will stick the IT in a field and still rule the land.

[Citadel_acolyte]

I think that the iron throne is doomed, but I don't think that Westeros is headed for democracy. I agree that there will be three or four kingdoms carved out of it. King's Landing is itself described as a cesspool, which only became the Royal City because Aegon found it convenient. I seem to remember Old Town as being a former seat of power.

[Jon of the Dead]

I'm fairly sure the IT will be destroyed at the end of the series, mainly because of GRRM's recent comments on the throne being "scary", "twisted" and a place for the monarch to look down at his people. This implies the IT and what it stands for is not entirely good.

[King Tam Stark]

I personally think it will end with there being 8 kingdoms(the deep north) and JT on the throne. JT stands for Jon Targ

it wouldn't surprise me to see john terry on the throne :lmao:

[mrunderhill]

I disagree with the last sentence.

For one, more modern government doesn't necessarily equal better government.

There is a LOT wrong with democracy for example. For one thing, it gives the false illusion that the citizens have a say. Really, they don't.

Most democracies give the citizens a choice of picking between two corrupt political parties every few years and that's it.

They have no actual say in the decision making of the government or the laws that affect their lives.

In the end, democracy is no different to a monarchy, oligarchy or dictatorship where a very small number of people (or one person) do all the decision making for the populace.

This too.

So very true. Democracy is just the new 'divine right'. A way to justify to the people why certain people should rule.

On topic the Iron Throne belongs to the Targaryens. It's their city, their castle and their throne. Either a Targaryen reclaims the throne or something new will have to be introduced. A new throne, a new castle and a new capital.

There seems to be four very distinct cultures in Westeros: Iron Islands, Dorne, North and the rest. So perhaps it will be broken up into these four.

[cealicu_ca]

I guess it would end the game of thrones. They will have to fashion a new name for the game unless a democracy is started.

And isn't democracy a game too? :)

[cealicu_ca]

because democracy is boring, that's why. Ideal and fair, yes, but boring. I would rather see the iron throne turn into a deadly transformer with all the swords sticking out of it and go on a rampage of innocents and/or white walkers then for Westeros to become a watered down medieval democracy at the end.

erm... democracy is neither ideal, nor fair (imho).

on topic: i'm rather inclined towards the "rome" like situation, especially since those pesky religious zealots were given a free hand by cersei.

[cealicu_ca]

So in other words you'd prefer war? Haha np I respect your opinion though.

So "democracy" doesn't imply war? :)) Lately we've seen wars fought to... impose democracy (leave aside the oxymoron). No offense intended.

[Veltigar]

The Seven Kingdoms are going to survive the series. They might even grow (lands of always winter and perhaps land in Essos as well). And they’ll certainly become much more culturally diverse (when Dany and her hordes of slaves land) and open to the rest of the world. The Iron Throne itself (as an object) might be destroyed and replaced by another throne.

In all honesty I just don’t get people who see independent Kingdoms at the end of this series. Westeros was a lot harder to live in before the Targs came and united the Kingdoms. Yes, there have been major wars in Targ Westeros, especially after the dragons died. But it’s still better than the constant carnage and bickering that would take place if the 7K were independent. The only Kingdom that would benefit from this are the Iron Islands and their old way. All the other nations would suffer even more than they did under Targ rule.