Stannis broatheon Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 So the answer is sitting around and waiting for Robert to die to start a war?? Yes, he would risk his life if he remained at KL. But Robert was his King, his liege lord. Stannis is supposed to risk his life, even give his life to save Robert's. He is sworn to do so. He instead sat back and waited for Robert to die. Do you realize that the incest benefited him the most? He eould become THE HEIR TO THE 7 KINGDOMS, no one would believe him that is why he contacted with Jon Arryn. He was proyecting his brother until the person he loved the most told him the truth.His plan was reasonable. It dailed because Jon Arryn did not want to tell Robert and LF chose to pison Jon Arryn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Eric Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 So the answer is sitting around and waiting for Robert to die to start a war?? Yes, he would risk his life if he remained at KL. But Robert was his King, his liege lord. Stannis is supposed to risk his life, even give his life to save Robert's. He is sworn to do so. He instead sat back and waited for Robert to die. The answer certainly wasn't to blurt out everything with no proof. Besides, did Stannis even know of the danger Robert was in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Do you realise that Cersei's plan to kill Robert worked because plot wanted her to be lucky, right? Cersei couldn't just poison him because killing the King right there would point every finger at her. That's why she needed it to be an accident. It was not the first time she tried to kill Robert though, she had planned for him to die in the melee mid AGoT as well. Robert was not in danger. He died because he was an irresponsible idiot. Stannis was in more danger than Robert had he had stayed in KL. Go and tell Robert the true would mean him being arrested, probably killed, and the truth had died there. The truth would not have died, Robert would have had the idea instilled in his head, and one slip from Jaime and Cersei, and they're done. Also, Robert's life >>>> Stannis' life in the eyes of duty. Honestly, I don't get why people believe Stannis should be so idiot to go and pretty much offer the Lannisters his own neck. He had no proof of what he said, that's why he allied with Arryn and Arryn died. He was next. If they killed the man Robert loved as a father, and then they killed the man he loved as a brother, why wouldn't they got killed the guy who was indeed his brother but he never cared for? :dunno: Because it's his duty. As I said, staying silent was the sensible thing to do, but it's also treason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Why don't you tell us? You seem to be quite an expert on things not in the book. Fanfiction seems to be your thing. The same thing she tells him all along the series, "You are Azor Ahai" and "You will be King". No. He had no other choice but to do it or he would have died. The fact that he said nothing to Robert all that while even when he had the book says it all. If Jon Arryyn, a father figure to Robert was hesitant to bring it up then Stannis was 100% right in his cautius approach. Yet, when it looks like the Lannisters are willing to kill to keep the secret, it becomes Stannis's duty to tell Robert before something grave happens. He doesn't, it's treason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barty Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 The answer certainly wasn't to blurt out everything with no proof. Besides, did Stannis even know of the danger Robert was in? I'm not saying he should blurt out everything. He wants to save his hide - fine. Run away to DragonStone. But he was definitely in a position to help Ned Stark. He didn't even have to go personally to KL. Send Davos to Ned instead. Ned was honorable and hated the Lannisters - also he was powerful and influential with the King. Something - do something I dint really care what it is but do something to save your brother from that snake. Don't just run away and give up after one setback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis broatheon Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 The same thing she tells him all along the series, "You are Azor Ahai" and "You will be King". Yet, when it looks like the Lannisters are willing to kill to keep the secret, it becomes Stannis's duty to tell Robert before something grave happens. He doesn't, it's treason. Again how do you explain that in Mel's PoV we dont learn about your fanfiction baseless theory? Sorry but it is delusional to not gather some evidence before he tells his brother about his suspicions. Stannis is not as naive as Ned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Are you really saying you need proof that Melisandre was with Stannis and that he never told Robert? Melisandre arrived at Dragonstone after Stannis fled King's Landing. Actually, she might have arrived before he fled but she went to Dragonstone while Stannis was still in KL and made Selyse a convert first. Selyse then worked on Stannis until he has enough interest in the Red God to listen to Melisandre. It's been explained a thousand times why Stannis did not tell Robert. If you want to ignore everything in text and make up your own bullshit then fair. I can't argue with your twisted sense of logic. But to people who can read and comprehend what's in the books, it's quite obvious that Stannis telling Jon Arryn is a blatant sign that treason was not on his mind. It may have been explained but Barty is right: it is a poor excuse, especially from a man who claims to be about justice, law and duty. He is the first to remind men of their duty to him, even if it means death. In fact, he tells Davos many times, many will die as he pursues his plans. Demanding that others are willing to die for you while you are not willing to risk your own life for your brother and your king is hypocritical. Also, many of you are saying that he should not have told Robert because he is next in line but that is not a reason to do your duty. Finally, everyone knows that Robert is not "mad" for Cersei. I think people, especially Stannis, underestimate how receptive Robert would have been to learning that Cersei had betrayed him and committed treason. Robert was not in danger. He died because he was an irresponsible idiot. Stannis was in more danger than Robert had he had stayed in KL. Actually Robert was in the greatest danger since Cersei had been trying to create an accidental death for him for a while. Stannis and Renly were also in danger because they were the true heirs and the only ones who could create problems for the Lannister children. We have this straight from the text. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis broatheon Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 I'm not saying he should blurt out everything. He wants to save his hide - fine. Run away to DragonStone. But he was definitely in a position to help Ned Stark. He didn't even have to go personally to KL. Send Davos to Ned instead. Ned was honorable and hated the Lannisters - also he was powerful and influential with the King. Something - do something I dint really care what it is but do something to save your brother from that snake. Don't just run away and give up after one setbackStannis barely knows Ned, and cant read his PoV chapters, like tou can. He barely knows the guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Again how do you explain that in Mel's PoV we dont learn about your fanfiction baseless theory? Sorry but it is delusional to not gather some evidence before he tells his brother about his suspicions. Stannis is not as naive as Ned. Because her PoV doesn't go back to her first time on Dragonstone? And if he thinks his brother's life is in danger, not telling him and fleeing (putting him in even more danger), is treason. I agree it probably wouldn't have worked, but the alternative is treason, pure and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 There is a saying: "before you save others, you first save yourself". Honestly, the whole idea of Stannis risking his life to tell Robert a truth he was likely not going to believe or he would ignore in order to avoid conflict with the Lannisters, is idiotic. Maybe waiting too much in Dragonstone was a mistake. Maybe he should have sent people to Ned. But again, why would he trust Ned Stark in first place? He did the right thing: secure himself and his family (because, let's not forget he has a wife and child that his actions could also put in danger) before acting. Cersei acted faster but that wasn't his fault. He cannot read minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Pounce FTW Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 The answer certainly wasn't to blurt out everything with no proof. There was the same proof that convinced Jon, Stannis and Ned. It would have been enough for Robert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Stannis barely knows Ned, and cant read his PoV chapters, like tou can. He barely knows the guy. Eddard is know by pretty much all the nobility to be honourable, to be like a brother to Robert, and to dislike the Lannisters. Saying "Stannis is not a mind-reader!" is no excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Actually Robert was in the greatest danger since Cersei had been trying to create an accidental death for him for a while. Stannis and Renly were also in danger because they were the true heirs and the only ones who could create problems for the Lannister children. We have this straight from the text. Stannis couldn't know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis broatheon Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Because her PoV doesn't go back to her first time on Dragonstone? And if he thinks his brother's life is in danger, not telling him and fleeing (putting him in even more danger), is treason. I agree it probably wouldn't have worked, but the alternative is treason, pure and simple. Stannis is not an idiot. Ned would have done what you say, Stannis wouldn't. Sorry but having Mel's Pov is enough evidence to disprove your ridiculous theory about Stannis expecting his brother to die Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 There is a saying: "before you save others, you first save yourself". Honestly, the whole idea of Stannis risking his life to tell Robert a truth he was likely not going to believe or he would ignore in order to avoid conflict with the Lannisters, is idiotic. Saving yourself is the smart thing to do, yes, but it is not the dutiful one. Stannis claims to be all about duty, yet, when his life is on the line, he commits treason and flees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Eric Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Eddard is know by pretty much all the nobility to be honourable, to be like a brother to Robert, and to dislike the Lannisters. Saying "Stannis is not a mind-reader!" is no excuse. So., honourable that he fathered a bastard eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis broatheon Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Again STANNIS CANT READ NED'S OR ROBERT'S MIND. He can not predict or trust some people like the readers would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 Stannis couldn't know this. Of course he could, it's obvious that if Stannis flees with the truth, the truth could come out at any time, and that Robert dying as soon as possible is the only way to reinforce their grasp on the Throne. Stannis is not an idiot. Ned would have done what you say, Stannis wouldn't. Sorry but having Mel's Pov is enough evidence to disprove your ridiculous theory about Stannis expecting his brother to die Yeah, he's not an idiot, he chose treason over death. Mel's PoV doesn't disprove anything, she won't think back to all her moments with Stannis over five books in the course of a single chapter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Eric Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 I'm not saying he should blurt out everything. He wants to save his hide - fine. Run away to DragonStone. But he was definitely in a position to help Ned Stark. He didn't even have to go personally to KL. Send Davos to Ned instead. Ned was honorable and hated the Lannisters - also he was powerful and influential with the King. Something - do something I dint really care what it is but do something to save your brother from that snake. Don't just run away and give up after one setback Stannis doesn't know Ned. There's absolutely no reason for him to trust Ned right on the spot not when his daughter was betrothed to Joffrey. Stannis has to consider all these things. Second, Stannis does not know the immediate danger Robert is in. He also does not know about Littlefinger's meddling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Eric Posted August 14, 2015 Share Posted August 14, 2015 There was the same proof that convinced Jon, Stannis and Ned. It would have been enough for Robert. Not really. Stannis never had the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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