Comics XII: All New, All Twelve

[red snow]

2 hours ago, Bastard of Boston said:

I feel like Landis gets a lot of shit -- I have no real basis for this, other than I feel this to be true -- and I have no real experience with him, myself, other than I know he co-wrote Chronicle and wasn't crazy about Rey from Force Awakens, but he is hitting all the right spots with this series. First of all, the art has been amazing, and I like how they're using a different artist for each vignette of Clark's life. Other than that, it's a great contemporary take on the character. The standout issue was #4. Landis writes a really great Lex.

I think he upset folk when he went on an anti-superhero rant once. It was a bit troll-like of him because it's clear he actually loves the medium. He's probably a bit like us with our bitching but in a position to do something/distance himself about mainstream superhero comics. His work on Chronicle shows he knows how to tackle the medium so hopefully doing DC projects is helping him calm down because pissing off a fanbase that would benefit from him would be a tragic cock-up.

2 hours ago, mormont said:

We know that already: relaunches. Renumbering from #1, line-wide reboots (combined with events for that double-punch), and so on.

Trouble is, like events, relaunches provide a reliable bump but no sustainable growth.

It's painful to watch in many ways. At least Image seems to be doing well but as much as I love those books it's a shame Marvel/DC aren't around for folk in the same way. We're all probably partly to blame for making them grow up with us rather than letting it be a genre that always appealed to a young demographic (not that we can't enjoy books aimed at young people but it's clear most books are aimed at older audiences even if we're just talking continuity)

[GallowKnight]

On 2016-03-18 at 7:01 PM, red snow said:

Fortunately the lack of film may delay it a little longer. there are strong odds on another infinity wars in the next 3 years though.

Unless in AvsX2 all the X-Men gets wiped out and replaced with suspiciously similar Inhuman counterparts. Except for Beast of course.

Have they stopped trying to make the Inhuman's a thing yet?

[Winterfell is Burning]

On 17/03/2016 at 4:43 PM, red snow said:

Except for the X-men who apparently don't care. At least they are getting their own cash-in event with the apocalypse storyline.

One- maybe the only- good thing Marvel is doing now is that this crossover is more like Fall of the Mutants in which is a thematic crossover, and they're each dealing with Apocalypse related stuff, but no connection between the storylines.

[red snow]

On 20/03/2016 at 0:08 PM, The_Gallows_Knight said:

Unless in AvsX2 all the X-Men gets wiped out and replaced with suspiciously similar Inhuman counterparts. Except for Beast of course.

Have they stopped trying to make the Inhuman's a thing yet?

They are still trying very hard but I think they are realising there's a lot of resistance to it.

10 hours ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

One- maybe the only- good thing Marvel is doing now is that this crossover is more like Fall of the Mutants in which is a thematic crossover, and they're each dealing with Apocalypse related stuff, but no connection between the storylines.

I prefer this approach. I think Marvel used to do it with mini-series related to the event back in the Civil War and House of M days. But again, being fair to Marvel, they probably noticed that these never sold anywhere near as well as when the main titles tie in (interesting if main title + spin off sales is generally greater than the spike in main title tieing in).

One thing I did approve of was when they started multishipping titles and doing away with vestigial titles. Spider-man is best example of this and it was something that worked in terms of sales and fans. Well, I guess if too many titles are multishipping it becomes a cost issue (but 18 issues a year is still better than 24 with a second tier spin off)

[Little Valkyrie]

11 hours ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

One- maybe the only- good thing Marvel is doing now is that this crossover is more like Fall of the Mutants in which is a thematic crossover, and they're each dealing with Apocalypse related stuff, but no connection between the storylines.

It's not a bad way to handle the mini-event/short crossover.  There's one going on with the Avengers books right now that can kind of be read independently (and it's good!  shock and amazement, it's good) and the Spider-Women books will have one that looks more conventionally "buy all these books, they need the sales bump really badly".  But pretty much everything is getting press-ganged into Civil War 2 as well.  Part of me is kind of excited to see how all the relatively new to comics fans react to getting their first full-blown character assassination/book plot derail Event under their belts.  This makes me a bad person.  I can deal with that.

[red snow]

On 21/03/2016 at 2:42 PM, Little Valkyrie said:

It's not a bad way to handle the mini-event/short crossover.  There's one going on with the Avengers books right now that can kind of be read independently (and it's good!  shock and amazement, it's good) and the Spider-Women books will have one that looks more conventionally "buy all these books, they need the sales bump really badly".  But pretty much everything is getting press-ganged into Civil War 2 as well.  Part of me is kind of excited to see how all the relatively new to comics fans react to getting their first full-blown character assassination/book plot derail Event under their belts.  This makes me a bad person.  I can deal with that.

It's promising that they are at least experimenting with different formats and seeing which ones do best in sales (or generating sales).

In terms of making the most of the film for getting new readers I have to hope Civil War 2 is aimed at existing readers and not just a cash grab off new ones. I really think they should have just had lots of film cover prints of Civil war 1 (for the characters in the comic at least or some Alex Ross painted versions of the MCU counterparts) and sell them. Put some ads in the back for some other accessible trades and hope the comic stores have the sense to help new readers check in on new titles.

I have trouble following big crossovers these days and the result is that I usually just give up. I skipped "infinity war" and went back to monthly installments of New/Avengers and suspect I'll give up again when I hit "secret war/battleworld". I've just got stuck with spidey since spiderverse - although I have read the first two issues of Miles Morales Spidey and like how it's connected to the MU without making me read all the spidey/avengers books (credit to Bendis where it's due).

If I find it hard, I seriously wonder how a new reader will respond to there being dozens of "Civil War" books. None of which seem to feature versions of the characters they know from the films.

I also had a look around my local shop to see what DC is doing for BvS. There's either a comic adaptation of the film out or a misleading cover from the film posters on a comic. It was bagged so I couldn't tell. The store itself wisely has a lot of Batman and Superman trades centre-stage with some good prices too. I guess DC have been printing more of some of these trades to help.

Deadpool probably works best as an entry book in that his stories are fairly irreverant and not continuity heavy so a reader probably can pick up any of his trades and be relatively safe.

[red snow]

some interesting speculation about Jonathan Hickman doing some work for DC. I think that could be an interesting proposition. Many seem to think it could be legion of superheroes (he apparently loves the title) which may suit him in the sense it's not directly connected to current DC timelines and lets him have free reign. For some reason I'd still love to see him on Superman as I think he'd have a really different take on Superman as an alien and the science of metropolis. I'd certainly check out anything he has a go at over in DC land.

I wonder what Snyder and Capullo are doing next? I noticed Capullo dropped the word Flashest in one interview so maybe they are going onto that book. Given the popularity of the show it may make sense to give the comic a high profile push. I'm sure Snyder has the "if i could only tell one Flash story, this would be it" ready to go

[Winterfell is Burning]

Hickman going to DC would be a killer move for them, and undoubtedly lead Marvel to kick themselves for not letting him take over the X-books (seemed the natural course after ending the Avengers run, and he did mentioned having some ideas that nobody there liked) because they were too busy trying to use the franchise as a prop for the Inhumans.

 

 

[red snow]

4 hours ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

Hickman going to DC would be a killer move for them, and undoubtedly lead Marvel to kick themselves for not letting him take over the X-books (seemed the natural course after ending the Avengers run, and he did mentioned having some ideas that nobody there liked) because they were too busy trying to use the franchise as a prop for the Inhumans.

 

 

Damn, that's a real loss if he was interested in doing X-men. I can just imagine how he'd handle Apocalypse and Sinister (although it may have been too similar to East of West). Plus he seemed to like playing with a large cast and the X-men probably have more than the Avengers. I guess that's another good fit of Legion of superheroes.

If I was DC I'd really try and headhunt some of Marvel's top guys. They've managed to get Tom Taylor (but he's only just taken off) but they should be trying to tempt the likes of Jason Aaron (who can turn his hand to anything). I wouldn't mind seeing Bendis do a DC book (not just because it would mean he wasn't writing a Marvel book). I don't think Fraction or Remender do anything outside creator owned these days but they'd have also been on the list. The guy who wrote "superior foes of Spiderman", Nick Spencer, could work well in the BAt universe.

At the moment DC feels a bit like the Geoff Johns and Scott Snyder show. Some of the other creators may be doing solid jobs but both houses work best when it feels like there's a strong voice on any given franchise. I think it's harder to do since Image took off as a lot of folk disappear as soon as they have a fanbase. Marvel's recent rebranding saw a lot of names disappear for example.

[Little Valkyrie]

On 3/25/2016 at 2:57 AM, red snow said:

Damn, that's a real loss if he was interested in doing X-men. I can just imagine how he'd handle Apocalypse and Sinister (although it may have been too similar to East of West). Plus he seemed to like playing with a large cast and the X-men probably have more than the Avengers. I guess that's another good fit of Legion of superheroes.

If I was DC I'd really try and headhunt some of Marvel's top guys. They've managed to get Tom Taylor (but he's only just taken off) but they should be trying to tempt the likes of Jason Aaron (who can turn his hand to anything). I wouldn't mind seeing Bendis do a DC book (not just because it would mean he wasn't writing a Marvel book). I don't think Fraction or Remender do anything outside creator owned these days but they'd have also been on the list. The guy who wrote "superior foes of Spiderman", Nick Spencer, could work well in the BAt universe.

At the moment DC feels a bit like the Geoff Johns and Scott Snyder show. Some of the other creators may be doing solid jobs but both houses work best when it feels like there's a strong voice on any given franchise. I think it's harder to do since Image took off as a lot of folk disappear as soon as they have a fanbase. Marvel's recent rebranding saw a lot of names disappear for example.

 

Bendis has a Marvel exclusive, and so does everyone who's writing a major Marvel book, like Aaron.  I find Aaron weirdly variable--his Thor started off pretty strong, but the way he dragged out the "Who is Thor?" mystery was downright incompetent because teasing took the place of character development.  And now it feels like he's doing basic-ass Feminism 101 and he could be doing so much more.

Tom Taylor completely ruined one of my favorite DC books, so I am happy to never see him and his Superman boner again.

Nick Spencer wrote for DC and had a deeply traumatic experience about which he is still clearly bitter, and is currently trying to explain on Twitter how DC double-shipping books at $2.99 is awful and exploitative, but Marvel double-shipping titles at $3.99 is subsidizing experimental books.

Remender clearly left Marvel unhappy, and is focusing on creator work.  Much the same with Fraction--I'd love to know what the hell happened with Inhumans.

If we got F4/FF Hickman instead of Avengers Hickman, he might do a good LOSH, but I'm afraid it would be endless Brainy pontificating while everyone else stood around.  Huge cast that you have to juggle very carefully.

[mormont]

Exciting news: our own Leigh Bardugo will be writing a YA Wonder Woman comic!

http://io9.gizmodo.com/dcs-comic-book-heroes-are-getting-the-young-adult-novel-1768224046

[Little Valkyrie]

YA Novels, not comics...

[red snow]

On 28/03/2016 at 4:33 AM, Little Valkyrie said:

 

Bendis has a Marvel exclusive, and so does everyone who's writing a major Marvel book, like Aaron.  I find Aaron weirdly variable--his Thor started off pretty strong, but the way he dragged out the "Who is Thor?" mystery was downright incompetent because teasing took the place of character development.  And now it feels like he's doing basic-ass Feminism 101 and he could be doing so much more.

Tom Taylor completely ruined one of my favorite DC books, so I am happy to never see him and his Superman boner again.

Nick Spencer wrote for DC and had a deeply traumatic experience about which he is still clearly bitter, and is currently trying to explain on Twitter how DC double-shipping books at $2.99 is awful and exploitative, but Marvel double-shipping titles at $3.99 is subsidizing experimental books.

Remender clearly left Marvel unhappy, and is focusing on creator work.  Much the same with Fraction--I'd love to know what the hell happened with Inhumans.

If we got F4/FF Hickman instead of Avengers Hickman, he might do a good LOSH, but I'm afraid it would be endless Brainy pontificating while everyone else stood around.  Huge cast that you have to juggle very carefully.

Sorry, I meant Tom King! Can see why you'd be confused by the Tom Taylor comment.

I'm not sure if Remender left unhappy, more that he realised he could make a living doing creator-owned. That said his most recent Black Science felt a bit like the main character being a stand in for his own thoughts with complaints about working for the man. Still, I think it's more a case of people liking to be their own boss if they can be. I think that's the case with a lot of the Marvel writers moving over to Image. It certainly doesn't seem like the situation DC had with the new52 and writers jumping ship.

I've got to mid way through time runs out on the Avengers books. I think New Avengers has actually been really good - especially with Namor calling the others out on their weak-ass BS morals. I guess they could never let the rest of the illuminati destroy worlds because of franchises but it's cool that Namor has been allowed to go that way. The main avengers book isn't as good and while a knee-jerk interpretation is because the cast is bigger I don't think it is that. The time-travel arc had an increasingly smaller cast - I just think it took far too long to get to the point it was trying to make while at the same time never fleshing out the time-periods they were in. Essentially it was a 6 part story with the depth of a well paced 48 page story. At 6 issues I'm wanting the different times to be explored more.

The latest saga was ok. Probably suffers from high expectations but I don't feel like much happened besides prince robot getting some great lines.

On 01/04/2016 at 10:03 AM, mormont said:

Exciting news: our own Leigh Bardugo will be writing a YA Wonder Woman comic!

http://io9.gizmodo.com/dcs-comic-book-heroes-are-getting-the-young-adult-novel-1768224046

That's cool. I'm never sure where comic book novels fit - although I do recall reading some when younger. In my case it was a good lure for me to the actual comics but I guess the reverse idea can apply too. I still need to get round to reading her Grisha books - I've had an ecopy of the first one lying around for a while.

[Little Valkyrie]

I am fairly sure that Remender left unhappy because he was redeveloping the post-Secret Wars X-Line, and it ALL got junked.  And he was also clearly having to write around a lot of editorial mandates, like spending time on retconning Pietro and Wanda out of being Magneto's kids.  The very last page of his SW tie-in ends with the chapter title FUTILITY in all-caps; the Uncanny Avengers Annual he did featuring Mojo was also a hilarious skewering of the current state of Marvel as it was.

I have too many mean feelings about Hickmanvengers to be contained here.

I think they're just YA novels featuring comics characters.  Been done before--there was a recent Lois Lane one or two--but I know thanks to sources that this is a serious push that's largely being handled by Random House, who know how to read a YA book market.

[red snow]

6 hours ago, Little Valkyrie said:

I am fairly sure that Remender left unhappy because he was redeveloping the post-Secret Wars X-Line, and it ALL got junked.  And he was also clearly having to write around a lot of editorial mandates, like spending time on retconning Pietro and Wanda out of being Magneto's kids.  The very last page of his SW tie-in ends with the chapter title FUTILITY in all-caps; the Uncanny Avengers Annual he did featuring Mojo was also a hilarious skewering of the current state of Marvel as it was.

 

If the bleeding cool rumours were to be believed it's a good thing the X-men ideas were junked - unless the "living on another planet" was an editorial idea. Those last comics seem worth a read just to witness how poor editoial is at marvel/dc.

End of the day, the fact Remender (or a lot of the other Image jumpers) haven't publicly stated an issue suggests they all, deep-down understand how writing a marvel/DC book automatically means your work is driven by higher editorial. Bendis seems to cast a spell over Marvel unless he just rolls with the punches - I get the impression he knows they won't actively undo his work while he's still there. That and I suspect he knows the world he's working in and that his runs on books stand irrespective of whether the next team undoes that. It's probably why he's cool on changing the staus quo on the books he writes.

Regarding Remender, I think he's at his best when working on a one title idea - putting him in charge of the X-men may never have worked (calls into question how Hickman may have also been head writer of those books too). With Image he gets to have several books that are distinct and don't have to tie in. That said I still eagerly await the Black Science crossover that ties all the books together (surely that has to happen?).

I'm still marvelling at my own brand alliance when I realise I've yet to pick up Remender's "devolution" series just because it isn't Image. I can't help but think it's a "b" story because it wasn't an Image project. A bit like how I've yet to read a Morrison comic outside DC that I really like (although I still only checked his Image books and not the Boom/other indy publishers he chose). Probably credit to Image for making me see their brand as "where the best writers work" even if that rule most likely applies to established comic writers. I still tend to check out the non Marvel/DC writers wherever as long as reviews create a buzz.

[red snow]

Is it just me or is the chat symbol here a lantern corps sigil?

 

[Nictarion]

The 10th Anniversary Criminal one-shot was solid. Always down for a Tracy Lawless story. Made me want more though. 

Tokyo Ghost #6 was good too. I can't decide which one of Remender's Image books is my favorite right now. I'm really into all 4 of them.

 

[GallowKnight]

I got my hands on the collected version of John Ostrander's first Deadshot mini-series from 1988. I've never actually read it before and it is great. Since it's Ostrander writing a Suicide Squad member the writing is high quality and the artwork and coloring is fantastic.

[Little Valkyrie]

On 4/22/2016 at 5:06 PM, The_Gallows_Knight said:

I got my hands on the collected version of John Ostrander's first Deadshot mini-series from 1988. I've never actually read it before and it is great. Since it's Ostrander writing a Suicide Squad member the writing is high quality and the artwork and coloring is fantastic.

Orlando Furioso, heh.

 

Eagerly awaiting the eventual product of the Ostrander/Mandrake Kickstarter I backed...

[red snow]

On 21/04/2016 at 3:00 PM, Nictarion said:

The 10th Anniversary Criminal one-shot was solid. Always down for a Tracy Lawless story. Made me want more though. 

Tokyo Ghost #6 was good too. I can't decide which one of Remender's Image books is my favorite right now. I'm really into all 4 of them.

 

Remender is doing a great job over at Image. I'm torn between my favourite as the art's some of the best in US comics at the moment across the board. It's probably a toss-up between Low and Tokyo Ghost for me as they are similar in approach and attitude (decadent fuure societies) and I feel they could almost be in the same universe/timeline. Black Science is just frenetic fun and I need to read more deadly class as I haven't got past the first trade yet.

 

I read the Spider-verse collection over the weekend. The collection is an absolute bargain in terms of pages per dollar. The event feels like a kid playing with all his spidey action figures and Slott somehow makes it work as a comic. The collection is let down by the really weird decision to print the collection out of order. They simply clump each miniseries together at the end eg we get Spider-woman 1-4, then Scarlet Spiders 1-3 even their story intermingles with Amazing Spider-man printed up front. It's a really odd decision on the editorial team's part. Maybe they were concerened people wouldn't like the jumping around but from a story point of view the minis are spoiled before you ever get to read them. Some of the tie-ins are a drop in qulity art and story wise so they maybe felt it was better to protect the main series? I've no idea probably a damned if you do, damned if you don't. I guess the event itself can be commended for being coherent within the main comic story and using the tie-ins to expand on some elements. Still highlights the inherent problems with event books though.