The Controversial Sansa Chapter

[Dya of Oldstones]

I like Le Cygne's parallels between Arya and Sansa, but I'm suspecting that Sansa killing LF may not be controversial...more like collective fist pumping and shouts of "you go girl!!!

I'm thinking either a wank/quality "me time" or something coming up with pillow tax with Myranda. I've mentioned this before, but maybe she will be getting educated on the uses of moon tea. I would think this quite normal and it would fly under my controversy radar, but maybe not everyone.

I'm also seeing a possibility of her unkiss getting a LOT more real, then GRRM leaving us on a cliffhanger and making us wait until ADOS to see whether or not she gets away with it. :smileysex:

[Le Cygne]

I like Le Cygne's parallels between Arya and Sansa, but I'm suspecting that Sansa killing LF may not be controversial...more like collective fist pumping and shouts of "you go girl!!!

I'm thinking either a wank/quality "me time" or something coming up with pillow tax with Myranda. I've mentioned this before, but maybe she will be getting educated on the uses of moon tea. I would think this quite normal and it would fly under my controversy radar, but maybe not everyone.

I'm also seeing a possibility of her unkiss getting a LOT more real, then GRRM leaving us on a cliffhanger and making us wait until ADOS to see whether or not she gets away with it. :smileysex:

Quality me time! Perfect! :lol:

And the unkiss getting real, that's going to be very interesting, too. He made us wait so long... I bet he's having fun writing this part, too. :leer:

[Mad Madam Mim]

Quality me time! Perfect! :lol:

And the unkiss getting real, that's going to be very interesting, too. He made us wait so long... I bet he's having fun writing this part, too. :leer:

Oh I hope so! Or I can imagine her 'unkiss' thoughts turning a lot more risque :leer:

[OldGimletEye]

My thought is that Sansa will turn down lemon cakes.

[Dya of Oldstones]

Quality me time! Perfect! :lol:

And the unkiss getting real, that's going to be very interesting, too. He made us wait so long... I bet he's having fun writing this part, too. :leer:

Too much fun and the suspense is killing some of us. :bawl:

[Steelborn]

Oh I hope so! Or I can imagine her 'unkiss' thoughts turning a lot more risque :leer:

"I love your skinny legs, and what's between them." The Hound knelt to unkiss her there, lightly on her mound at first, but Sansa moved her legs apart a little, and he saw the pink inside and kissed that as well, and tasted her.

She gave a little gasp. "If you love me all so much, why are you still dressed?" she whispered. "You know nothing, Sandor Clegane. Noth---oh. Oh. OHHH."

:leer:

[Taenqyrhae]

I think Sansa is going to seduce someone…possibly Littlefinger but not necessarily.

I really like the idea posted several pages back about Sansa seducing Littlefinger and then claiming he raped her. That would explain why her hymen has plot armor throughout the series…so she'll have proof. I could see her doing it before her wedding night with Harry, convincing LF that she was in love with him and wanted him to be her first. It would be controversial to some people for some reasons - whether for the false rape accusation or just Sansa using her cooch to manipulate men.

[Le Cygne]

Oh I hope so! Or I can imagine her 'unkiss' thoughts turning a lot more risque :leer:

Her last chapter she was practically channeling him, and in addition to the cruel kisses fantasy a la Dany, and she's a woman now, she won't close her eyes ("look at me"), there was the Alayne Stone/Sandor - Mya Stone/Lothor parallel, and this:

"... Does he dream of her draped in silks and velvets?"

"He's a man. He dreams of her naked."

And then she places him in the marriage bed, because of how he'd kissed her, after dreaming of him in the marriage bed, because of how he'd kissed her, and he asked for a song, and just before that dream, there were dogs barking when Lysa sang, and then:

"I will dream a sweet dream, and when I wake there will be dogs barking..."

And of course, the wicked things she wants to do:

"Usually when ladies share my bed they have to pay a pillow tax and tell me all about the wicked things they've done."

"What if they haven't done any wicked things?"

"Why, then they must confess all the wicked things they want to do."

Oh, yeah, he's set it up... :leer:

[Colonel Green]

I really like the idea posted several pages back about Sansa seducing Littlefinger and then claiming he raped her. That would explain why her hymen has plot armor throughout the series…so she'll have proof. I could see her doing it before her wedding night with Harry, convincing LF that she was in love with him and wanted him to be her first. It would be controversial to some people for some reasons - whether for the false rape accusation or just Sansa using her cooch to manipulate men.

That makes no sense. If she wanted to bring down Littlefinger, all she has to do is expose all the incriminating stuff he's done that she knows about. Moreover, it's injurious to her situation to lose her virginity, and in particular to claim she was raped.

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

yup, controversial to some fans does not mean rape or child murder.

But a lot of fans find the awakening of Sansa's sexuality very controversial. You would not believe how often on this forum people rant on about Sansa's innocence and purity and exclaim that they feel possession over her virginity, wouldn't let my daughter/sister anywhere near the hound, want her to be with someone "nice" who they approve of, which totally negates the choice of the actual woman in question.

Sansa's sexuality is a long fought over subject, with those who see her ever growing passion for Sandor and see the coming of age element to her arc going nose to nose with the "she is a child and must forever remain a chaste and pure innocent embodiment of the "good girl" " crowd.

I think she will have a full and frank sexual discussion with Randa, learn more of the ways a Westerosi woman can have her cake & eat it too. ie moon tea. she will continue to fantasise about the Hound and yes, have a good wank.

Which would I guarantee you scandalise a lot of readers.

[Le Cygne]

Sansa's sexuality is a long fought over subject, with those who see her ever growing passion for Sandor and see the coming of age element to her arc going nose to nose with the "she is a child and must forever remain a chaste and pure innocent embodiment of the "good girl" " crowd.

Also, it makes no sense that he's going to sideline a main female character sexually. Even Bran said she loves kissing stories. If he can see it...

"My sister Sansa likes the kissing stories, but those are stupid."

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

Yes, GRRM has deliberately set Sansa up as enjoying romance and sex is absolutely a part of romance, Lust & Love share the same currency. Sansa's sexual awakening is an integral element of her story. And there is no way she will be a Virgin at stories end, and given that she starts out as the archetypal perfect Westerosi daughter the chances of her not growing into an altogether more empowered and self assured woman are slim to non.

It disturbs me how afraid of female sexuality some readers are. The fact that so many readers refute her personal feelings and desires in favour of their own diktat of her staying pure & chaste and only opening her legs through marriage to the character they feel is "good enough" for this innocent tower of good girl virginity which they see her as tells us a lot about how far entrenched these controlling ideas about women and sex still are in our own world.

Others want to use her as a reward for the character they like best. and pair her with people she shows zero personal interest in, which just plays into the age old princess's as prizes cliché which I feel her story arc is directly flicking the V to.

Her journey from valuable, pliable, obedient commodity to self assured, self directed, independent minded lady is proving to be a joy to read. If her story suddenly takes a massive U turn I'd be extremely shocked.

And in a world that reflects our own in the matter of women's sexuality ie: it being manipulated, denied and traded by men as a means to subjugate them, her taking her sexuality into her own hands has got to be key element to her story.

[Le Cygne]

I agree with everything you said, I can't say it any better...

Also I'm still laughing about this, given our wanking prediction:

her taking her sexuality into her own hands has got to be key element to her story

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

you gotta love a good double entendre. ;)

[Harry the Hair]

My thought is that Sansa will turn down lemon cakes.

Blasphemy!!!! :O

[OldGimletEye]

Blasphemy!!!! :o

At the Gates of the Moon, Sansa in her room......

Knock, Knock, Knock

Sansa: Uh,er, um, who's there?

Randa: Sansa it's Randa. I've got some freshly made lemoncakes.

Sansa: Uh, yeah, well, um, thanks, but I'm not really interested right now. Maybe later.

Randa: Sansa, you've got me a little worried here. You're turning down lemon cakes. Is something wrong?

Sansa: Uh, um, er, everything is just fine. I'll be out in a few minutes.

Randa: Sansa why are you breathing so heavily?

Sansa: Breathing heavily? Uh, um, I don't think I was.

Randa: Yeah, well you were. You were making some other strange noises too. I didn't want to say anything, but.....

Sansa: I wasn't!!!

Randa: Yeah, well, you were. Were you doing that thing I showed you?

Sansa: No, I would never, I mean, a proper lady would never.....

Randa: Sansa, come on. Tell me the truth. I'm gonna keep pestering you until you tell me. I still haven't got my pillow tax. It's time I collected.

Sansa: Ok, maybe I was, but just a little.

Randa: Just a little? LOL. Ok. But now, I have to find out to who.

Sansa; Uh, um, well, you wouldn't know him. Anyway, I just paid your pillow tax.

Randa: Well you were behind in paying the tax and interest has accrued. Too bad for you. So tell me, who was it Sansa? Ser Loras? Harry The Heir? One of the Royces? Garlan Tyrell? Aegon?

Sansa: Well none of them actually. I'd rather not say.

Randa: Sansa, I'm gonna get this out of you.

Sansa: Ok, fine, it was Sandor Clegane.

Randa: Sandor Clegane? Goddamn girl, you're freakier than I thought.

Sansa: Well, it could be worse. Tyrion Lannister would have been worse.

Randa: Well, that's true. But Sandor Clegane?

Sansa: Well, see the thing is, well, you really don't understand.....

Randa: Oh, I understand Sansa. Somebody has been very wicked. Wicked indeed.

Sansa: Randa, please don't tell Mya!

Randa: Well, that depends.

Sansa: Depends on what?

Randa: Depends on whether you tell me everything.

Sansa: You're extorting me!

Randa: Yes, yes, I am.

Sansa: Ok, fine. I'll tell you. Bring in those lemoncakes.

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

Bwahahahahahahaha!!!!! :lmao:

[Harry the Hair]

At the Gates of the Moon, Sansa in her room......

Knock, Knock, Knock

Sansa: Uh,er, um, who's there?

Randa: Sansa it's Randa. I've got some freshly made lemoncakes.

Sansa: Uh, yeah, well, um, thanks, but I'm not really interested right now. Maybe later.

Randa: Sansa, you've got me a little worried here. You're turning down lemon cakes. Is something wrong?

Sansa: Uh, um, er, everything is just fine. I'll be out in a few minutes.

Randa: Sansa why are you breathing so heavily?

Sansa: Breathing heavily? Uh, um, I don't think I was.

Randa: Yeah, well you were. You were making some other strange noises too. I didn't want to say anything, but.....

Sansa: I wasn't!!!

Randa: Yeah, well, you were. Were you doing that thing I showed you?

Sansa: No, I would never, I mean, a proper lady would never.....

Randa: Sansa, come on. Tell me the truth. I'm gonna keep pestering you until you tell me. I still haven't got my pillow tax. It's time I collected.

Sansa: Ok, maybe I was, but just a little.

Randa: Just a little? LOL. Ok. But now, I have to find out to who.

Sansa; Uh, um, well, you wouldn't know him. Anyway, I just paid your pillow tax.

Randa: Well you were behind in paying the tax and interest has accrued. Too bad for you. So tell me, who was it Sansa? Ser Loras? Harry The Heir? One of the Royces? Garlan Tyrell? Aegon?

Sansa: Well none of them actually. I'd rather not say.

Randa: Sansa, I'm gonna get this out of you.

Sansa: Ok, fine, it was Sandor Clegane.

Randa: Sandor Clegane? Goddamn girl, you're freakier than I thought.

Sansa: Well, see the thing is, well, you really don't understand.....

Randa: Oh, I understand Sansa. Somebody has been very wicked. Wicked indeed.

Sansa: Randa, please don't tell Mya!

Randa: Well, that depends.

Sansa: Depends on what?

Randa: Depends on whether you tell me everything.

Sansa: You're extorting me!

Randa: Yes, yes, I am.

Sansa: Ok, fine. I'll tell you. Bring in those lemoncakes.

then Sandor bursts in to the room in his Gravedigger disguise and yells: I knew it!

Randa: Why do we have a gravedigger here?

Sandor: The elder brother took me with him just in case things don't work out with Sweetrobin....

[Le Cygne]

<snip>

Awesome! :lol:

[Colonel Green]

Yes, GRRM has deliberately set Sansa up as enjoying romance and sex is absolutely a part of romance, Lust & Love share the same currency. Sansa's sexual awakening is an integral element of her story. And there is no way she will be a Virgin at stories end, and given that she starts out as the archetypal perfect Westerosi daughter the chances of her not growing into an altogether more empowered and self assured woman are slim to non.

It disturbs me how afraid of female sexuality some readers are. The fact that so many readers refute her personal feelings and desires in favour of their own diktat of her staying pure & chaste and only opening her legs through marriage to the character they feel is "good enough" for this innocent tower of good girl virginity which they see her as tells us a lot about how far entrenched these controlling ideas about women and sex still are in our own world.

Others want to use her as a reward for the character they like best. and pair her with people she shows zero personal interest in, which just plays into the age old princess's as prizes cliché which I feel her story arc is directly flicking the V to.

Her journey from valuable, pliable, obedient commodity to self assured, self directed, independent minded lady is proving to be a joy to read. If her story suddenly takes a massive U turn I'd be extremely shocked.

And in a world that reflects our own in the matter of women's sexuality ie: it being manipulated, denied and traded by men as a means to subjugate them, her taking her sexuality into her own hands has got to be key element to her story.

A lot of the speculations about the contents of this chapter are wildly over the top (Sansa will murder Robin and then get raped by Littlefinger, blah blah blah), but this suggestion is the exact opposite, a serious underbilling. Elio has repeatedly cited the Vale of Arryn as a place where interesting things will be happening in TWOW, a seeming callback to the earlier, seriously overplayed quote about "controversial" -- but I really doubt the interesting things he's discussing involve Sansa masturbating.

It's also iffy to bring the show into discussion, of course, but it sounds like there's a major development in Sansa's arc next season, and I expect it correlates broadly to her book material arc.