House of Cards, Second Season

[Horza]

Well,

I don't see how that required the wiping out of that plotline at the start of S2. If anything they should have kept it running so there'd be some honest to goodness tension as our plucky underdogs battle to bring down Underwood on the verge of his ascension to the highest office in the land. Instead we got billionaire intrigue and Handler: The Doug Stamper Story.

Fuck, if you don't like it stop watching it. I don't understand this pathological need to watch shit you hate and then come in here and tell us about it.

Get a grip. This is a fun show to watch, it's also full of beautifully shot scenes of underwritten characters exchanging unbelievable dialogue in the pursuit of a weirdly paced plot that adds up to less than the sum of its parts.

[Castel]

really enjoyed the first season, but am struggling to get through this one (just finished episode 4)

It's becoming formulaic, Frank finds leverage to eliminate anyone in his way, destroys them, rinse/repeat

It's a bit like Boss imo. You know on some level that Kelsey Grammer's Kane going to wiggle out of the chains and avoid complete destruction the real question is: what price will be paid for this escape? Of course, Boss had an interesting over-arching story that created some tension all on it's own as you realized it was all self-destructive and futile, something this show doesn't have going for it.

Horza,spoiler for the entire british series:

There is no tension. Maybe the film-makers are presuming too much about their audience's familiarity with the show, but it seemed pretty clear to me that the plot was "asshole becomes President". It's like the Boss thing above, it's the journey towards the holy grail (and the aftermath)that's supposed to be interesting imo.

[Horza]

Castel, spoilers for UK and US HoC

I don't think they were assuming much familiarity with the UK Series, and rightly so. There's nothing wrong with 'asshole becomes President/Prime Minister/High School Captain' as a plot structure, foregone conclusions are fine so long as the climb isn't all the show is about. Tension comes from caring about the outcome, not from the extent of the adversity per se. In UK HoC there were fewer characters and they were generally better drawn, there were reasons to care about what happened to them in the course of Urquhart's climb to power. Francis Urquhart himself was morally complex, we meet him as an old and loyal servant of the Conservative Party, hopeful of his just reward. Over the first season we watch him become a shark. We meet Frank Underwood snapping a dog's neck, cold-blooded from the start.

I agree the armed services rape plotline worked a lot better than all the others, because we actually saw some consequences. For once the show brought on an idealistic character who wasn't a walking punchline, gave her some depth and allowed her to respond like a normal person to the machinations of the Underwoods. It's a good example of why the rest of the political plotlines feel so hollow.

[Arthmail]

I have a grip. All of the bitching is just fucking boring. Have at it.

[Horza]

What does that make bitching about people bitching?

[Howdyphillip]

I just finished the series tonight, and I am again greeted with the simple fact that Kevin Spacey is the greatest living American actor. Part of the writing and machinations were tedious and stretched the bounds of my ability to suspend my disbelief, but the show more than made up for it with the performances.

This was absolutely fantastic and was more than worth it to renew my Netflix account for.

[Raja]

I don't see how that required the wiping out of that plotline at the start of S2. If anything they should have kept it running so there'd be some honest to goodness tension as our plucky underdogs battle to bring down Underwood on the verge of his ascension to the highest office in the land. Instead we got billionaire intrigue and Handler: The Doug Stamper Story.

Season 2 spoilers

I feel like you can still kill of Zoey and Jenine if you keep the editor around. The tension, or stakes rather might have mattered if the editor( his name escapes me right now) hadn't been caught the way he was and then put into jail. Before he got caught, I thought he would be tipped off and that that storyline might get somewhere but nope. That might be a bit of allegory, but imo it was quite poor. I'm not sure why he didn't just die, it might have been better to do that rather than make him go through this whole ridiculous 'hacking' the AT & T network and what not. I mean, if you were going to give him a insignificant end ( so far) you might as well get it over with than dragging it out as they did. The show would probably have been better served if he actually got somewhere rather than end up in jail. I suppose they introduced that anonymous style hacker using his story line, so there is that

[El Cid]

I just finished the series tonight, and I am again greeted with the simple fact that Kevin Spacey is the greatest living American actor. Part of the writing and machinations were tedious and stretched the bounds of my ability to suspend my disbelief, but the show more than made up for it with the performances.

This was absolutely fantastic and was more than worth it to renew my Netflix account for.

Spacey is just brilliant. Calculated, Ruthless, but just so damn smooth.

[Commodore]

A bill raising the retirement age and cutting spending is not one any Democrat would propose or vote for.

And why would a Tea Party senator oppose it?

[Castel]

Because the Tea Party guy is supposed to be the radical asshole doing his own thing no matter what the leadership agreed on? Completely fictional of course.

[Zorral]

A bill raising the retirement age and cutting spending is not one any Democrat would propose or vote for.

And why would a Tea Party senator oppose it?

Disagree entirely, judging by the history of Clinton etc.

As for T bag opposition because it's all about NO

Danged depressing.

Claire's bill show just how this works.

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

And why would a Tea Party senator oppose it?

Cause a Dem is proposing it.

[Aemon Stark]

The power couple of Kevin Spacey and Robin Wright may be the greatest pairing in television history. (I say this after episode 4.)

[Kalbear]

At least in that respect it continues to excel, Aemon. They're largely excellent through the entire second season, much better than the first.

[Commodore]

People are confusing ruthlessness for cleverness.

It's not that clever to find someone's personal weakness and exploit it. Most people just have a conscious about it.

Disagree entirely, judging by the history of Clinton etc.

As for T bag opposition because it's all about NO

Danged depressing.

Not once during Obama's tenure has he or the Dems proposed any entitlement reform (the GOP has, and GWB did before). In the House of Cards plot they just inverted reality. It's the GOP proposing entitlement reform and Harry Reid refusing to consider any.

And if you are going to claim the Tea Party says no to anything, what Dem proposal should they have said yes to that would advance their worldview?

[Durckad]

And if you are going to claim the Tea Party says no to anything, what Dem proposal should they have said yes to that would advance their worldview?

Well, the entitlement reform was enacted because A) they wanted to avoid a government shutdown and B) Frank Underwood was involved and is a conniving SOB. Frankly, the most unrealistic aspect of the whole scenario is that the Tea Party gave in as quickly as they did. Then again, s

eeing as Obama doesn't exist in the House of Cards-verse, the Tea Partiers might be more liable to do something other than try to repeal Health Care reform and shut down the government.

Also, expecting HoC to be an exact and realistic depiction of the US political process is a bit naive especially when you consider how many 'historical' films and series fudge the facts for the sake of the good old entertainment factor.

I just finished season 2.

I thought it was, overall, better than Season 1. Season 1 had a bunch of filler in the middle but it was bookended by some terrific episodes. Season 2 is the same, except it's a

bit more consistent overall. I think that I will end up being one of those annoying naysayers that picks apart the 'popular show of the week.' I love House of Cards for its acting and its characters, but god does it take the easy way out with a lot of its plotting. Aside from Frank and Claire, pretty much everyone is either naive or incompetent and President Walker makes Dubya look like some bastion of towering intellect with how easily he is duped and played by Frank. It's a great show to watch for the characters and the acting but the politics and the maneuvering is like watching a game of Scrabble between an English major and a group of mentally handicapped four year olds.

I was really disappointed that the reporters' storylines seemed to get dropped halfway through the season. There was some potential there to bring another facet of the story into play but unfortunately, that did not happen. Rachel's story seemed the most needlessly lengthened as if it was just there to fill up space until that inevitable climax. I quite like Stamper though. He's a certified slimeball creepbag and one of the few characters with almost nothing redeeming about him, but I'll be a bit disappointed if he ends up dead.

So yeah, I enjoyed this season but I don't think it deserves all the acclaim it's getting. Maybe if the acclaim was limited to the acting and some of the characters, but I can't help but find most of the plotting lazy and contrived.

[Zorral]

For what it's worth, all you wrote reflects my feelings about this as well. :cheers:

(Content of quote removed because it exposed spoilers despite you hiding them, and I couldn't get them to go back into hiding again.)

[Commodore]

The Underwoods are pure evil, but I don't think the HoC admirers in the DC ruling class see them that way. To them it is a confirmation and reflection of how their world works. They are all powerful doing needful things in a world they own, no matter what it takes. It is a confirmation of their power and abilities. They do not consider it evil just real, maybe to be admired.

[Durckad]

And you get that from... where?

It's possible to enjoy a show whilst still finding the characters to be awful, terrible people.

[Myshkin]

I just finished season 2.

I thought it was, overall, better than Season 1. Season 1 had a bunch of filler in the middle but it was bookended by some terrific episodes. Season 2 is the same, except it's a

bit more consistent overall. I think that I will end up being one of those annoying naysayers that picks apart the 'popular show of the week.' I love House of Cards for its acting and its characters, but god does it take the easy way out with a lot of its plotting. Aside from Frank and Claire, pretty much everyone is either naive or incompetent and President Walker makes Dubya look like some bastion of towering intellect with how easily he is duped and played by Frank. It's a great show to watch for the characters and the acting but the politics and the maneuvering is like watching a game of Scrabble between an English major and a group of mentally handicapped four year olds.

I was really disappointed that the reporters' storylines seemed to get dropped halfway through the season. There was some potential there to bring another facet of the story into play but unfortunately, that did not happen. Rachel's story seemed the most needlessly lengthened as if it was just there to fill up space until that inevitable climax. I quite like Stamper though. He's a certified slimeball creepbag and one of the few characters with almost nothing redeeming about him, but I'll be a bit disappointed if he ends up dead.

So yeah, I enjoyed this season but I don't think it deserves all the acclaim it's getting. Maybe if the acclaim was limited to the acting and some of the characters, but I can't help but find most of the plotting lazy and contrived.

I liked season one a bit better. I felt is was a bit smaller and meaner, and I liked that. But that's just me. I agree that some of the political maneuverings were too simplistic, but I'd put a lot of what the Underwoods did in that same catagory. I was surprised at how often Frank's Plan A was nothing more than to sweet talk his rabid enemy. I was surprised at how often this worked, and I was surprised at how shocked Frank seemed to be when it didn't.

The reporters storyline being just dropped/wrapped up so early also felt strange to me; almost like the writers hit a wall with it and just said fuck it, we'll cut that shit out. Let's hope Hammerschmidt makes a comeback in season three. Rachel's story takes up way too much time and matters way too little, but I really liked their treatment of Stamper; he's believable as an ex-addict whose world is coming apart. And I'm sorry, but I'm pretty sure he's dead. His eyes are open in the final shot of him laying in the forest.