WoIaF: the tip of the iceberg

[heirofValyria]

Before the World of Ice and Fire came out I recall someone saying that Martin had originally written a lot more about the history of Planetos. But cut it out during editing in order to fit the book's size. The person said that 2/3rds of the content that GRRM wrote was not put in the book. I for the life of me can't find any reference to this and I don't know what to make of it. Do you guys know about this?

Personally I'd like to read all of that information. Especially if it went into more detail about places like Asshai, Mountains of the morn, city of winged men, Carcosa, etc. 2/3rds would be a lot of info.

[Jak Scaletongue]

I thought that was in reference to a lot of Targaryen history - the Fire and Blood book GRRM has mentioned he might release after the series is done, cause it gives a too much away apparently.  But I may just be thinking of something someone said on a thread...

[heirofValyria]

Ahh... didn't think of that. However, it wasn't specific about it being just about the Targs. I was thinking that those hundreds of pages could be about things that GRRM deems that reads shouldn't see (ie secrets about some mysteries and other delicious info). Those pages could be sitting in some internet file just waiting for someone to reveal it... 

[Blackfyre Bastard]

Before the World of Ice and Fire came out I recall someone saying that Martin had originally written a lot more about the history of Planetos. But cut it out during editing in order to fit the book's size. The person said that 2/3rds of the content that GRRM wrote was not put in the book. I for the life of me can't find any reference to this and I don't know what to make of it. Do you guys know about this?

Personally I'd like to read all of that information. Especially if it went into more detail about places like Asshai, Mountains of the morn, city of winged men, Carcosa, etc. 2/3rds would be a lot of info.

Check this video. Very interesting and contains something pertaining to your question. I know is kinda long video but is worth it.

[Cayrouse]

Ahh that's a crying shame, what a waste of a rare opportunity to have martin  actually publish a book if it's only gonna focus on the targs. If there are indeed 2/3 of Twoiaf that was left out and was eventually going to be published I hope it would be  about sothoryos or eastern essos. I don't think I'd read a book that focuses on house Targaryen if I got it for free.

[Ice Queen]

Ahh that's a crying shame, what a waste of a rare opportunity to have martin  actually publish a book if it's only gonna focus on the targs. If there are indeed 2/3 of Twoiaf that was left out and was eventually going to be published I hope it would be  about sothoryos or eastern essos. I don't think I'd read a book that focuses on house Targaryen if I got it for free.

There's also The She Wolves of Winterfell, which was supposed to be published but got pushed back until after the series is finished. It probably gave away too much as well. 

[Whitering]

I really want more knowledge about Yi Ti and the rest of the place, we've focused on Westeros though, so I am likely SOL, and also Asshai and the Shadow, I mean, come on.

[Mrs.Grumpy]

I need more info about Carcosa, Great Moraq and Ulthos.

[Lord Varys]

Ahh that's a crying shame, what a waste of a rare opportunity to have martin  actually publish a book if it's only gonna focus on the targs. If there are indeed 2/3 of Twoiaf that was left out and was eventually going to be published I hope it would be  about sothoryos or eastern essos. I don't think I'd read a book that focuses on house Targaryen if I got it for free.

'Fire and Blood' is supposed to be a history of the Targaryen reign. It will, of course, heavily focus on the Targaryen kings and the royal family, but it will also tell the history of the last 300 hundred years of Westeros in great detail. This will inevitably include a history of the important political figures at court and in the Realm as well, giving us lots and lots of information on other noble houses as well as important people in the Free Cities like the Rogares.

In that sense, I'd not dismiss 'Fire and Blood' so easily even if you don't like the Targaryens all that much.

[LmL]

I really want more knowledge about Yi Ti and the rest of the place, we've focused on Westeros though, so I am likely SOL, and also Asshai and the Shadow, I mean, come on.

Whitering, have you ever read any of my stuff? If you are interested in Asshai and the Shadow, you might find it interesting. We've had a lot of great debates - have I seen you in any of the threads? I think I might have, but I cannot recall. 

Cheers. 

 

[Whitering]

Whitering, have you ever read any of my stuff? If you are interested in Asshai and the Shadow, you might find it interesting. We've had a lot of great debates - have I seen you in any of the threads? I think I might have, but I cannot recall. 

Cheers. 

 

I have, and thank you for putting so much work into your...well, work. I haven't added anything to the discussion because I am not creative and had nothing to say. However, conjecture, no matter how well reasoned, does not sit as well with me as the written material of the books.

[LmL]

I have, and thank you for putting so much work into your...well, work. I haven't added anything to the discussion because I am not creative and had nothing to say. However, conjecture, no matter how well reasoned, does not sit as well with me as the written material of the books.

Oh, for sure. No doubt. My guess is that the best look at Asshai will come via vision or dream, so as not to remove too much of the mystery of it. My guess is that Marwyn is going to show Dany how to use the glass candle, and that's how she will get a hold of the dark truths Quaithe says are waiting for her in Asshai. I'm definitely hopeful we'll learn a bit more.  

[Saving Stannis]

What I'm hearing about Fire & Blood sounds a little bit redundant given how much detail TWOIAF went into on each king relative to the lack of detail on certain house histories or cities in Essos. how about Qarth...a city central to the main novel narrative...which doesn't even have its own chapter?

[Jak Scaletongue]

What I'm hearing about Fire & Blood sounds a little bit redundant given how much detail TWOIAF went into on each king relative to the lack of detail on certain house histories or cities in Essos. how about Qarth...a city central to the main novel narrative...which doesn't even have its own chapter?

I got the impression Fire & Blood would go a fair bit into the history of the Targaryens - not just the Westerosi Conquest to Present day, but the *whole* history of House Targaryen, which would include their history in Valyria and (hopefully more detailed) flight from the Doom.  But that just might be me hoping to learn how the Valyrians tamed the dragons in the first place...

So all the stuff we've got in TWOIAF would be (hypothetically) the last chapter or two of Fire & Blood - hopefully some details about things that were glossed over in TWOIAF, but still likely only a chapter or two about the Targs ruling in Westeros. And hopefully the rest will be a lot more focused on the Targs in Valyria and wider Essos!

 

Random thought: Doesn't Marwyn(?) say that *Valyrian* magic is rooted in "fire and blood"?  So maybe the Fire & Blood book will take a look at Valyria as a whole, with a focus on where/how the Targs came out of that culture/society.  Maybe.  That would be pretty neat, too!  And anything focusing on Valyria will have to include, at the very least, some info on Western Essos (if not Qarth, Sarnor, etc.).

[Saving Stannis]

I got the impression Fire & Blood would go a fair bit into the history of the Targaryens - not just the Westerosi Conquest to Present day, but the *whole* history of House Targaryen, which would include their history in Valyria and (hopefully more detailed) flight from the Doom

...And hopefully the rest will be a lot more focused on the Targs in Valyria and wider Essos!

...So maybe the Fire & Blood book will take a look at Valyria as a whole, with a focus on where/how the Targs came out of that culture/society. 

That'd be nice. I always thought it was interesting reflecting on the fact that the Targaryens are described as being far from the most powerful Valyrian house in the Freehold. I'd love to find out that remnants of more powerful Valyrian families still exist.

[Jak Scaletongue]

I always thought it would be neat to see the Targs at the bottom of the totem pole, so to speak! 

I know the other Valyrian families didn't believe the Targ's prophetic dreams, but you'd think that in the day or two or three leading up to the big bang a few of them would realize "Hey, maybe now is a good time for weekend away!" - they did have dragons, still, so I do find it a *bit* hard to believe the Targs were the only ones willing to save their skin.  I know humans have a habit of digging in and toughing it out...and arrogance, but still!  There weren't a few people who figured they better get outta town?  Really?  Like, I understand not wanting to sell everything off and completely abandon everything you hold dear, but no one else thought it might be a good time for an extended visit to Lys? Some of them were bound to have thought "Better safe than sorry - let's take a trip!"

[Jon Fossoway]

When reading about Daenys I think about the Noah thing in the bible. If I recall correctly, after recieving the vision, Noah began constructing his boat and everyone made fun of him. Being the Targaryen a minor family in the VF, they probably suffered something similar. We know two families followed them to Westeros: Celtigars (I remember Stannis refering them to servile, so probably they were a very minor family in Valyria, or probably a merchant family, like the Spicers in WS); the Velaryons, phonetically, strikes me as a common name in the Freehold. So you have this minor and somewhat superstitious or absurd family moving out of the Freehold, followed by these two families of adventurers.

Anyhow, I've always like the idea of reading a novella about the times of Daenys, and the Targaryen being mocked or looked down upon.

[direpupy]

I always thought it would be neat to see the Targs at the bottom of the totem pole, so to speak! 

I know the other Valyrian families didn't believe the Targ's prophetic dreams, but you'd think that in the day or two or three leading up to the big bang a few of them would realize "Hey, maybe now is a good time for weekend away!" - they did have dragons, still, so I do find it a *bit* hard to believe the Targs were the only ones willing to save their skin.  I know humans have a habit of digging in and toughing it out...and arrogance, but still!  There weren't a few people who figured they better get outta town?  Really?  Like, I understand not wanting to sell everything off and completely abandon everything you hold dear, but no one else thought it might be a good time for an extended visit to Lys? Some of them were bound to have thought "Better safe than sorry - let's take a trip!"

Wel actually twoiaf confirms at least one other dragonlord surviving the doom, the idiot got himself killed trying to reclaim his old home but he did survive the initial destruction.

Aurion was one of the few dragonlords who survived the Doom of Valyria. According to histories of Qohor, he raised forces from Qohorik colonists and declared himself first Emperor of Valyria. Atop his dragon, he flew south to lay claim to what remained of Valyria and reestablish the Freehold along with his thirty thousand men. Neither Emperor Aurion nor his host were ever seen again.

 

[Jak Scaletongue]

Cool!  Apparently I forgot that part! 

[Aemond's Eye]

On 28/12/2015 at 6:37 AM, Cayrouse said:

Ahh that's a crying shame, what a waste of a rare opportunity to have martin  actually publish a book if it's only gonna focus on the targs. If there are indeed 2/3 of Twoiaf that was left out and was eventually going to be published I hope it would be  about sothoryos or eastern essos. I don't think I'd read a book that focuses on house Targaryen if I got it for free.

Lots of people will though, especially given the number of talking points raised in TWOIAF that are never expanded upon during the Targaryen rule.