Prof. Cecily

I had a KvD liner. Did NOT work for me. The only liners that do work for me are NARS, so it that wasn't a surprise. I loved the texture and colour of the KvD liner.

Of course Aerys named Jaime to the KG as an insult to his old friend, trusted Hand, companion at arms, etc. Just as refusing the betrothal between Rhaegar and Cersei was an insult. Remember what Aerys said to Lord Tywin on that ocasion? The World of Ice and Fire - The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II Gods be good, that must have been a blow to the Lion of Lannister' pride. I have the impression Aerys never paid proper attention to the lyrics of The Rains of Castamere I don't get much of a feel for what happened at the Battle of the Trident- whatever the outcome, would ser Jaime have done his bloody deed if Aerys gave the order to burn all?

You won't find me denying Aerys' paranoia. However, remember who he had at his side- ser Jaime Lannister, the newest and youngest member of the KG. The causes of the first Dance of Dragons? You can read more about that starting on page 73 of TWOIAF Or here at our fabulous wiki http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Dance_of_the_Dragons Great reading for a lazy hot Sunday. Also, one of the gorgeous videos from the HO production

Oh, yes, indeed. Also, Cat has some features of Lady Jessica.

So there are hints of possible problems with the IB from Aerys' time. Interesting. From what I can see, the estrangement between Aerys and Tywin begins from the time Joanna Lannster was a lady-in-waiting to Queen Rhaella. And those tasteless comments on Lady Joanna's breasts happen in 272. Hardly an effort to lure the lady to his bed, don't you agree? This is all long before the Defiance of Duskendell, in AC 277. It's clear, of course, that the DoD unhinged the poor man's mind. as to rhaegar fighting for his fahter, i think it was more he was fighting for his house. robet was his cousin, and i bet he was well aware of how robert reacted to him and his, that stereotypical baratheon rage. Well, yes, of course he was fighting for his House. And his House is headed by his father. Also obviously. Given Aerys' penchant for abusing women AKA ' taking mistresses' it must have been alarming, to say the least, to see the son following in his father's footsteps. Robert and the other lords had had enough of enough. Also, their lives are at stake! Hmmm. Interesting. I didn't know that not all the lords of the Vale followed Lord Jon into rebellion. So much to learn! i dont think rhaegar would have been able to treat with the rebels as long as robert lead them. Of course not. Rhaegar has nothing to offer the rebels. The have rebelled against the throne, not him. Rhaegar commands the armies, not the realm. i also think that aerys would have tried to fire the city, regardless of who returned from the trident, so it seems reasonable to me that jaime would have still killed him. Do you have anything from the text on which you've based that thought? I don't say you're wrong! wherr i see another divergence would be if tywin had proceeded to strike at the city or not. im up in the air about that. on the one hand, he could have decide to sit peacfully at the rock, then returned to the red keep to declare that rheagar owed him for not siding with the rebels, or he might have still struck as part of a gambit to place his own family on the throne. with the kind of personality and thought processes we have seen in tywin so far, either seems feasible. LF isn't the only one to take advantage of chaos! Cheers!

Aerys= House Targaryen. Anything else is treason on the part of the Prince of Dragonstone. I'm sorry, I didn't understand the rest of your post. It's a very very hot afternoon here and my brain are probably simmering in my skull. And I've run out of ice-cubes for my iced nettle tea.

Since we're basically speculating, it's as well to remember that Rhaegar fought for his father. After the crushing of the rebellion, Aerys would still be king. We can speculate about whether Rhaegar would be able to depose him peacefully, or would depend on his friends in the Kingsguard to arrange a tragic accident or find some other solution. If Rhaegar had won that duel and the battle, House Baratheon would have been ruled by Stannis. Ned. Would he have survived the Battle of the Trident? Lots of 'What ifs?' here! The idea is yours. What do you base it on? I'm sure something you've read triggered this speculation and I'm very curious to know just what that was.

I agree with you about the ravens, yet what evidence is there Rhaegar was trying to form a coalition against his father? Other than that Varys told Aerys this was so?

Is there a text that supports the idea Rhaegar lived in the Red Keep? I could be wrong, but I thought that as Prince of Dragonstone, he and his Dornish princess held court at Dragonstone. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Rhaegar_Targaryen While factions in KL are mentioned, it's never said Rhaegar was present. Just his, in retrospect, stupid 'supporters'. I wonder who encouraged them to provoke an obsessively ruler's mistrust towards Rhaegar.

It's true Daenerys wouldn't have wed Khal Drogo. Yet she would have wedded someone (Viserys?) So Illyrio could have given the eggs to her as a wedding prezzie. Or to Rhaegar. So many possiblilities! Robb, certainly. Well, as certainly as any pregnancy can be. Catelyn is pregnant at the time of the Battle of the Trident, IIRC. Still, a victorious Aerys doesn't bear thinking of.

There would have been a different story. A very different story. And the dragons? Would we have the dragons?

No worries.The forum is a friendly place and the convos are the best welcome anyone could ask for.

Yes!

The Tywin/ Padishah Emperor is based solely on their language and speech patterns. And, yes, their descriptions. Of course. Kingmaker. Tyrion as a nod to Clarence? Could Sansa end up being an Irulan? I must say I like the Leto/Ghanima 'marriage' very much. Ghanima's projected marriage to prince Farad'n, for example, would be a neat little parallel treatment. And the Baron Harkonnen? Ser Barristan Selmy, Thufir Hawat? Incest. We had a rather odd news item recently (a case of accidental incest) and as a result I've read a bit on the subject. Granted, neither The Independant nor the Guardian are my sources of choice, ranking with that peculiar Thomas More document, but anyway http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/genetic-sexual-attraction-husband-and-wife-discover-they-are-brother-and-sister-9653274.html And then, of course, Craster. To tell the truth, I find teacher/student sexual goings on, or therapist/client, more distasteful than incest. Anyway, back to Planetos. The only Heinlein I've read was the story about 'grokking'. Yes. Stranger in a Strange Land. Which of his books do you find are reflected in ASOIAF?

Nice one with the Mapes MMD imagery. Much better than Meera. How about Lord Tywin as the Padishah Emperor? The conversation of these two characters is strangely similar, at least to my eye. And Arya. St Alia of the Knife? The parallel of the hidden lineage of the teen messiah figures? With its attendant negative aspects?