why the HBO show 'MIGHT' have f****d up

[locke and key]

I'm glad they skip the kingsmoot altogether. Useless in the plot and boring. Now Asha can step right into Stannis without taking that detour to the iron islands.

without the kingsmoot, none of the greyjoy storylines other than theon's could exist in adwd and affc

[Colonel Green]

without the kingsmoot, none of the greyjoy storylines other than theon's could exist in adwd and affc

Euron seizes the throne with a minimum of fuss and either sends Victarion on his quest, or goes himself (in the scenario where they merge those two). Easy.

[DarkAndFullOfTurnips]

without the kingsmoot, none of the greyjoy storylines other than theon's could exist in adwd and affc

I wouldn't go that far since it isn't necessarily something they need to film, but certainly the Kingsmoot would be the only good way IMO to introduce the characters and make them relevant/interesting. We just don't really need more than a couple scenes and Aeron's delusional blathering.

[andrew_]

sorry, seems most people are capable of reading it. Should i make it simpler for you next time? also the only way you could know it isnt properly punctuated and structured is if you had read it, which you stated you didnt... so instead of trying to look funny or whatever you failed in pulling off, just dont. stick to the asoiaf theme, its for discussions not petty corrections.

Nah I'm not a grammar Nazi but it's clear you put next to no effort into how you wrote your post, therefore I only skimmed over it taking notice of you lack of articulation and English skills. And I'm not trying to be funny, I'm trying to educate you, if you don't put any effort in, why should others put the effort into reading it? And I'm not asking for a perfectly written piece of writing, all I'm saying is that this isn't a f***en text message conversation with your mates.

[staffred]

Season 4 will be the last chance to redeem Jon and Stannis ( yes, I still have some hopes for him ). Let's see, but honestly, D&D hate Stannis and don't care about Jon, so they'll probably have like no screentime and all the focus will be on Lannisters and Dany.

I see a lot of post complaining that Stannis isn't done justice in the TV-show. I don't get that at all. He is exactly as despicable as in the books. I Think he is very well adapted to television.

[Lord Elrosir]

The only thing that I take issue with as far as the adaptation of Stannis is that they make Melisandre look like she makes EVERY decision for him. Otherwise it's been pretty spot on.

[The Idiots Lantern]

The only thing that I take issue with as far as the adaptation of Stannis is that they make Melisandre look like she makes EVERY decision for him.

At least he has the grace to be aware of it, and not like it in the least bit. I get a vibe that Show!Stannis is trapped. His failure in Blackwater Bay haunts him, and Melisandre's claims that she could have rescued his men if only she'd been there are what bind him to her now. He can't take the risk that she's telling the truth.

[Khal Porno]

Euron seizes the throne with a minimum of fuss and either sends Victarion on his quest, or goes himself (in the scenario where they merge those two). Easy.

I absolutely agreed, and I was thinking this on my third read of Feast and Dragons. Ultimately the Kingsmoot is a waste of time because nothing changes. The relationships that exist between all the Greyjoys are exactly the same following the Kingsmoot as they are immediately before. It would be a waste of screentime.

[Ser Tahu]

Euron seizes the throne with a minimum of fuss and either sends Victarion on his quest, or goes himself (in the scenario where they merge those two). Easy.

I absolutely agreed, and I was thinking this on my third read of Feast and Dragons. Ultimately the Kingsmoot is a waste of time because nothing changes. The relationships that exist between all the Greyjoys are exactly the same following the Kingsmoot as they are immediately before. It would be a waste of screentime.

The same could be said of many things that they have shown, and the problem with cutting the Kingsmoot is that doing so would cause us to miss a lot of the interactions between the Greyjoy's that really helped establish their characters. Cutting the Kingsmoot would also cause the Iron Islands to get too far ahead of everything else. So as far as I'm concerned, cutting the Kingsmoot would be a bad idea, and that is even without taking into account the fact that it was one of the very few interesting moments from AFfC.

Also, what people often forget is that between Balon dying and the Kingsmoot Euron crowned himself mostly unopposed. My prediction:

Season 4:

episodes 31-33: Balon dies and Euron crowns himself, with Aeron being in both scenes (establishes Aeron and Euron). Meanwhile, YarAsha is defeated at the Dreadfort and retreats.

episodes 34-35: no Iron Islanders

episodes 36-38: YarAsha returns and we get some interactions between her, Aeron and Euron (develops those characters).

episode 39: Aeron declares that there should be a Kingsmoot

episode 40: no Iron Islanders

Season 5:

episode 41: setup for the Kingsmoot; Victarion is introduced.

episode 42: the Kingsmoot (further develops the Greyjoys, especially Victarion)

episodes 43-49: the rest of the AFfC stuff

episode 50: Euron sends Victarion to retrieve Daenerys.

[The Dragon has three heads]

I see a lot of post complaining that Stannis isn't done justice in the TV-show. I don't get that at all. He is exactly as despicable as in the books. I Think he is very well adapted to television.

RUN I CAN HEAR THE STANBOIS COMING!!! RUN WHILE YOU STILL CAAAN!!

[PatrickStormborn]

I absolutely agreed, and I was thinking this on my third read of Feast and Dragons. Ultimately the Kingsmoot is a waste of time because nothing changes. The relationships that exist between all the Greyjoys are exactly the same following the Kingsmoot as they are immediately before. It would be a waste of screentime.

I disagree, for several reasons:

• The Kingsmoot means Victarion, Aeron and Asha have to accept Euron as King of the Iron Islands.
  
• It also means neither Victarion or Asha can lawfully oppose him; they were defeated.
  
• It means Aeron's only option is to flee, as he openly defied Euron and lost.
  
• It increases the significance of Theon, as only he can be used to contest the Kingsmoot.
  

Plus, the Kingsmoot is an interesting scene that has a lot of character interaction without requiring much build-up. The show needs more of those scenes, not less.

[Caelestis]

I disagree, for several reasons:

• The Kingsmoot means Victarion, Aeron and Asha have to accept Euron as King of the Iron Islands.
  
• It also means neither Victarion or Asha can lawfully oppose him; they were defeated.
  
• It means Aeron's only option is to flee, as he openly defied Euron and lost.
  
• It increases the significance of Theon, as only he can be used to contest the Kingsmoot.
  

Plus, the Kingsmoot is an interesting scene that has a lot of character interaction without requiring much build-up. The show needs more of those scenes, not less.

^This, and one more important reason: the revelation of the Dragonhorn.

Although we've already seen Euron himself at this point, it's only at the Kingsmoot that Euron reveals his plans to take control of Dany's dragons and his brilliant/insane idea to conquer ALL of Westeros. In one moment, Euron is established as a legitimite threat on a scale that many of the villains of this series haven't reached, simply because he's ahead of the curve. Yes, Euron is no greater threat than Balon right now, but I highly doubt GRRM introduced the Dragonhorn and had Victarion sail all the way to Slaver's Bay for that plot not to go anywhere: however it turns out, there will be some major ramifications and I doubt any of it will be good news for the Seven Kingdoms.

Up to this point, the Ironborn have been relatively minor players throughout the conflict; it is Euron that pushes them up another level (illustrating that their plot-line is important to the overall narrative), even if there's no immediate pay-off. I think the audience needs to be aware of this and in this case, showing is far more effective than telling: the readers only started paying attention to Euron when he sounded the Dragonhorn at the Kingsmoot and I think it should be no different in the TV-series. I still feel the outcome of the Kingsmoot would be a very effective potential ending of Season 4 (minus Lady Stoneheart, of course).

[Khal Porno]

I disagree, for several reasons:

• The Kingsmoot means Victarion, Aeron and Asha have to accept Euron as King of the Iron Islands.
  
• It also means neither Victarion or Asha can lawfully oppose him; they were defeated.
  
• It means Aeron's only option is to flee, as he openly defied Euron and lost.
  
• It increases the significance of Theon, as only he can be used to contest the Kingsmoot.
  

Plus, the Kingsmoot is an interesting scene that has a lot of character interaction without requiring much build-up. The show needs more of those scenes, not less.

I look forward to your cries of butchery if they leave it out or compress it in some way.

[PatrickStormborn]

I look forward to your cries of butchery if they leave it out or compress it in some way.

How can they compress the Kingsmoot badly? All they'd need to do for me to be satisfied is to show Aeron declaring that Kingsmoot must take place, and then show Asha, Victarion and finally Euron making their (short) stands for leadership. I'd even be fine with just Asha and Euron, if they cut the other two brothers. I don't see how compressing the Kingsmoot could ruin the Kingsmoot.

If they leave it out, I'll be disappointed (for reasons I've already explained in other threads - mainly because of the relevance of keeping Theon and Asha around without the Kingsmoot). If what we get is worse than the Kingsmoot, I'll be livid.

But regardless, I'm sure there will be many other opportunities for me to cry "butchery" next season and beyond. I hope there isn't, but I'd be deluding myself if I trusted D&D to create a good, coherent, intelligent season of television.

[Seneti]

I see a lot of post complaining that Stannis isn't done justice in the TV-show. I don't get that at all. He is exactly as despicable as in the books. I Think he is very well adapted to television.

Agreed. I remember hating Stannis in the books until he headed to the Wall and even then my opinion of him only improved because he was the first to recognize the real threat. It's not until Stannis gets to the Wall that he becomes a truly likeable, awesome character.

[DarkAndFullOfTurnips]

Again, you need the Kingsmoot because just randomly showing random characters doing important things is silly. You need some background. It doesn't need to be long. I'm sure it won't be that popular among viewers but it's a necessary evil unless they change everything to omit the Greyjoys entirely...Which honestly may not even be that bad but certainly way too much work just to skip a couple of potentially entertaining scenes.

[Red Tiger]

I don't think TV Jon is as popular as book Jon. Dany is a star and he's more of an afterthought.

^This one. I just can't picture this version of Jon as an influential leader or an inspiring hero.

[Lord Joker Of FunLand]

The books are way better, but how many people can say their favorite books series got turned into a great show? I consider myself very lucky, even if it's not exactly what i imagined in my head.

Still an amazing show, when you separate it from the books.

[Lord Joker Of FunLand]

^This one. I just can't picture this version of Jon as an influential leader or an inspiring hero.

I couldn't picture that in the first 2 books either. He only became a good leader once he got back to the wall. IMO of course.

[Andrés Garcia]

The seasons that are based on AFFC and ADWD might turn out better than the books themselves--or so I hope.