Long Price Quartet vs. The Black Company vs. Prince of Nothing

[Spring Bass]

Exactly. In fact, that's what fascinated me about A Shadow in Summer the first time I read it - many of the common "tropes" of Fantasy novels (such as the big battles, combat, etc) were not or almost not present. Moreover, the bulk of the story happens after the antagonist's plan fails.

[Calibandar]

In order of my preference:

1. Prince of Nothing

2. Long Price quartet

3. Black Company

The Glen Cook series I didn't care for, tried it severeal times.

[Francis Buck]

Haven't read the Long Price Quartet, but I really enjoyed (and continue to enjoy) the Prince of Nothing/Second Apocalypse series. This is primarily due to the world-building, which I think is some of the most original in fantasy right now. I'm not the biggest fan of the prose, and honestly I don't even think the actual storytelling or characterization is all that great most of the time (though it's still certainly better than your average run-of-the-mill drivel), but there's just so many awesome concepts and ideas that it keeps me interested anyway. I've tried Black Company twice and couldn't get into it, though I wouldn't call it bad by any means. Just not my cup of tea.

[Horselover Fat]

Cali and Francis, what was it that made you dislike them? I found them pretty readable (the first three anyway). I have not read the PoN stuff yet. I like Abraham in general but I couldn't get into A Shadow in Summer and I haven't tried again yet.

[AUyushu]

Even if it's the weakest, the difference is not all that great, you should not expect some dramatic changes in storytelling in the next three.

Yeah, the first book was the weakest by a bit to me, but it's not like there was a gigantic difference in the books, the writing style and characters were similar throughout. The story is just a bit more interesting in the other three.

[wolverine]

Haven't read the Long Price Quartet, but I really enjoyed (and continue to enjoy) the Prince of Nothing/Second Apocalypse series. This is primarily due to the world-building, which I think is some of the most original in fantasy right now. I'm not the biggest fan of the prose, and honestly I don't even think the actual storytelling or characterization is all that great most of the time (though it's still certainly better than your average run-of-the-mill drivel), but there's just so many awesome concepts and ideas that it keeps me interested anyway. I've tried Black Company twice and couldn't get into it, though I wouldn't call it bad by any means. Just not my cup of tea.

Hmm...I actually really like the prose in the series. I think it adds to the story's mood and setting. It flows really well IMO.

[AUyushu]

Hmm...I actually really like the prose in the series. I think it adds to the story's mood and setting. It flows really well IMO.

Yeah, I think Bakker's prose is one of the best parts of the books really. His world building is really nothing special, he's simply taken Islamic Crusades era culture, added in Tolkien, and twisted it. His prose, deep history, and the rich characters (for the main characters anyway, he has a ton of bland characters that run together) are the strengths of his books to me.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

That's the best thing about Bakker. He's so divisive, even his dans disagree about what they like. You'll never run out of things to argue about.

That said, deep history is a part of world building

[Happy Ent]

That's the best thing about Bakker. He's so divisive, even his dans disagree about what they like.

No we don’t!

[wolverine]

Yeah, I think Bakker's prose is one of the best parts of the books really. His world building is really nothing special, he's simply taken Islamic Crusades era culture, added in Tolkien, and twisted it. His prose, deep history, and the rich characters (for the main characters anyway, he has a ton of bland characters that run together) are the strengths of his books to me.

And his sweet character naming ability!

[Spring Bass]

No, no, no, don't turn this into another Bakker thread!

. . . Anyways, I don't think it would be impossible to tell the characters in the Long Price Quartet apart, although it would be harder than with GRRM. Fortunately, that's something that Bakker improves upon in the Dagger and Coin Series - Cithrin, Geder, and Dawson all have very distinct character voices, and I think I would recognize quotes as being from them.

[Horza]

The idea that 'Daniel Abraham' is a mere subset of the manifold identities of R. Scott Bakker iis an intriguing one but sadly I am loath to trust your word alone, Bass.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

I think the fact that most of the characters in Long Price don't have signature quotes is one of the selling points. While I have nothing against singular, memorable characters, that's not what Abraham (nee Bakker) is going for in Long Price. Instead they feel like multifaceted, normal people whose characters and personalities change over the course of many decades who are put into sitiuations that they can't quite handle. Except for maybe Baltasar Gice.

[Talleyrand]

I'd suggest Black Company myself, I loved them. Its concise manner is nice compared to the purple prose in so many of today's works

[Former Lord of Winterfell]

Black Company is essentially a fantasy take on the Vietnam tale (this was a whole class of books that came out in the 70s and 80s). First person POV and the POV is pretty fun. Shamelessly bogarted by Erikson to make Malazan. Lots of swashbuckle and absurdity. I've read at least 6 of these books so far.

In fairness to Erikson, he added a whole lot of other stuff in there as well. It's a much more dense, epic work than is the Black Company series.

But in fairness to Cook, I think Erikson's attempt to copy the gritty feel of the Black Company books was unconvincing. The Black Company reads like it was written by a guy who really knows how troops act. Malazan reads (at least to me) like someone who has done a lot of reading about it, and is trying to fake it.

As for the three listed series, I haven't read Long Price, but greatly prefer Black Company to Bakker's work. One virtue of the Black Company series is that it doesn't require the investment that PoN does. Tthe first book is not a difficult read, and will give you a really good sense on whether or not you will like the rest of the series. I think you really have to read a lot of Bakker's stuff to figure that out. I had to slog through 3+ pretty dense books before finally figuring out it wasn't for me.

Although I did figure out that Bakker is the kind of guy who'd annoy the fuck out of me in person.

[Shryke]

My problem w/ the characterization in this series is that I think they are too wooden and indistinguishable far beyond just not having signature quotes. Martin's characters don't just have signature quotes; they have signature personalities.

I don't think they are indistinguishable at all. What they are is not-overtly-dramatic.

Martin's characters are dramatic. Those motherfuckers are chewing the scenery.

Abraham's characters feel more natural. They have different ways of feeling and thinking, but they aren't throwing them in your face going "See, here's my character traits".

[wolverine]

That may be true. If I ever get around to a reread, maybe I'll be able to pick up on it better. It's probably true that Abraham's characters feel a bit more realistic or "natural" as you say.

*forms a pose indicating an inclination to further consider the topic*

You naughty little monkey.

In fairness to Erikson, he added a whole lot of other stuff in there as well. It's a much more dense, epic work than is the Black Company series.

But in fairness to Cook, I think Erikson's attempt to copy the gritty feel of the Black Company books was unconvincing. The Black Company reads like it was written by a guy who really knows how troops act. Malazan reads (at least to me) like someone who has done a lot of reading about it, and is trying to fake it.

As for the three listed series, I haven't read Long Price, but greatly prefer Black Company to Bakker's work. One virtue of the Black Company series is that it doesn't require the investment that PoN does. Tthe first book is not a difficult read, and will give you a really good sense on whether or not you will like the rest of the series. I think you really have to read a lot of Bakker's stuff to figure that out. I had to slog through 3+ pretty dense books before finally figuring out it wasn't for me.

Although I did figure out that Bakker is the kind of guy who'd annoy the fuck out of me in person.

Why? I don't understand why it would take over 3 books to figure that out.

[Rhom]

Interesting. I hopped on Barnes and Noble to order the books and found that two of them are not available in the trade paperback. One of those two was available used... and the other (book 2 I think) was only available as an eBook or a Hardcover.

Hmph. I'll do some more searching later.

[Horselover Fat]

Alright fine, I just got the omnibus of the first two Long Price novels and I'll give it another go shortly.

[RedEyedGhost]

Interesting. I hopped on Barnes and Noble to order the books and found that two of them are not available in the trade paperback. One of those two was available used... and the other (book 2 I think) was only available as an eBook or a Hardcover.

Hmph. I'll do some more searching later.

The omnibus with the third and fourth books will be available November 27th... (that's a good day for books - Gilman's The Rise of Ransom City and Butcher's Cold Days will also be out that day).