eyenon15 Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 It would have to be something that capitalizes on Joffreys biggest fear and also humilates him.I'm thinking Joffs fear is losing the power that his birthright gives him. So some type of deal where Tywin arranges a situation where they are in a room somewhere away from the public and no one is bowing down to King Joffs authority.Whatever the lesson Tywin did, it would no doubt be a stupid and useless lesson.Tywin's lesson to Tyrion was a huge failure, his lesson to Joff probably wouldn't have been any better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldHandTheGood Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Hi everyone! Now, we know that Tywin was planning a sharp lesson for Joffrey in ASOS, to make him stop being so bratty. He was visibly upset over the prospect of giving Joffrey a sharp lesson. Tywin of all people being upset. Isn't this a little strange to you? We've never seen Tywin upset, not once (though he was absolutely upset when Joanna died and Tyrion was born). This means that Tywin probably had something horrific planned for Joffrey, but he felt bad about it because he didn't want to put his family's name into ruin. We know what Tywin's sharp lesson for Tyrion was when he was 13.. he had Tysha raped by like 100 soldiers. My theory is that he had something similar in store for Joffrey. He likely planned to have Joffrey raped by someone.. but since he was the King, it had to be someone close and someone who could keep their mouth shut. Having him raped by the Kingsguard would work, and they can be trusted not to hurt him since they swore vows not to. Tyrion would also be a candidate because Joffrey hated Tyrion and it would've been incredibly embarrassing for him to get raped by a dwarf. What do you guys think? A bit of a drastic jump there, don't ya think? First thing, Tywin had Tysha raped because he saw her as no better than a whore, a class of people we know he despised, for daring to marry a Lannister. And doubly, as a way to teach Tyrion a lesson about dishonoring the family name. The punishment was only really workable because of the fact that Tysha was of low birth, a common girl who nobody gave a rat's shit about. Joffrey, on the other hand, was the king, and Tywin's granson. I hazard a guess that he had no issue abusing Tyrion and forcing him into a such a monstrous role in Tysha's fate due to Tyrion being his loathed dwarf son. Joffrey, while certainly a problem for Tywin, would require far more delicacy and subtlety, due to the boy's poor temperament and mental state, and his high standing in society as a king. Having him raped would involve too much risk, and could potentially begin a war if Cersei ever got wind of it. Also, what purpose does it serve? To shame and scar an already petulant and cruel little brat? Would that solve Joffery's temper issues or exacerbate them? I doubt Tywin would have risked such a move, if it ever even remotely crossed his mind (which I somewhat doubt). I doubt Tywin knew at that point what a sharp lesson for Joffrey would involve, as punishing a king is somewhat difficult, especially one as willful as Joffrey. I could image it would probably have been unpleasant, knowing Tywin, but whether it would have worked or not is another issue entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dames do Moan Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 This should go in the compendium of theories. Tywin was probably getting advice from Randyll Tarly, thinking Joff could benefit from a good raping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batbob45 Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 If Tywin was known for his humor, he would did what Tyrion did to Cersei, put something in Joffrey drink to make him stay on the porcelain throne for hours and hours. if Tywin wanted to torment the kid, he would require Joffrey to run what Joffrey wanted to do through Tywin or lock him in the black cell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiki Posted April 30, 2015 Author Share Posted April 30, 2015 Maybe Tywin would have the City Watch do the deed instead of the KG or Tyrion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiki Posted April 30, 2015 Author Share Posted April 30, 2015 Yes, Tywin was planning on having the City Watch, the Kingsgaurd, and Tyrion all run a train on his nephew. Then Tyrion earns the nickname "The Lion who mounts the King." Tell me, how do you imagine that conversation going when he proposed the plan to Tyrion? Seriously, what is the fixation on rape? I just got the impression that Tywin would temporarily pull his men from the capital or something similar to show Joffrey how screwed he would be without his grandfather's army. I'm not fixated on rape, Tywin is. I'm just telling you guys what's in character for Tywin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsOfBrains Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I am guessing it would be something like getting together all the kg and having them strip him naked and beat him. The message being "these guys, this power you think you have, it's actually mine and you are just a figurehead."I picture Joffrey trying to order the kg to kill Tywin while they ignore him and beat him with sacks full of oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Warning Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I'm not fixated on rape, Tywin is. I'm just telling you guys what's in character for Tywin.Is he?Also, I'd imagine it'd be as simple as Tywin striking the king and the Kingsguard doing nothing or Tywin ordering one of the Kingsguard to give Joff a quick slap. Just to show that Joffrey's power flows from Tywin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyenon15 Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Does anybody have the quotes from Joffrey that sent Tywin over the edge.it was some speech Joff gave about how his father (Robert) was badass and something or other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taenqyrhae Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Yeah, since Tywin was upset by Joffrey implying that Tywin was a coward for not leading the armies against the enemy, maybe he would force Joffrey to ride at the front of a force sent against Robb's army - only right as Joffrey realizes that the odds are insurmountable and that he is about to die, it is revealed that "Robb's army" is just Lannister men wearing Stark colors. I don't think Tywin would try sexual humiliation, even if it wasn't actual rape (such as stripping him down and having masked men grope him), because he would have to know the possibility this would further derange Joffrey and possibly make him incapable of producing heirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseHB Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I'm not fixated on rape, Tywin is. I'm just telling you guys what's in character for Tywin. No that's something that would be in character for the Mountain, or Ramsay. Tywin has more than one tool in his box, and so stupid as to have the king gang raped. Tywin has Tommen. Most useful tool in the box. Tywin's lesson went down as planned. Joffery had pie and wine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georginette RR Martine Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I'm laughing so hard right now !!! Love this thread ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dames do Moan Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I am guessing it would be something like getting together all the kg and having them strip him naked and beat him. The message being "these guys, this power you think you have, it's actually mine and you are just a figurehead."I picture Joffrey trying to order the kg to kill Tywin while they ignore him and beat him with sacks full of oranges.This and the OP have to be a troll right?There is no way Tywin would do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taenqyrhae Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Fun but unlikely theory - Tywin intended to have Joffrey pegged by Sansa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tyrion I Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Does anybody have the quotes from Joffrey that sent Tywin over the edge.it was some speech Joff gave about how his father (Robert) was badass and something or other. It's that SC meeting where Tyrion and the rest of the gang learn about the outcome of the RW. And Joffrey angers Tywin quite a lot when he's pointing out that his father (Robert) won the previous war while Tywin supposedly hid under CR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkfaithful85 Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 That's a pretty big leap for me...he would probably done something like have someone slap him around or kidnap him in the night and put him in a cell for a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clegane'sPup Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 Tyrwin may have isolated Joffrey, but have the KG in the background, and said something like: Kings have been slain before and not was said of it. No, I don't think that would work. If Tywin physically beat Joff, Joff would scheme to get back at his grandsire. Difficulit situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tharvot Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 the pointy end? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clegane'sPup Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 yep I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taenqyrhae Posted April 30, 2015 Share Posted April 30, 2015 I think book Joffrey could be chastised effectively. When Tyrion slaps him, he stops being such a dick, briefly at least, and he did not respond by having Tyrion killed or imprisoned. I think a carefully meted out punishment could very well have set Joffrey on a better course. Joffrey was not totally insane, he had fear, he had a sense of self-preservation, that's all you need to be conditioned via punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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