How will they condense FFC and DWD into Season 5? (book spoilers)

[Arkash]

Indeed, the switch from talking about eight seasons to talking about seven is probably motivated by that, in some part.

Yeah, that's true. Still; it's damn fucking annoying that we're going to have only seven seasons were eight, imo, would have been perfect.

TWOW is gonna be massive anyway.We're too far away from ADOS to say, but if TWOW is the second ASOS - and it seems it will, it's gonna need (if we want to keep as much of the subtitlties possible and thrilling sub-plots) at least one season and a half. So I still hope for eight seasons... but knowing it's seven and it's most likely going to stay that way...

[JonSnowed]

If Winds really is so epic then almost certainly we will be getting some of it next season.

[sj4iy]

Yeah, that's true. Still; it's damn fucking annoying that we're going to have only seven seasons were eight, imo, would have been perfect.

TWOW is gonna be massive anyway.We're too far away from ADOS to say, but if TWOW is the second ASOS - and it seems it will, it's gonna need (if we want to keep as much of the subtitlties possible and thrilling sub-plots) at least one season and a half. So I still hope for eight seasons... but knowing it's seven and it's most likely going to stay that way...

I like the idea of seven seasons, myself. I've watched too many tv shows try to drag out the story beyond the breaking point. If the showrunners think that their story will work best in 7 seasons, then I'm fine with it. I'd rather be left wanting more than thinking "if only they hadn't dragged it out".

[boojam]

Game of Thrones is good for HBO's prestige, but does it actually move their bottom line much? While audiences have grown, the show's budget has also grown. And the show is widely pirated and people share HBO go accounts. I mean - yeah I'm sure HBO is thrilled to have GoT and the HBO executives may care more about it than most of their other shows, but GoT is only a small part of the content that HBO is creating.

Well as I mentioned elsewhere... HBO saved Time-Warner's bacon.

No long ago Rupert Murdoch tried a hostile buy of TW , but HBO's profits where so high for this year that ol' Rupert's share holders thought he was gonna sell the farm to get TW and

crashed his stock!

Murdoch ran for the hills.

How much of that was due to GOT I don't know, but I think it makes up a decent fraction of HBO's bottom line.

If HBO had a Star War's - like 'merchandizing' (more than they do) with the show they might even bullet proof TW more!

(Actually HBO is working of better distribution, we shall see.)

[PatrickStormborn]

Yeah, that's true. Still; it's damn fucking annoying that we're going to have only seven seasons were eight, imo, would have been perfect.

TWOW is gonna be massive anyway.We're too far away from ADOS to say, but if TWOW is the second ASOS - and it seems it will, it's gonna need (if we want to keep as much of the subtitlties possible and thrilling sub-plots) at least one season and a half. So I still hope for eight seasons... but knowing it's seven and it's most likely going to stay that way...

With Aegon and Euron most likely cut, I imagine a significant portion of TWoW will be unnecessary for the show.

[Hath4]

I think Euron will be in the show, the latest greyjoy family tree has him as balons brother, so he existes within the show universe. Most likly he will be the only greyjoy uncle in the show. They could have had the entire ironborn story cut last year by having yara captured by Ramsay, but the didn't so the plot will be there, though heavily reduced with no Vic or aeron. Aegon though is more likly to be cut. If I had to estimate the odds I would say 80 percent chance Euron is in, 40 percent for Aegon.

[Marcus Agrippa]

With Aegon and Euron most likely cut, I imagine a significant portion of TWoW will be unnecessary for the show.

I think we are getting Aegon. Sneaky suspicion. Also (a) lady stoneheart. Varys's plan is supposed to be unveiled next season. Also Just because you have heard nothing about it means they are keeping it under wraps. I made a mistake and told my friends by the end of ADWD there were 4 active throne seekers so I also hope Euron makes it.

[PatrickStormborn]

I think we are getting Aegon. Sneaky suspicion. Also (a) lady stoneheart. Varys's plan is supposed to be unveiled next season. Also Just because you have heard nothing about it means they are keeping it under wraps. I made a mistake and told my friends by the end of ADWD there were 4 active throne seekers so I also hope Euron makes it.

I hope that you're right, but unfortunately there is currently nothing to suggest that Aegon has been included. Euron is even less likely, although I think they could delay him until season 6.

It would be extremely anticlimactic if Dany invades Westeros and has to face... Tommen and Stannis.

[Marcus Agrippa]

I hope that you're right, but unfortunately there is currently nothing to suggest that Aegon has been included. Euron is even less likely, although I think they could delay him until season 6.

It would be extremely anticlimactic if Dany invades Westeros and has to face... Tommen and Stannis.

That would be the most boring thing of all time. Namely because the north just wants independence (go Scotland!) and will betray stannis at some point. Tommen looks like a good guy in the show. If they want to make Daenerys a villain that would be it. I know a lot of show people already like Tommen. Like really like him. It's sort of crazy. Aging him up in the show might have been a mistake. I read somewhere on this forum that the Kingsmoot was going to happen. I haven't found a proof yet so I just keep quite about it. True we have nothing on Jon connington but I am not so certain that Aegon matters till book six anyway. He only met tyrion and moved across the sea to Westeros in ADWD. Thought the timing of Arianne 1 is interesting.

[Mycah Bluth]

They are going to go balls to the wall with composite characters. :grouphug:

Is there any way they could replace Taena Merryweather with Ellaria Sand? I would dearly love that, and for Ellaria to be spying for Doran the whole time. There is so much dramatic potential to be had between Cersei and her.

[zaphodbrx]

I still can't believe that they cut Arianne and Quentyn. hundreds of pages with deep characterization and complexity just tossed out of the window. For what? A 'wuv' story between Trystane and Myrcella, Sand Snake T & A, and some fan fiction involving Jaime. Yeah..

I almost think they would have done better just not having Dorne at all ( like the Iron Islands now ).

[PatrickStormborn]

That would be the most boring thing of all time. Namely because the north just wants independence (go Scotland!) and will betray stannis at some point. Tommen looks like a good guy in the show. If they want to make Daenerys a villain that would be it. I know a lot of show people already like Tommen. Like really like him. It's sort of crazy. Aging him up in the show might have been a mistake. I read somewhere on this forum that the Kingsmoot was going to happen. I haven't found a proof yet so I just keep quite about it. True we have nothing on Jon connington but I am not so certain that Aegon matters till book six anyway. He only met tyrion and moved across the sea to Westeros in ADWD. Thought the timing of Arianne 1 is interesting.

It would certainly be boring.

Agreed on Tommen. Aging him up completely defeats the purpose of the character. With a strong regent, show-Tommen is easily the best candidate for the throne. I say this as one of book-Dany's biggest supporters: I think show-Tommen is a FAR better option than show-Daenerys. Book-Dany made mistakes in Meereen, but they were generally due to a desire for peace; show-Dany doesn't even have any Meereenese advisers. How on earth did D&D miss the point so badly?

But I disagree on Aegon. Yes, he'll become more important in TWoW, but he's already important in ADwD: he's part of Varys' scheme, Tyrion convinces him to turn west instead of east, he successfuly conquers vast areas of the Stormlands in a relatively short time-frame, and his invasion puts significant pressure on the crown.

They could delay him until season 6, but they won't. I'm holding out hope that Euron is being held back, though.

[aFeastForDragons]

The show will be horribly boring without Aegon, Vic and Euron.

[123456750]

I hope that you're right, but unfortunately there is currently nothing to suggest that Aegon has been included. Euron is even less likely, although I think they could delay him until season 6.

It would be extremely anticlimactic if Dany invades Westeros and has to face... Tommen and Stannis.

If Aegon is not included in season 5, then it will clearly mean one thing - he is fake and just another Iron Throne contender. And that will be a huge spoiler for the next books.

[Marcus Agrippa]

It would certainly be boring.

Agreed on Tommen. Aging him up completely defeats the purpose of the character. With a strong regent, show-Tommen is easily the best candidate for the throne. I say this as one of book-Dany's biggest supporters: I think show-Tommen is a FAR better option than show-Daenerys. Book-Dany made mistakes in Meereen, but they were generally due to a desire for peace; show-Dany doesn't even have any Meereenese advisers. How on earth did D&D miss the point so badly?

But I disagree on Aegon. Yes, he'll become more important in TWoW, but he's already important in ADwD: he's part of Varys' scheme, Tyrion convinces him to turn west instead of east, he successfuly conquers vast areas of the Stormlands in a relatively short time-frame, and his invasion puts significant pressure on the crown.

They could delay him until season 6, but they won't. I'm holding out hope that Euron is being held back, though.

I agree- show tommen is becoming a force of popularity. I don't if "best" works yet. We will see how he reacts to any of the coming events. If cersei still over-lords him then nobody has a reason to cheer for him. On the other hand if he shows some governing abaility or manages to be tricked by cersei (mother knows best) then we are looking at a very likable character.

His conquering of the Stormlands is imporant but it didn't matter until he got storms end. Stannis is now down to 3 castles in the south and none of them are major (various keeps still hold to him as well but nothing major)

There is a lot going on in this season that's why I see him showing up in late 5 or 6. From what i have heard we will get a lot of the north and the lot of dorne. With dany, tyrion, vale, and kl being mixed in (the far north we might only get a scene or two) I doubt they will want to over do the amount of new characters. I hope Manderly makes it.

The show will be horribly boring without Aegon, Vic and Euron.

I could do without out Vic but the other two almost HAVE to be in it. The conflict needs to be large. I really think they extended ASOS way to long.

[The Reckoner]

I wonder if, Trystane Martell being (f)Aegon, Varys and Illyrio won't be working to Doran Martell to procure the hellhorn, using the chaos in Meereen to get close enough to the dragons to bind them with the horn.

[PatrickStormborn]

If Aegon is not included in season 5, then it will clearly mean one thing - he is fake and just another Iron Throne contender. And that will be a huge spoiler for the next books.

All it means is that D&D decided he was not essential to the conclusion of the story. But that is not necessarily a huge spoiler.

I agree- show tommen is becoming a force of popularity. I don't if "best" works yet. We will see how he reacts to any of the coming events. If cersei still over-lords him then nobody has a reason to cheer for him. On the other hand if he shows some governing abaility or manages to be tricked by cersei (mother knows best) then we are looking at a very likable character.

His conquering of the Stormlands is imporant but it didn't matter until he got storms end. Stannis is now down to 3 castles in the south and none of them are major (various keeps still hold to him as well but nothing major)

There is a lot going on in this season that's why I see him showing up in late 5 or 6. From what i have heard we will get a lot of the north and the lot of dorne. With dany, tyrion, vale, and kl being mixed in (the far north we might only get a scene or two) I doubt they will want to over do the amount of new characters. I hope Manderly makes it.

I could do without out Vic but the other two almost HAVE to be in it. The conflict needs to be large. I really think they extended ASOS way to long.

That's why I said he's the best if he has a strong regent - or even a strong hand. Mace and Cersei are obviously not good candidates to rule Westeros, especially with the Others set to invade. But with someone like Kevan, I'd back an older Tommen over show-Stannis or show-Dany (on the other hand, book-Stannis and book-Dany are both preferrable to book-Tommen even with a strong regent). Without Euron or Aegon, Stannis and Dany are going to look far worse by creating more war, especially as the show has yet to establish the continued unrest in the Riverlands.

Yes, there is a lot going on in season 5. But Aegon is more important than most of what the show is choosing to focus on. Without Arianne, Aegon or the plot to marry Dany, Dorne is not important in season 5. If their role in the show is to support or oppose Dany, they could have been introduced in season 6. Similarly, there's little point expanding the Vale storyline at the expense of Aegon.

They definitely stretched ASoS out too much, and worse they adapted it badly. I'm still so confused about their structuring of season 4. Why bother having the Purple Wedding so early in the season if Tyrion's escape was delayed until the finale, Jaime was already back in King's Landing, and Stannis didn't get to the Wall until episode 10? Why have nothing happen at the Wall all season and then rush everything that does happen? Why have Dany start ruling Meereen so early if they weren't even actually going to go into her ADwD material until season 5? Why create additional material for Stannis and Jon's storylines when they could have just finished their ASoS material???

[Marcus Agrippa]

All it means is that D&D decided he was not essential to the conclusion of the story. But that is not necessarily a huge spoiler.

That's why I said he's the best if he has a strong regent - or even a strong hand. Mace and Cersei are obviously not good candidates to rule Westeros, especially with the Others set to invade. But with someone like Kevan, I'd back an older Tommen over show-Stannis or show-Dany (on the other hand, book-Stannis and book-Dany are both preferrable to book-Tommen even with a strong regent). Without Euron or Aegon, Stannis and Dany are going to look far worse by creating more war, especially as the show has yet to establish the continued unrest in the Riverlands.

Yes, there is a lot going on in season 5. But Aegon is more important than most of what the show is choosing to focus on. Without Arianne, Aegon or the plot to marry Dany, Dorne is not important in season 5. If their role in the show is to support or oppose Dany, they could have been introduced in season 6. Similarly, there's little point expanding the Vale storyline at the expense of Aegon.

They definitely stretched ASoS out too much, and worse they adapted it badly. I'm still so confused about their structuring of season 4. Why bother having the Purple Wedding so early in the season if Tyrion's escape was delayed until the finale, Jaime was already back in King's Landing, and Stannis didn't get to the Wall until episode 10? Why have nothing happen at the Wall all season and then rush everything that does happen? Why have Dany start ruling Meereen so early if they weren't even actually going to go into her ADwD material until season 5? Why create additional material for Stannis and Jon's storylines when they could have just finished their ASoS material???

Sorry- I miss read that on the top. Yes- thank goodness both his possible regents are dumb. I wonder what they are going to do with him and Margery? Show! her seems to be very smart and capable and I wonder how influetional she will be in the governing structure. I agree without the plot to marry dany to Aegon or Quetyen Dornan Makes very little sense and it looks really bad. It also makes Varys look like some sort of hero when he cleary is a huge problem in the books. Stannis will be fine- the show verision has gotten huge amounts of supports after the eddard thing and he will now be the shows bad ass. Daenerys is in some trouble. This why they need to show the battle of fire and she needs to COMMAND it. She needs a victory or her bad ass moment in her last chapter will sound hollow or worse- she will be made into a lunatic.

I agree on every level. They could have been done with ASOS at the start of 5 and cleared AFFC in a shorter period and extended ADWD. Even if they go around the same period in the timeline Stannis, Daenerys, and Tyrion have far more imporant storylines. That being said keeping Tywin in the show longer made it awesome for that season. Charles dance is very good. I have grinded on the lack of story progress for Jon and Stannis before. They needed to finish their respective materials so they could move on quickly thourgh the politics of being king. The purple wedding to me so early made sense. They should have done the Red wedding season 3 episode 5 and the purple season 3 episode 8 with stannis heading to the wall in episode 10 with the cliffhanger of the wildings attacking the wall or starting their attack.

[Colonel Green]

They should have done the Red wedding season 3 episode 5 and the purple season 3 episode 8 with stannis heading to the wall in episode 10 with the cliffhanger of the wildings attacking the wall or starting their attack.

I don't agree there.

The show, in adapting the books, has to keep in mind all subsequent seasonal arcs when they adapt a given season (this is especially true as they start to approach AFFC/ADWD, which is all over the place in terms of where it leaves the characters).

ASOS is too big to do well in one season. As a result, you have to structure the major story points over a two-season period, and given the nature of AFFC/ADWD, by and large it make sense to use most of the end of ASOS as the end of the fourth season. The Red Wedding in episode 5 would have been impossible. You'd have to do the entire Sansa/Tyrion KL story, as well as basically all of Arya's ASOS material, in the first four episodes, in addition to all the setup with Robb and Catelyn, and Jaime and Brienne's visit to Harrenhal and meeting Bolton, etc.

By and large, I think the show's placement of the major "event" markers over seasons 3 and 4 make sense, with the major exception of the Battle of the Wall. I think the insistence on having it in episode 9 was a mistake.

[sj4iy]

I still don't understand the insistence that the show's seasons should be divided up one per book. That's nonsensical to me. Why would you create arbitrary limits on the show simply because that's the way the books were divided up?