Rant and Rave without Repercussion [Book Spoilers]

[Nights Kings Queen]

Jaime seems to be really bothered by rape (to the point of cutting off the head of Pia's rapist) so the show has him rape his sister;

Going to defend the show here.

That was bad editing. If you watch that scene again you'll see she's actually kissing him back and pulling him towards her. But they messed up so badly it looked like a rape. That's why they thought it was consensual, because they re-watched it they couldn't see anything other than what they intended.

[Bittertea]

Major spoiler.

D&D have confirmed this was from winds :(

Damn.

Though If/when it is done in the books, I doubt Stannis will have any say in it.

[DarkRose_9]

I actually really liked Hizdahr and Dany's interaction this ep. Imagine if we'd had a whole season of it. Mereen would have been so much more interesting. *sigh* Then they killed him.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

I really need to do a reread. Vowed that I would wait till Martin announces the release of the next book but will have to break that vow it looks like.

Stannis is not the loving parent we see in the show but he has shown some preferences for her daughter that are a bit hard to catch. Like, why he left her have patchface? he was a gift from his parents to make him laugh :dunno: The only thing left from them, he allowed Shireen to have it.

[The Ghost of Winter]

Damn.

Though If/when it is done in the books, I doubt Stannis will have any say in it.

My thoughts exactly, crazy hairy ol' Selyse and Melisandre will probably do it on their own and he'll be pissed.

[aliasocfan]

Major spoiler.

D&D have confirmed this was from winds :(

I kind of hope that GRRM completely fucks with them and cuts it from Winds.

As long as the conversation wasn't recorded. Just pretend it never happened.

[Nights Kings Queen]

Probably but the manner is probably going to be a whole lot different than what happens in the show.

Totes.

Doubt book stannis would sacrifice his daughter to end a blizzard. He would sacrifice his daughter for a dragon and nothing less. The stone dragon. But that will screw up big time.

[DarkRose_9]

I kind of hope that GRRM completely fucks with them and cuts it from Winds.

As long as the conversation wasn't recorded. Just pretend it never happened.

At this point, I hope if they do try to consult with him for next season that he's like, fuck you guys, just make shit up since that's what you're doing anyway.

[Le Cygne]

George sounds really pissed in that post about Outlander. Especially when he writes about the Riverlands storyline which D&D apparently thought was boring. I guess Jaime doing nothing in Dorne and Brienne waiting for a candle is so much better.

God how I hate their smug faces.

True, and that was a nice way to underscore that there's more to come in the Riverlands in the next book.

[teej6]

Again, because it probably got lost in the previous pages:

The scene won't be like in the books. You know what? Because first, Stannis has already marched to Winterfell. He's WAAAY to far from Shireen to burn her. The only way for him to do this is sending a letter saying "btw, the snow is too much for me. Melisandre, burn my child".

Shireen will be burned? Yes. But for different reasons. :dunno:

Also, Stannis while considering the possibility that he may die asks Massey to find the sellswords anyway to put Shireen on the throne.

[Nights Kings Queen]

I kind of hope that GRRM completely fucks with them and cuts it from Winds.

As long as the conversation wasn't recorded. Just pretend it never happened.

Exactly. We'll do a cersei. Push anyone who has seen this down the nearest well and nobody will know. And then it will never have happened.

[Le Cygne]

And the sad part is I don't think this scene was ever intended to be about Stannis, it was so we could be subjected to the sounds of a young girl screaming in another moment of torture porn.

Yep, more torture porn. I suppose we should be thankful they didn't have her raped before she was burned.

[Mr Smith]

I kind of hope that GRRM completely fucks with them and cuts it from Winds.

As long as the conversation wasn't recorded. Just pretend it never happened.

What a ridiculous thing to say. Yeah sure, Martin is happy to see his own work butchered just to mess with D&D. Honestly...

[aliasocfan]

My thoughts exactly, crazy hairy ol' Selyse and Melisandre will probably do it on their own and he'll be pissed.

Completely agree.

[LadySoftheart]

Going to defend the show here.

That was bad editing. If you watch that scene again you'll see she's actually kissing him back and pulling him towards her. But they messed up so badly it looked like a rape. That's why they thought it was consensual, because they re-watched it they couldn't see anything other than what they intended.

Yeah, that's not really what the showrunners said, though - they made sure to point out that Jaime's a bad guy who did a horrible thing, etc., so it's actually very ambiguous what they thought they were showing. But this discussion is very much off-topic so we'd better not continue or else the thread will get shut down, and I have a feeling that people REALLY need it tonight :D

My larger point is that it seems that when a character in the books does one thing, nowadays the character with that name on the show does something quite different - viz Stannis in the books saying that he wants Justin Massey to make sure his daughter becomes queen if Stannis dies, versus burning her alive because of a relatively minor setback compared to what his army is experiencing the books. Where he does not burn Asha Greyjoy (king's blood, anyone?) even though his army is in rather dire straits.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

What a ridiculous thing to say. Yeah sure, Martin is happy to see his own work butchered just to mess with D&D. Honestly...

He's the master of his universe. He can change it and make sense, unlike them. :dunno:

[MordredDayne]

I'm confused about the Hizdahr moment right at the beginning of the Meereen scene. He comes in all late and is like, "Just making sure everything is in order." which I took to mean that it was at least possible that he was organizing the Harpy attack. But then he gets stabbed to death, so I guess he wasn't and it was just a feint? Then again, the Harpies seemed to be killing people pretty indiscriminately, so maybe they double crossed him? Oh hell, I am probably putting way too much thought into this. In all likelihood he was just taking a piss. Unfortunately for him he didn't get lost like the Blackfish.

[Rise Above]

The Unsullied are a bunch of dickless losers on the show. Except for Grey Worm.. and where the hell is he? Dead? Still healing? After all that build up with him and Missandei you'd think they'd at least mention his situation.

[SerMixalot]

For those show apologists that will be defending Shireen's burning cause it happens in the book. I will admit the scene was very powerful on the show and I don't have a problem with the show making Stannis a villain, which he clearly is at this point. Ok, whether it is part of ASOIAF or not (Stannis sacrificing Shireen), fine, it is a character arc for Stannis to travel through and could have worked quite well. One doesn't have to argue as a book purist to point out the problems with the show only story telling. Yes they set this scene up for a while, Stannis has been burning people, that has been established. Yes they have established the power of king's blood. Yes they have shown Stannis to be stubborn man-ambitious like D&D say? NO, he is not ambitious he has a strong and unbreakable conviction of what he must do, there is a difference, though not necessarily important for this argument.

The problem is they have also shown Stannis's doubts about the red god. They have shown him to be a pragmatic man.

They did NOT establish that Stannis has fully bought into the red god. Their own lazy story telling, by not killing Balon, impacts the watcher's ability to believe Stannis would make this decision.

They did not establish what was at stake. It has been shown in show that Stannis will fight through all adversity, not cave in, he has iron will. They did not establish that Stannis was in such a desperate straight as to justify this decision.

And more importantly they did not establish what Stannis had to gain from this sacrifice. Previously he gained a way to Kill Renly and a way into the Storm's End castle and to kill the usurpers, specific goals. Nothing is established as to why Stannis would accept this sacrifice.

It Stannis is to sacrifice his daughter and his legacy, we as viewers must understand, from Stannis's perspective, that it is necessary, that he believes it will be successful and will get him something worth the cost. D&D simply did not achieve that end.

And that is piss poor story telling. The writers did not justify the scene, therefore the scene fails. Powerful yes, emotional yes, but as those initial emotions pass, one wonders WTF.

[Dark Heart]

yes.

The same reason why at the Red Wedding a pregnant woman was stabbed repeatedly in the belly.

It's like they took writing tips from the writers of American Horror Story.

It's really disturbing to me how much this show looks like something Ramsay would write.

Like consider what Myranda says:

“Ramsay gets bored easily. … Let’s see. There was Kiera. The blacksmith’s daughter. She was tall. Like you. Lovely figure. But she talked and talked and talked and… Ramsay got tired of that. Then there was Violet. She had gorgeous blond hair. But she got pregnant and, well, that was boring. Then Tamsay. Such a sweet girl. Of course sweet girls get a bit dull after a while, don’t they? Ramsay let me come with him on that hunt.“

And compare that with what we had in the show.

Sansa’s character growth and storyline in Vale? Well, that’s boring. Catelyn talked too much so we gave her ideas and lines to other people and then killed her for real. All that talking is just too boring. Talisa got pregnant? So very boring, best to have her stabbed in the belly. Honorable and sweet Brienne? Oh, no we can’t have that. Let have her killing people without blinking and fighting with the Hound. That’s much more interesting!

Ramsay‘s “Remember what happens to people who bore me” threat might as well GoT tagline.

Also,. for those who don't get it, Martin's post:

"See, I saw this show that is being AMAZINGLY adapted. And the books are even BETTER. Also, it features a GREAT ACTOR that is both in this AMAZINGLY adapted show and the other one"

Translated:

"See, I saw this show that is being AMAZINGLY adapted, unlike Game of Thrones. And the books are even BETTER, just like ASOIAF. Also, it features a GREAT ACTOR that is both in this AMAZINGLY adapted show and the other one who forgot the character he plays exists, and this show is great because they aren't wasting his talent. So, you better go and watch this AMAZINGLY adapted show instead".

The subtext:

"I hate Game of Thrones, my books are better".

That was amazingly snarky. Bravo for Martin. I was exspecting he would find a way say how unhappy he is; but this was even better then what i hoped for.

As for Edmure; I expect that D&D will rember him when they decide that that "whore's fighting and slapping each other in pond " scen just have to be put into the show.

Cas, why you had to remind me of that scene? Don't remind me...!

Books

Dany: I can't with this shit anymore. I am not this. I am a Dragon. I'm outta here!! I'm... Drogon! You're here! Take me! I'm a dragon! We're one! I can even feel your pain! I am the blood of the Dragon!!

Show:

Jorah: Khaleesi, I'm rescuing you from the evilness and the mess you create yourself for not reason than creatively making sense because someone wanted to happen! Take my hand despite is infected with something that might kill you in the next months because I love you!

Dany: Oh, Jorah! I'm so needed of guidance than I'm ok with leaving with you despite you betrayed me and sold me to the Usurper... I forgive you because you brought me my new Dwarf Saviour. Also, you represent everything D&D wanted to happen to them in their teenage years!!

I shudder to think what they'll do now for Dany's Hand. What is Tyrion (who was in the city for all of five minutes) going to take the role from dead Barristan? And then he'll rule the city better then Dany ever could?

Dumb and Dumber does not care for logic or continuity but since people have caught on to this inconsistency, the fools may bring up the Targ immunity to disease next season.

I considred that grayscale might be a stand in for the pale mare but it's looks to me like it's just that, like always , it's another case of nobody knows what the f is happening.