[Book Spoilers] Arya and Sandor

[Le Cygne]

They were riding through fire and Stark corpses, both facing what they feared the most.

Oh, I like what you said.

You just made my heart break in one million pieces. Monster! :bawl: :bawl: :bawl:

I know, that's just cruel. :bawl:

Making more demands, if they don't show Arya talking to Needle when she hides it under the rock in Braavos, I will be so disappointed.

[silentwanderer]

And I love it. Their chemistry is amazing. They're funny and there is a begrudging respect growing between them.

You know these are kindred spirits when, instead to use the knife to stick it in his eye and to the back of his skull, Arya initiates a fight they both needed to clear their heads.

[lostinwesteros]

Sorta fresh from just reading the four books (haven't read Dance yet) but I feel so f'ing late with these theories. God, I just feel so behind right now... :blush:

Not to worry -- you'll be posting away in no time, and you'll find that there is SO much info on this website and on the threads (there're hundreds and hundreds if them) that very, very few - if any - members are on top of most everything. You also have a distinct advantage for having read the first 4 books so recently. I thought I remembered everything, but in the last year and a half since I finished, I've forgotten SO much. And, you've got the Wiki to use as a reference or to bring you up to date on Forum-related things.

[lostinwesteros]

Back on topic, I think they've gone too far creating a wonderful duo for us to really reverse that now. Not that I think it'll be all sweetness and roses for them from here on - I think each will still give as good as they get at times, but a true comradery has been born this episode that I don't think will/can be completely erased.

[Karmarni]

Find it fascinating that the show has cut almost all of the conversations between Sansa and the Hound and has added additional scenes to Arya and the Hound. It's like Sansa doesn't really know him and will never "wish the Hound was here," but Arya's beginning to know him better than she did in the books.

I've wondered if the show will transpose some of what the Hound tells Sansa about himself to scenes with Arya.

I think maybe the crow had something to do with the way things turned out, too (that's really asking a lot of the show, to get into that :)):

Yes, always have thought the crow had meaning.

[Guest]

I absolutely loved Arya & Sandor. Sandor has long (in book and show both) been a favorite character of mine, but in the books I really don't care about Arya. However the actresses' performance has made me love Arya heart and soul. I really needed to see some Frey deaths and she delivered.

And when the Hound was just like "Well tell me next time" then sat down and ate the food still cooking on that fire, I laughed out loud.

I really hope they don't part as badly as in the books.

[Le Cygne]

Find it fascinating that the show has cut almost all of the conversations between Sansa and the Hound and has added additional scenes to Arya and the Hound. It's like Sansa doesn't really know him and will never "wish the Hound was here," but Arya's beginning to know him better than she did in the books.

Not defending the show here, but at least she had a couple of conversations with the Hound, and he took her seriously. The others just seemed amused while she played a ship game, told a poop joke, and adult conversation flew over her head.

[jugdesh258]

I dunno, I think something similar will still happen. Arya's reluctance to kill Sandor isn't because she still felt hate for him, but because she grew to like him. Otherwise, she would have killed him. She just made up excuses to not do so when she left him to die.

Yes... I am not going to re-read but I think Ayra leaves his name off her list maybe unconsciously before he is presumed to die. She says she is not going to kill him because that is what he wants but she might be torn.

When GRRM's characters interact a bit of each rub's off each other:

• Arya gets some of that Killing is fun vibe
  
• Sansa is taught the reality of what a real night is....while the Hound becomes more like one
  

[WhineHaus]

Depending on whether or not GRRM decides to re-introduce Sandor in later books, they could plausibly kill him in the show. I could see it going either way: Arya give him the gift of mercy, or she leaves him for dead.

If Arya does indeed kill him, I wouldn't want it to be out of hatred. Their final scene could be a really heart wrenching one. The Hound, who is dying from his wounds, convinces Arya to give him the gift of mercy. She is reluctant, but eventually does so out of love. It would actually suit her character arc that she get attached to the Hound, but he too ends up getting taken away from her. It's a trend we've seen throughout the show and book series.

If Arya doesn't kill Sandor, I'll be pretty excited. That'd ignite my hopes for the return of the Hound, or a Sandor/Arya reunion. Then again, she's not so good at reuniting with people...

[Greywolf2375]

Depending on whether or not GRRM decides to re-introduce Sandor in later books, they could plausibly kill him in the show. I could see it going either way: Arya give him the gift of mercy, or she leaves him for dead.

If Arya does indeed kill him, I wouldn't want it to be out of hatred. Their final scene could be a really heart wrenching one. The Hound, who is dying from his wounds, convinces Arya to give him the gift of mercy. She is reluctant, but eventually does so out of love. It would actually suit her character arc that she get attached to the Hound, but he too ends up getting taken away from her. It's a trend we've seen throughout the show and book series.

If Arya doesn't kill Sandor, I'll be pretty excited. That'd ignite my hopes for the return of the Hound, or a Sandor/Arya reunion. Then again, she's not so good at reuniting with people...

Sandor has all ready returned. Now we just need to see what will happen with Brienne's travels to see if she goes where he is.

[Dove]

If Arya does indeed kill him, I wouldn't want it to be out of hatred. Their final scene could be a really heart wrenching one. The Hound, who is dying from his wounds, convinces Arya to give him the gift of mercy. She is reluctant, but eventually does so out of love. It would actually suit her character arc that she get attached to the Hound, but he too ends up getting taken away from her. It's a trend we've seen throughout the show and book series.

omg if they do the "Hound giving random Stark soldier the gift of mercy" scene from the books next season and then later paralell that and Arya's forced to do the same for him it would be so heartwrenching but fantastic

I actually really really love the idea of that. If the Hound doesn't have an important part to play I'm actually kind of pulling for that to happen now.

[Mendoza]

The biggest cheat would leaving it ambiguous whether Arya did it or not

[silentwanderer]

If Arya does indeed kill him, I wouldn't want it to be out of hatred. Their final scene could be a really heart wrenching one. The Hound, who is dying from his wounds, convinces Arya to give him the gift of mercy. She is reluctant, but eventually does so out of love. It would actually suit her character arc that she get attached to the Hound, but he too ends up getting taken away from her. It's a trend we've seen throughout the show and book series.

I've always thought the character didn't kill him out of love. Both characters were equally damaged to understand the gesture and not to make a big deal out of it, at that point.

On the show, The Hound already seems less damaged and Arya already let him live, when she could've used the knife she killed the Frey with to kill Sandor.

[go joff go]

I can already tell that the Hound/Arya dynamic is going to be one of the highlights of the series. He almost felt like a father to her and seems to understand her better then Ned ever did. I have feeling that storyline is going to end up with a lot of people in tears when they break apart.

Also, I don't remember what happens in the book, but when the Hound asks for Mercy, I want Arya to say with tears in her eyes "Not Today"

[Guest]

omg if they do the "Hound giving random Stark soldier the gift of mercy" scene from the books next season and then later paralell that and Arya's forced to do the same for him it would be so heartwrenching but fantastic

I actually really really love the idea of that. If the Hound doesn't have an important part to play I'm actually kind of pulling for that to happen now.

No! Don't kill the Hound. He's my favorite. :(

[silentwanderer]

I can already tell that the Hound/Arya dynamic is going to be one of the highlights of the series. He almost felt like a father to her and seems to understand her better then Ned ever did. I have feeling that storyline is going to end up with a lot of people in tears when they break apart.

I agree, not only The Hound was the only man who helped Ned when the mob attacked him at his execution but, as of this season,. Arya is the only Stark girl who knows his personal story, as far as Sandor is concerned.

For all he knows, Arya is the only one who knows what his brother did to him. The Hound doesn't know Sansa heard the story too.

[The Killer Snark]

Sandor is still alive in the books. He's the gravedigger at Quiet Isle, but it's dubious whether he's going to be reintroduced. Anyway, they have to keep the parting the same as in the books in case GRRM does bring him back, because his status is unconfirmed.

A point about Arya's refusal to offer Sandor a mercy killing. The younger Arya would have jumped at the chance to make sure he was dead; the new one, ironically, knowing his survival is unlikely, leaves him for dead because she deems it crueller, precisely because she's lost her hatred for the character, and she resents it. When looking back at Micah, she can hardly remember him in a way that generates much emotional response, and the Hound has been keeping her safe, and she's experienced so much in any case since and seen so much pain that his death seems relatively trivial. But the grudge against Sandor for it was one of the last things that still tied her to being the previous Arya of Winterfell, so she hates Sandor for making her no longer hate him, and her desertion of him was an act of spiteful childishness. It's as if she was trying too hard to recall the lost Arya by leaving the Hound to an unnecessarily worse death. She comes to realise this on the boat and regrets not giving him the gift of mercy, and it's a set-up for other childish decisions (such as the killing of Dareon) that occur when she reaches Braavos. It's integral to the development of the character that her leaving the Hound is shown as an incongruous mistake on her part in the series, because that it what it's meant to come across as in the books.

[silentwanderer]

Sandor is still alive in the books. He's the gravedigger at Quiet Isle, but it's dubious whether he's going to be reintroduced. Anyway, they have to keep the parting the same as in the books in case GRRM does bring him back, because his status is unconfirmed.

Not to mention. if Sandor is still alive, that makes him one of the few people along Gendry, Theon Greyjoy, the Brotherhood and Rickon Stark who can tell Ramsay Snow didn't marry the actual Arya Stark.

The books are going to need him, if only to destroy Bolton's claim over Winterfell.

[The Killer Snark]

I hadn't thought of it from that angle yet. I think you're most likely right.

[Mendoza]

For some reason I always thought Ramsey Bolton was just going to be put down, but him finding out he had nothing but a fake seems like a good idea as well. You got played, buddy.