Tsavong Lah Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 What part of the politics got you? Was it the (spoilers for the whole season): The fact that the scandal didn't sink everyone or the quick moves against Tusk? Everyone just...does things as if they won't have consequences when they go up against Tusk. They'll just seize plants, they'll just pardon a money-laundering billionaire right after a confession -and a recession-etc. It is a bit convenient. As for the show jumping the shark,I heard this with Russo too and I don't get it. It certainly broke the narrative that people expected but I don't see how exactly that's a failing. In fact, I'm a bit impressed by how they deal with the aftermath of the event. For context, I work in politics (mainly on the campaign side) and many friends of mine work on the legislative side both at the state level and federal level. I think it is both the way it progressed and the acting without thinking through consequences and counter moves. They seemed so unprepared for reprisals. You don't go to war over something without gaming out how your opponent will strike back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigima Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Finished S2. Good ride. Some complaints: The stuff with Doug is dumb and screams of forcing the creation of baggage to drag down Frank in the next season. I can't keep track of *all* the machinations -- what will the consequences be of revoking Feng's asylum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castel Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Finished S2. Good ride. Some complaints: The stuff with Doug is dumb and screams of forcing the creation of baggage to drag down Frank in the next season. I can't keep track of *all* the machinations -- what will the consequences be of revoking Feng's asylum? The same thing that happens when any government body's word can no longer be taken for granted: less cooperation. Would Feng have come clean if he had thought there was the slightest chance of the President overwriting a signed pardon from the State department? Also, sucks to be the Secretary being overruled of course. I'm more worried about Tusk's pardon tbh. It smacks of behind the scenes dealing and I don't see how anyone could sell it to the people or Walker. Don't know how much of a good idea it is to just screw the guy over either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horza Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Ah, this show. Hey, if you're going to use the name and tack Michael Dobbs on to your screenplay maybe don't yourselves so goddamn seriously? This concept at heart is, yanno, a satire. Oh, that's a great idea Frank. I, President Robot will override my circuits immediately. Entitlement Reform! Rare Earths! China! Sexual Assault in the Armed Services! A Bridge! - hey, I read the NYT headlines too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Soprano Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Watched Chapter 18 last night. No spoilers, just one comment: Typical McPoyle behavior. You can't just go around barking at people, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Watched Chapter 18 last night. No spoilers, just one comment: Typical McPoyle behavior. You can't just go around barking at people, man. "THE MCPOYLES WILL RULE THE WORLD!!" Just finished the season I agree with the people that have commented on Frank's lack of a worthy adversary. Tusk was ok, not great.I really like this show. Mainly because Kevin Spacey is my favorite actor, and its impossible for me to hate him. His characters can be so wonderfully twisted.My main complaint for this season is the President. How can a guy be this naive? It just doesn't click. I know the President can be kept in the dark on a great many things, but I have absolutely no idea how a man like this could have been elected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterfell is Burning Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 "THE MCPOYLES WILL RULE THE WORLD!!" Just finished the season I agree with the people that have commented on Frank's lack of a worthy adversary. Tusk was ok, not great.I really like this show. Mainly because Kevin Spacey is my favorite actor, and its impossible for me to hate him. His characters can be so wonderfully twisted.My main complaint for this season is the President. How can a guy be this naive? It just doesn't click. I know the President can be kept in the dark on a great many things, but I have absolutely no idea how a man like this could have been elected. Yeah, even discounting the fact Walker was elected in large past due to Tusk's influence, the show portrayed him as too naive to be believable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Visenya Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 Knock Knock :D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 It was definitely a letdown after that excellent opening ep. The thing that continues to bug - and it bugged with the first season - is that for the most part Frank Underwood seems to be largely incompetent. From an outward perspective, what he supports tends to actually fail, and what he says he can do basically backfires. Now, we know that's because he's doing it deliberately (most of the time; the education strike he totally fucked up), but why would you trust him to do anything given that he's such a fuck up? Examples from the second season:-There's the China negotiations,which resulted in China almost going to real war and going to a trade war while jeopardizing a strategic resource-There's the civilian oversight bill - killed-There's his proposals of how to handle the casino money - total failure-There's his inability to get the votes - something that Sharp handles easily by simply telling them what to do-Completely mishandles the Freddy situation-Has protesters lined up outside his door I'm sure there's more - and there was from the first season too. But he seems to be so very incompetent at what he's doing I don't see why people keep letting him do things for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthmail Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Except he looks incredibly competent compared to the rest, who can't seem to do anything. And this is more true to life than if he was simply dancing everything he wanted through Congress. Far more realistic. Besides which, as much as this is about politics, its a character study as well. Frank and Claire are simply fascinating on every level. And I think that Lucas Goodwin is a fucking idiot on every level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Finished it last night. It was ok. The President should have saved himself. He didn't know about it in the first place so not sure why he's going down with the ship for something he didn't do and knows that Frank was involved. Dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalbear Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I love watching Frank and Claire. They're awesome. But the amount of effort in making every single human other than them so bad at everything and so naive and trusting diminishes them quite a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castel Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 That last spoiler from Mexal is really the worst example of the problems. Throughout the season the President is also pissed at Frank's incompetence, he is right, the man had become distracted by his private war with Tusk and has basically been forced to react to everything instead of doing a good job either getting votes or helping run the administration. However getting Walker to change his mind without a good reason after having his one definitive moment of clarity and agency was bad. Frank doesn't need the win, Walker -and Frank's enemies- do. I get that we're supposed to consider the President psychologically (if not politically) weak and naive on some level -he jumps from back and forth from one master to another- but that really validated all the complaints about him being a moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigima Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I tend to agree with Kalbear. Underwood is brilliantly evil, but we only know that because we are privy to his real plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castel Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Yes, and that final manipulation I was talking about was well-played. It used all the limited resources at his disposal well. That was the best he could have done and it would be credible to most. There is just simply no reason for it to work on a self-interested person. Frank had nothing to offer in return. It was just a self-destructive move,especially given that Frank was partially responsible for fucking everyone over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Monkey Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 So I'm watching the British version of the series, which consists of three miniseries with four episodes each. The American version of the show is clearly adapted from the first miniseries ("House of Cards") in the main plot elements, but when we reach the second miniseries ("To Play the King"), the plot deviates completely from its American counterpart. A few elements remain, like Frank's relationship with his main assistant deteriorating, but otherwise the American version has gone on a completely separate track. I haven't seen the third miniseries yet ("The Final Cut"), but To Play the King was a huge letdown. Really contrived storymaking. The first miniseries is good, but I find the American far superior. You can really tell how much more attention they put on direction and cinematography on television productions after 2000. It's baffling how cheap-looking most TV shows from before that year look when you see them now (that does for productions from any country, including the US). Golden Age of Television indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horza Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 So this is hatewatching. I was amused at the extent to which the first few episodes were effectively admissions that many of last season's plotlines and characters were a waste of everyone's time (Cleanwater, Zoe and her crusading pals, etc.) but was a little surprised they went as far as to write out Christina. She was one of the dwindling supply of grounded, relateable characters and a link to the Russo case (I guess Rachel is that link but she was welded to the Stamper storyline. Boy, that went places). As to why I didn't care about the Tusk-Underwood 'war': aside from it relying on the manipulation of an impossibly spineless and stupid president, chief of staff etc, there just wasn't any real stakes. One of these two arseholes is going to run America, what does it mean? We don't know, and I don't care. The show has a lazy, cop-out cynicism about politics that prevents this conflict from having any real meaning. Francis Urquhart was a patrician Tory and his policies were Thatcherism on steroids, he's a product of the tortured conscience of late 80s Britain and his rise is a commentary on the period. Beau Wilimon doesn't appear to have anything to say about US politics except that its all lies and did you know politicians are ambitious and conniving? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterfell is Burning Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Well, I don't think the plotlines from season 1 being wrapped up is so much an admission of failure as a consequence of they deciding to extend the show beyond s02 as it was originally intended. Some of these plots, specially Zoe's investigation on the Russo murder, had the potential to bring down Frank. Since they don't want to bring him down yet, they dropped them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthmail Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 Fuck, if you don't like it stop watching it. I don't understand this pathological need to watch shit you hate and then come in here and tell us about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commodore Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 really enjoyed the first season, but am struggling to get through this one (just finished episode 4) It's becoming formulaic, Frank finds leverage to eliminate anyone in his way, destroys them, rinse/repeat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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